I'm with dbg: I've seen hundreds of cyclists trying to get around some 'zoned-out' guy who can't hear the passing cyclist's bell or horn and the only reason there wasn't an accident is due to the skill and patience of the passing cyclist. Cyclists who are listening to music on headphones are rarely even aware of the hazard they present or the extraordinary efforts others have to make to avoid them.

How can you be convinced when you can't hear?

Perhaps you'll be convinced when you're suddenly listening to 'Stairway to Heaven.'

BS


BS


WTF?


Too funny.


Anyone relying on their sense of hearing while biking is an accident waiting to happen. What are the safety nannies going to preach next? That we need to fully utilize our sense of smell too?

Hey, maybe there is a line of cyclists silently fuming behind me the entire ride home, but I don't think so. I operate vehicularly and there's a reason that the rules of the road do not require vehicle operators to respond to auditory information except for sirens.

I stay in my lane (even on the MUP), if I have to change lanes I make sure the lane I'm moving into is clear. If I'm in a setting that can comfortably and safely allow me to establish a right-most position that will allow others to pass at an appropriate distance, I do so.

You know who I have the most problem with? People who don't know how to ride their bikes and don't consider for a moment that the way in which they're riding is rude and potentially dangerous to others. It seems like half the time I pass some novice cyclist on the ol' MUP, dude will look left at me and start moving in my direction. Most of these folks aren't wearing earphones (though those who are make themselves doubly annoying).

I'm not angry with them because I understand that's the risk of a MUP and I'd rather see them out enjoying themselves than sitting on the couch, but it's still way more of a problem than in my experience than mean people riding with earphones.

Not everyone is cycling down the bunny trail to work.


The day a patient, skillful, or any other kind of cyclist has a problem passing me on my route will be the day I am elected Pope. In fact, I probably would get injured by the worldly appearance of such an apparition, as I will fall over in surprise to find one of these alleged skillful patient cyclists anywhere when and where I cycle to work.
Exactly.

I would hate to think about what a beer and pizza rest stop would do to their puritanical equilibrium.

I recommend that the safety nannies loosen their helmet straps, take a deep breath, and chill out. And don't preach safety static to music lovers.

Do any of you anti headphone people ride in the winter? If so, don't your ears get cold?

BTW, here are the headphones I use . They work nicely when places 1-2 inches below the ear, and possibly using a helmet strap to keep them secured.

25 mi Urban Commute on 5 lane very busy roads.

I wear a radio since my mp3 player broke. I find that the wind noise plus all the traffic stuff going on is just a mash of noise until someone gets really close anyway. I use my rearview mirror a lot and find it much more useful than my ears. I can't hear overtaking cyclists in all that noise anyway so that is a non-issue for me. As for legal or not, how many of you have a rear reflector in addition to your rear light? The law requires one in most states but I have never seen or heard of someone getting a ticket specifically for that when they had a blinkie on that back. I highly doubt that the headphone law is enforced much either. I mean you see inline skaters using headphones all the time, what is so different about a cyclist using them? Anyway, I find the music gives stimulus to my mind that helps me stay alert over long rides so I think that outweighs the negatives for me. I can still hear cars overtake me just as well as before as I don't blast the volume. I think this is just one of those common senses things. They can't tell how loud you have it turned up so they just outlaw it. Figures.

The problem with arguing....err...discussing...on the internet is it is too much like competing in the Special Olympics: you may win, but you're still ********.

Condescending remarks about sense of smell are just idiotic. Is that really the best you could come up with?

Anyone operating any vehicle on the road needs a sense of hearing: it's one of the two senses we employ to detect potential dangers and to deny that simply indicates you choose to be a reckless hazard. There are traffic laws in this country (yes, I'm Canadian too and yes, I ride in the winter, and yes, I wear a touque, but a touque doesn't blast music in my ears) that limit the noise a motor vehicle is allowed to emit (although it is, admittedly ,rarely, if ever, enforced) and that is to allow the vehicle operator the ability to hear sounds that may alert him/her to potential dangers. If you want to close-off one sense, why not close-off your sight too then, or is that as inane as your remark about sense of smell?

It has nothing to do with being a 'safety-nanny' as you regard it: you're operating a vehicle on the road and there are responsibilities that go with that privelege. It's not just you out there: accidents and injuries and fatalities affect a large number of people and putting yourself in a greater position to be in one is self-centered, inconsiderate and thoughtless. That's all I'm going to say about it.

It's illegal here in BC.

I just can't understand how someone can cut off a sense and manage to distract yourself at the same time and still think they are as safe as if they had the sense and no distraction.

I used to be a musician and have a keen sense of hearing and I feel the sound of traffic informs you of your place in it. Hearing is one of the advantages bikes have over cars to be safer on the road. It helps prevent collisions by being more aware of your surroundings.

Nice hyperbole, hundreds of headphone wearing cyclists holding up the world, and causing accidents. Funny how there are no statistics to back up this assumption that cyclists are more at risk or more distracted by listening to music. I think this whole "cyclists need to be able to hear every little f'ing thing" to operate safely perpetuates the myth that cycling is inherently dangerous and that cycling on the road is some sort of privilege bestowed upon us by motorists. Don't wear your headphones you have to listen for those big bad cars. Even when rocking out I am much more aware of what's happening in traffic than any motorist, and I can certainly hear sirens, a car horn, or a City Bus coming up on me. Why on earth I would need to hear a child's voice is a ridiculous question. Can you hear a child's voice with the windows rolled up and the Air cond. on? The better question is what is a child doing in the middle of a city arterial travelling at 20 mph? And if another cyclist needs to get around me there is no reason for him to say anything to me, accelerate around me like all of the motorists seem to be able to do without giving an auditory warning.

I don't think it is especially dangerous, but I don't listen on my commute. I find there is way too much background noise from traffic for me to really hear or enjoy the tunes. I've even considered putting some ear bud headphones inside some hearing protection ear muffs, but I doubt it would fit with a helmet.

When I ride offroad, I usually listen to my mini disc player, and it seems to keep me pushing myself harder than I would with no supporting soundtrack. You do have to keep your eyes well up the trail, especially in technical sections, or you can get surprised by an oncoming rider. I'm pretty sure I crash more frequently when listening to music, because I push my limits more. That's part of the fun offroad though.

This is flat-out wrong. Noise ordinances are designed to protect the people who are in the surrounding area from being bombarded by the noise from obnoxiously loud automobiles.

If it were for the benefit of the driver, the law would talk about noise within the cabin, not the noise emitted from the vehicle. 1000 watt car stereos would be illegal. No, it's not about the driver. Again, that's why traffic law is based on visual signalling.

And I ride in the winter. With headphones it's actually easy to keep your ears warm since you can get them in any size with any level of padding you like all the way up to fully enclosed DJ-style phones with big thick over-ear cups. Toasty! Me, I use earbuds and cover my ears for warmth as I otherwise would.

I was going to leave my last remarks as my last remarks regarding this issue until I read this post and felt compelled to respond.

Does there need to be statistics to prove that with the severe impairment or elimination of one of the two vital senses used in riding a bike, the rider is put at increased danger? Although, I haven't searched for it, I would even wager there probably is research that supports the obvious. I'm sure there are a number of studies that confirm common sense in this regard too.

A cyclist doesn't need to hear 'every little f'ing thing,' but he does need to hear when a car is approaching too close from behind or the sound of brakes as some idiot is coming out of an alley or the sound of a car sliding out of control on ice (guess you don't worry about that where you are). Those sounds are not always loud and you only need to not hear one of those warning sounds once.

If you don't think that we are inherently at more risk by sharing the road with 3+ tonne vehicles, you are deluding yourself. It's not a myth: it's fact and it's common sense. Motorists didn't give us the privelege of riding on the road, either: our governments, however, did by stating we are EQUAL to motor-vehicles and by enacting laws that compel motorists to observe that equality and another set of laws regulating how we operate our vehicles on public streets. Not everyone has that privelege or protection.

Why you need to hear a child's voice is anything but ridiculous: when they dart out from between cars on your right and you are looking back over your left shoulder for cars coming up, how do you expect to hear their startled yelp? There are countless scenarios where you need to hear them. Kids don't always observe obvious dangers. Neither do dogs and I think I'd like to hear one if it comes running up behind me determined to make my leg it's lunch.

And, finally, if a cyclist wants to pass you and you are weaving all over the bike lane or the narrow strip of lane we might have to ride in rather than keeping as far right as safely possible, he/she generally rings their bell to let you know their intention. Maybe that's not something you practice, but many others do. It's the decent and respectful thing to do, after all. And holding someone up needlessly is just inconsiderate.

But, if you, and others like you, want to be all about yourselves, I only hope when you do have that accident it affects no-one else: family, friends, co-workers, the other people involved and their family, friends and co-workers, emergency services personnel, etc.

That's really all I have to say. Thanks for reading.

Both ears, my traffic side ear is free to hear the wind. Perfectly legal.

doing an I-POD while riding a bicycle IS DANGEROUS !!!!!you can`t hear the cars too well.cars are bad enough without distractive music.

You guys must really travel slow. I can't hear cars without headphone due to traffic noise and just all around wind.

Do you have any satistics to prove this at 25mph?
Cause with a full head of hair, there's so much wind noise I can't hear anything around me.

so it's legal to have a ear piece in one ear? also, can you elaborate a little on how you determine exactly what's happening behind you? this is a skill i'd like. have you any formal jedi training?

Yes there needs to be studies, otherwise its just your opinion.

Brakes out of an alley, sliding on ice, approaching too close? These are all examples of negligent driving that have nothing to do with my ability to hear.

Right, equal rights and equal protection. I can listen to the radio in my car and I can listen to the radio on my bike. And actually you are more likely to die in your car than on your bike.

Why would I be looking over my left shoulder for any length of time. And what is this "startled yelp?" Are we in Wild Kingdom? If some kid darts out in traffic better they are hit by me, than the car that would be occupying my space if I wasn't taking the lane. This still doesn't answer the question of how a motorist would hear this, "startled yelp." And I think I would see a dog start its chasing run way before I heard it. We are hardwired to look for moving objects against a stationary background.

Again, why do you assume that a cyclist listening to music is weaving. Maybe you can't hold your line and hey too bad for you that your such a bad cyclist. But that is shown in your statement that you stay as far right as possible (get doored often?) It is not my responsibility to move right into the door zone, or closer to the curb for an overtaking cyclist. It is my responsibility to safely hold my line and for a passing cyclist/motorist to pass safely, there is no need for any other communication, let alone a bell. This is the same assumption a motorist makes when they toot their horn, an assumption that I am supposed to yield my position in the lane because they are overtaking me. This assumption is wrong.

And I hope you don't trip and hurt yourself getting off that soapbox, the next time you get doored, or the next time your sideswiped by a passing motorist because you can't hold your line.

1. city streets, bike lane, multipath
2. i don't think so. what do you do when you hear a car? besides i can still hear well, better than any driver.
3. i use the flat plastic strip ones that came with the walkman. they fit under the helmet.
4. books on tape. maybe you could argue this is safer but i don't care.

i thought that sense of smell crack was pretty funny, myself.

some people who use hearing to ride: www.teambat.org
they deserve there own thread though, they're pretty awesome.

i'm looking into an mp3 or something that can record lectures that i can listen to again. suggestions?

There is an 18mph crosswind today... The only thing I hear without earplugs is wind noise. If I wear ear plugs the wind noise is deadend and I can have a minimal chance of hearing traffic. If I wear a head set I can block out the wind, possibly hear the traffic and I can listen to some great tunes.

Good!

Don't forget to report back when you are ready to wager with real money; or better yet when you can cite that supporting research.

Common sense tells us that one's sense of hearing is important for safely navigating traffic. The problem is, common sense isn't reliable. It's common sense that tells people that it's safer to bike on the sidewalk or the left side of the street. It's common sense that tells people that cycling is inherently more dangerous than other forms of transportation.

It is this same common sense that seems to be the only thing used to support the argument against headphones. I have not seen a single scientific fact or statistic listed to the same effect. I encourage any headphone opponents to list them though.

Furthermore, most people telling us how unsafe headphones are probably don't even have personal experience with the issue. They have likely not worn headphones while riding. If they had for any length of time, I suspect their views on the subject would be different. It may be true that your ability to hear traffic is decreased, but the usefulness is highly dubious in the first place. Hearing the sound of traffic is probably a psychological comfort for these people. If there are 15 cars near you, can you really identify the position and speed of each one using sound? Getting any useful information from sound in moderate to heavy traffic is near impossible.

They wear ear muffs or headbands! I've even seen many full balaclavas. I put red hot chili peppers in my ears when it's cold and I'm set!

Maybe he was trying to be funny while making a valid point. Is your remark about Special Olympics intended to be a stong argument or an offensive joke? Unlike the poster that you are calling an idiot, you aren't funny and you aren't making a point, only name calling and insulting people with special needs. Who is the idiot?