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The Last Few Seconds Before You Got Hit?

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Old 10-11-14, 06:07 AM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by Papa Tom
or was it just a matter of being in the wrong place at the wrong time?
This.

There's just nothing you can do about a driver who, quite simply, makes a mistake. I was hit in broad daylight, wearing hi-viz, DiNotte headlight flashing.

Approaching an intersection where I had the green, two oncoming cars in the left-turn only lane. First car had plenty of time and turns. Second car pulled up into the intersection, stopped as you do for oncoming traffic, then apparently decided, "Why wait? It's just a bike, I can make it" and T-boned me in the intersection.

In the last moment, I had to decide if I wanted to hit the front quarter-panel and fly over the hood, or cut in front and get hit by the front bumper. I chose the latter.

The bumper contacted my left calf (imprinting "Pontiac" there backwards). It flipped me into a barrel roll. The pedals unclipped when my feet were at the top of the roll, I tucked, rolled on impact and landed in front of a bus. Fortunately, the bus was stopped and boarding passengers. Not thinking this at the time, (of course the bus was stopped--it had the red light) I screamed and scrambled up on the curb.

The bus driver, and several passengers phoned 911. The car driver stopped. His story changed ("He was going too fast" to "I didn't see him") but he still took his ticket anyway. Even had insurance. Insurance paid 100% with no questions asked.

I was out of work for a week with a bruised shoulder. (My job requires that I can lift book totes loaded to 50 pounds.) The only reason I didn't break a collarbone was because in that last moment, flying through the air I remembered to tuck and roll on impact. Didn't even have any road rash. Helmet was a goner though.

I was back on the bike--my second bike--as soon as I had the doc's A-OK five days later.

Last edited by tsl; 10-11-14 at 06:13 AM.
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Old 10-11-14, 06:34 AM
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Damn, @tsl, you are a heck of a quick-thinking athlete.

But I don't understand why you would choose the front bumper over momentary contact with the car. What told you that you would stand a better chance that way?
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Old 10-11-14, 08:02 AM
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My thought was 'why did I hear the honk before the brakes'. Wtf? Honk when you're stopped.
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Old 10-11-14, 08:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Walter S
Be very cautious about relying on eye contact. Making it and finding it are important ways to increase your safety. But just because somebody sees you does not mean they will drive safely!

I clearly remember, about 40 years ago I was going down a hill in downtown Atlanta and a woman pulled up to the road as she was exiting a parking lot and about to enter my lane from the right. We clearly made eye contact and I proceeded with confidence she would wait for me to pass in front of her. Then she pulled right out in front of me. I hit her car and luckily was launched over her hood and landed on the pavement and rolled, with minor injuries. The front end of the bike didn't do as well.

I think people quite commonly misjudge the speed of a bicycle, they pull out and get hit. Just like trains, just not as dangerous to the motorist.

Edit: my lesson that day - slow down anyway
That's a very good point. It certainly wont guarentee safety, but it helps add another layer.
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Old 10-11-14, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by noglider
Damn, @tsl, you are a heck of a quick-thinking athlete.

But I don't understand why you would choose the front bumper over momentary contact with the car. What told you that you would stand a better chance that way?
Two things:

Vectors: Remember computing vectors in high school math? (I can, and I'm pushing 60.) Or have you at least played billiards? In a collision between two moving bodies, body with the least energy (me at 190 pounds including the bike moving at 15-20 mph) will be propelled at an (easily computed) angle by the body with the greater energy (4200 pounds of Pontiac moving at 10-15 mph). Plus, by steering to my right around the front of the car, I would already have started to move in the same direction of the car, reducing total impact.

If I hit the side of the car, all of my energy would have been converted into impact and injury. Choosing the front of the car, some of my energy would keep me moving away from the car, plus some of the car's energy would be imparted to me, also pushing me away from the car.

What I didn't clearly state in the post above is that this was on a four-lane. If we count from the bus, 1, 2, 3, to 4 at the other curb, I was hit in lane three. I continued moving forward as I barrel-rolled though the air, and landed in lane 1 in front of the bus, well away from the car and out of further danger from it. I was also vectored to the right by about 20 feet.

Impact, injury, and chance: There was a 100% guaranteed chance that if I chose running head-on into the car's front wheel, I'd end up flying across the hood, perhaps getting ripped open by the radio antenna or windshield wipers, and/or smashing through the windshield. Then If I did go through the windshield, being carried down the street until the driver slammed on the brakes, ejecting me back across the hood and into the street, or (if I was lucky and didn't stuck get in the windshield) falling off the other side of the car into the street. 100% chance of major injury.

The alternatives were a possibility that the driver would realize his mistake and stop, or failing that, I'd bounce off the front (vectors, remember) and have to deal only with injury from falling into the street. 50-50 chance of minor injury.

I went with the 50-50 chance of complete escape or minor injury. I got the minor injury.

Had the car been further ahead into the turn, BTW, I'd have tried to steer around the back. Such was not the case.

And it's not all quick thinking. I pay attention to every collision report here and on other forums, even if I don't comment. Over time, I've built a list of "What would I do in this scenario?" and filed the answers away. It was simply remembering, "Left cross, not enough room to brake, won't make it behind, might make it in front" and executing.

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Old 10-11-14, 01:38 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by Walter S
Be very cautious about relying on eye contact. Making it and finding it are important ways to increase your safety. But just because somebody sees you does not mean they will drive safely!
Good point. Aside from cases of the driver seeing the cyclist and misjudging speed, there's another potential problem. Just because you see the driver's eyes and they appear to be looking at you does not mean they see you. I think it is important to remember that the human brain filters out lots of stuff it receives from the optic nerve. When drivers are looking for other motorized vehicles they may not register the little cyclist because it's not necessarily what they are looking for. They can look right at you, not see you and pull out as if you weren't there.
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Old 10-11-14, 01:50 PM
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I'm still impressed, even understanding your explanation. Even more impressed now.
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Old 10-11-14, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by noglider
I'm still impressed, even understanding your explanation. Even more impressed now.
Yeah, well, let's hope it works out as well the next time...
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Old 10-12-14, 05:43 AM
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I almost got hit this summer. Picture a dust road with very loose sand on it. I was cycling with my brother, trying to rush the last km home. I know that road by heart, I must have done it thousands of times. Yet, on a 90º curve with trees on both sides which prevent you from seeing what goes on at the other side, me, like an idiot, kept riding on the left side, chatting with my brother about whatever nonsense we came up with when boom, a car appears on the other side. My brother veers out of the road and I panic and yank the brakes. Rear wheel skids on sand and I bit the dust on my knee and elbow. The car stopped roughly 40 cm before he hit me. My thought on those two or three seconds, which felt like years, was something like "well, this is it, apparently". I had to stay seated for a few minutes because my legs were shaking so much . It's left me just a couple of scars in my elbow and a cool bar story

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Old 10-12-14, 06:31 AM
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Originally Posted by tsl
Yeah, well, let's hope it works out as well the next time...
There may not be a next time. Your odds are good, though of course there's no reason to be complacent. It's not like lightning hitting the same place twice. As skill increases, so does safety.
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Old 10-12-14, 06:33 AM
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@pedalsimotxilla, loose sand has caused me more accidents than anything. It terrifies me.
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Old 10-12-14, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by mgw4jc
But how can a rear view mirror help you prevent an accident? Honestly asking here, not being snarky. I don't see how a mirror would help discern between the vehicle that doesn't see you and the one that is about to go around you. You can't see which way the driver is looking with a mirror.

I don't use any mirrors, but I am aware of vehicles behind me by sound and/or headlights. I guess I prefer to concentrate on holding a safe line as far right as possible instead of checking a mirror for something I can't do anything about.
Two things always stressed in commercial driver training are "get the big picture", and "leave yourself an out". Whats behind you is 50% of your riding environment, being aware of whats behind you gives you more options to deal with whats in front, and besides you.

personally I find hearing to be my most limited sense when riding at anything above a walking pace due to the wind, and the noise traffic makes.
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Old 10-12-14, 11:14 AM
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From the OP:

Thanks for all the responses, everyone. I was unaware of how many of you have actually been involved in crashes.

What I guess I was looking for is as an inside scoop as to what was going on in your head before the crash, rather than the circumstances of the crash. Were you distracted? Daydreaming? Pre-occupied with a mechanical issue?

In another of my recent threadstarters, I explored my own thoughts and actions while driving a car down the same route that I ride to work, and I was alarmed to discover that I'm not always as alert as I expect drivers to be when I am on a bicycle. This is why I've become so hyper-sensitive to what's going through my mind when I'm in the bike lane. I see now that regardless of how super-careful I am when I'm riding a bike, people in their cars can make bad things happen just by losing focus or by slipping on the steering wheel for a split second.

That said, would those who have already commented care to describe their mental state immediately before the crash in no more than 4 or 5 words?
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Old 10-12-14, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Papa Tom
What I guess I was looking for is as an inside scoop as to what was going on in your head before the crash, rather than the circumstances of the crash. Were you distracted? Daydreaming? Pre-occupied with a mechanical issue?
Focused on the road, the traffic, and the conditions. I can tell you in precise detail everything about the mile leading up the collision.

I ride with an intense focus on these things. Counter-intuitively, it's actually part of what relaxes me on the bike. I focus so intently on the task at hand that stress, thoughts about problems, home, work, whatever have no maneuvering room in my head, and fall out of my ears along the road somewhere. It's why I feel so refreshed on arrival at my destination.
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Old 10-12-14, 02:52 PM
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I had a pretty severe accident back in April of 1982. I was 21 years old. I was riding to work in the morning. I decided to take a slightly alternate route, and I turned left. An oncoming car hit me head-on. I don't remember the impact, and I don't remember the ambulance ride. In fact, I don't remember what I was thinking, other than, "Hmm, I think I'll go this way for a change." I woke up on my back on a stretcher with a doctor standing over me. He told me he had witnessed the impact. I flew in the air and landed far from the impact. The driver got out of her car, put her hands on her head, and just shrieked and wasn't useful in any way.

As luck had it, I was bruised and very slightly cut, but otherwise fine. I was in a lot of pain, but having just cheated death, I was compulsively making jokes and was in a totally giddy mood.

It was four weeks until I got back on a bike again, because walking was difficult. But I feel I was lucky overall.

Given that I was crossing oncoming traffic, it's likely the accident was my fault, but I don't know anything. Maybe the car driver crossed over to the wrong side and it was therefore her fault. There was a horrible runaround from insurance. The driver was not the car owner, and the car owner had not paid his premium. The insurance company refused to pay. Everything was very shady, and I wasn't skilled at defending my rights, so I didn't learn anything. I don't even know if there was a police report.

Being 1982, bike helmets were rare, and I was a rare cyclist to wear one. Lucky thing. People thought I was silly to wear a helmet until then.
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Old 10-12-14, 07:47 PM
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Papa Tom, having commuted on Long Island for five years or so in the early 80s, I tip my hat to you. I had a lot of near misses caused by inattentive drivers (and there weren't cell phones then!)--the only collision was an oncoming car that made a left turn into me with no signal and no warning. I was on the brakes early, and she was on them late, so it ended up being more of a love tap, although I might have hit her hood with my fists a little harder than the physics of the incident would otherwise have dictated. All I remember thinking was "Oh, no!". Maybe the second word was twice that long.

I will also say that New York drivers in general, and Long Island drivers in particular, were extremely aggressive, as if they were keeping score on how many cars they passed and lights they made. In some ways, this may help make them more predictable (just assume they're going to do the worst case, most outrageous action possible. Every. single. time.) I hope things have improved over the past 30 years.

Good luck to you, sir.
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Old 10-12-14, 08:23 PM
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@FanaticMN, they haven't gotten much better. Maybe a little. As I'm sure @Papa Tom knows, a Suffolk county executive made some really stupid remark about how bikes don't belong on the road, in response to a request to improve conditions.
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Old 10-14-14, 03:09 PM
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I was distracted for just a second and going to fast. I was a realatively new cyclist at the time and my bike was riding well. The advice I got from a friend was to slow down in town, espically our town which is known for hitting cyclists. It's sound advice and have since avoided two other potential accidents.

what was going through my haed just before I hit the car, Oh SH$T......

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Old 10-14-14, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Papa Tom
From the OP:

Thanks for all the responses, everyone. I was unaware of how many of you have actually been involved in crashes.

What I guess I was looking for is as an inside scoop as to what was going on in your head before the crash, rather than the circumstances of the crash. Were you distracted? Daydreaming? Pre-occupied with a mechanical issue? …

That said, would those who have already commented care to describe their mental state immediately before the crash in no more than 4 or 5 words?

Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
I was riding at about 9 PM on a wide, well-lit, low volume residential suburban street with no parked cars, wearing two rear view blinkies, and right and left rear view mirrors when I got hit from behind. It was so serene that I don’t remember what I was thnking….
Having fulfilled your request, I’d like to comment on this preceding post:

Originally Posted by kickstart
Two things always stressed in commercial driver training are "get the big picture", and "leave yourself an out". Whats behind you is 50% of your riding environment, being aware of whats behind you gives you more options to deal with whats in front, and besides you...
In my High School Driver’s Ed class, the admonition that I remember well, was “You don’t own the Right of Way until the other driver yields it to you.” For that reason, I always look left and right even when passing through an intersection where I have the green light (driving and cycling), and never asssume I can immediately go when in the vicinity of a vehicle. Advice I learned from BF is that you can only trust the direction that the front wheels of the vehicle are pointed.
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Old 10-14-14, 05:06 PM
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Every time I've been hit I had at least some kind of warning. So I was focused on trying to turn out of the crash. Obviously the times I've been hit I failed.

The instance that sticks out was being right hooked while riding downhill on a sprinkly day. I banked hard right. As far over as I could. I remember watching the front tire pass a few inches from my front tire. Then my front tire was barely under the body of her car. But I pulled out and the back tire missed my front tire by less than an inch. The relief I felt was short lived tho as I watched the over sized rear bumper sweep right into my tire. Fortunately I was pretty close to the ground at that point. Didn't have far to fall.
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Old 10-15-14, 08:28 AM
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We have a phrase at work that I think applies here: "chronic unease." It means to take a step beyond understanding your situation, surroundings, work processes, etc. and asking yourself, "what could go wrong?" It sounds like you have great knowledge of your route, traffic patterns, etc., but do you ask yourself "what if?" I would guess the answer is probably yes. That is a good habit to get in. Make a conscious effort to ask yourself, "what could go wrong?"
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Old 10-15-14, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by rpecot
We have a phrase at work that I think applies here: "chronic unease." It means to take a step beyond understanding your situation, surroundings, work processes, etc. and asking yourself, "what could go wrong?" It sounds like you have great knowledge of your route, traffic patterns, etc., but do you ask yourself "what if?" I would guess the answer is probably yes. That is a good habit to get in. Make a conscious effort to ask yourself, "what could go wrong?"
I spent about eight years working as a jewelry crime investigator for Lloyd's of London, and a big part of my job was to examine the little mistakes made by traveling diamond salesmen that could lead to a multimillion dollar theft. In so many cases, a split second loss of focus could get a salesman into big trouble, and in so many others, the theft was going to occur no matter what the salesman did to avoid it.

This experience formed the basis of my question. I can't imagine doing anything more to avoid a catastrophic meeting with an automobile, but I'm sure many others felt the same way before it happened. Am I fooling myself, or is there a reason I've been riding the roads for 45 years without a single accident?
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Old 10-15-14, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by noglider
I'm still impressed, even understanding your explanation. Even more impressed now.
Makes me want to get fresh brake pads ASAP. I can usually stop before trouble, but really worn pads won't help there!

I have always automatically steered in direction of travel of potential obsticle, unless steering the other way gave me more room. People seem to make a sport out of blocking me & cutting me off, so recently I've started taking the lane & they can go pound sand with their dangerous driving behaviour.

- Andy
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Old 10-15-14, 06:05 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by Papa Tom
I can't imagine doing anything more to avoid a catastrophic meeting with an automobile, but I'm sure many others felt the same way before it happened. Am I fooling myself, or is there a reason I've been riding the roads for 45 years without a single accident?
You're on the right track. Clearly you're doing one or two things right, with that record. You've also been lucky, but that's not bad. We all survive on an element of luck.

I think one important trick is memorizing lots of various patterns and then recognizing them. This comes only with practice. Then something unusual happens. You have to put that in your collections of patterns so you can recognize it if it ever recurs.
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Old 10-15-14, 07:11 PM
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Someone earlier had mentioned "good luck." I had a construction inspector say something that really made sense (and drove home the chronic unease sentiment): "We don't want to be in the luck business. Because there's a 50/50 chance of it being good or bad." Those are not odds I want to take regarding my safety. You are on the right path. Continue to question. Seek to improve yourself.
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