"Tactical" flashlight buyers
 

Any military people find the "tactical" nature of these flashlights useful? Or is this "tactical" designation, with seizure-inducing strobes and beveled lens caps really just for show? (I know as a nonmilitary bike person myself, the tactical features aren't useful at all and I'd prefer they be completely omitted.)

Just for show. I wouldn't use the strobe during a paintball match, and I don't plan on hitting anyone with the bezel.

I guess maybe if I was like down behind enemy lines and needed to signal the rescue chopper and it was dark and I didn't have a radio or an infrared and it was a Tuesday and a new moon and a leap year...

If that was you, then I'd turn it on and shine it right at you. :innocent:

Surefire, a leading US manufacturer of tactical flashlights holds training sessions for their use. I have never met anyone who has actually attended.

Tactical-style flashlights on bikes seem silly to me- they're big and heavy, with bulky attachment systems, and often lack in run-time compared to dedicated bike lights.

I will say, though, that the strobe function is a highly effective way of getting the attention of drivers. Perhaps the strike bezel would be a good "plan B" if the strobe fails to keep them away from you on the road...

Actually, tactical flashlights are amongst the smallest, most inexpensive ways to get lighting on the bike.

Show me a bike-specific light that will put out 200 lumens for 1 hour that costs less than $85 - you'll be lucky if you can get anything <$100 for 200 lumens. You can alternatively buy a Terralux $28 flashlight that will deliver the goods, and mount stably with a $5 lockblock.

I guess the Magicshine is a bike-specific solution, but it doesn't really count since it's not made by a well known bike-specific manufacturer (like Blackburn, NiteRider, etc.)

IMO, these major bike light manufacturers really need to get with the program - they've been WAY behind the lighting curve for years now. It's really sad when a $28 tactical flashlight outperforms nearly 100% of their products that cost 3x as much.

The lumens per dollar is great on LED flashlights, but many (maybe most) cyclists need something that lasts longer than 1 hour before a charge or battery change is needed.

I'm using a few of them, but I've been out of the military since long before marketing people started giving the "tactical" designation to everything. I think this is a pretty shrewd appeal to people who play a lot of Splinter Cell and can envision themselves having a sudden need for a tactical lint brush while suspended upside-down from a tactical wire rope at 3am in a foreign embassy.

The only tactics I'm aware of that apply to these flashlights are:
1. lighting things up (standard mode,)
2. getting attention (the flashy mode.)

I suppose bashing the enemy's skull in is a tactic, but you can do that with lots of other tactical things...

If I recall, the last time anybody produced numbers, the majority of bike commuters have commutes that are less than one hour and the vast majority of cyclists never ride in the dark (or the rain, or the snow or the cold). I figure for most commuters and rec riders, an hour is about all they need and changing a battery in a flashlight isn't rocket science if they need more sometimes.

I saw the Surefire ones at Loews the other day-Does anyone have an explanation as to why those things are $85 apiece that isn't an insult to the intellect?

cuz there's kids without Ipods in China...now eat your meat!

Point is valid - but even so -

Point to ONE bike manufacturer which can come up with something that would deliver 1+hr of useable lighting (not just a "to-be-seen" light) for <$100?

You can use a $20 P7 flashlight with 200+ lumens on medium for 2+ hrs easily. Nothing the major manufacturers make comes close for price.

I also don't see the average cyclist or commuter need a 200 lumen light. I got a Cygolite Luxeon light (150 lumens, maybe), that is more than enough for anything, save maybe off-roading in the dark. The main thing you need for commuting is "be seen" visibility. That includes the tail-light, reflectors, reflective clothing, etc.

Most of these flashlight costs you're quoting don't include the battery cost. Last I checked, 4 AA's + Charger is still around $20 or more. Add that cost to any flashlight if you don't have the batteries bought already.

I'm guessing you don't have anything brighter than that, or otherwise you wouldn't be saying "that is more than enough for anything".

I find the tactical forward-clickie switches very useful in real life. Half the time I pick up a flashlight, I only need a quick burst of light to look at something, so a tactical light is perfect. Push for momentary illumination, release to turn off. I don't know why they even bother making reverse-clickies :crash:

US labor, Acme threading, and probably you can actually get parts for it 5 years from now. That's my best guess.

I have a Seca 700 (as in, 700 lumens). In total darkness, I can ride at a slow cruise (15mph) on the 175-lumen setting... the light's distributed really well, and that helps. But even at 700 lumens, well-distributed and all, it's still not overkill for high speeds and/or situations where there are strong lights to compete with (two oncoming lanes of car headlights, for example). It'll be a long time before I call "overkill" on a production light system.

Neither the seizure inducing nature, nor the beveled lens caps are the reasons I have two. The reasons I have them is they are more technologically advanced than competitively priced bike lights.
My Dinotte is a wonderful light, but it just gets used less because the flashlights are easier to use, and they do the job as well or better.

This is true. However, consider that this is a one-time investment, and you can get a high-quality charger + 4 AAs in a kit for $25ish. The entire lockblock/light+battery setup at 200 lumens is still < $60, and you can get 400 lumens for $28 more with a 2nd flashlight on your helmet. This is for US dealers, as well - if you go DealXtreme, you can get 2 x P7s with 18350 chargers for exactly the same price - for at least 800, if not 1000 lumens.

If you run the P7s on "medium", it will STILL be brigher than your Cygolite 150lumen and run for hours. And it will still cost lower than your Cygolite. I also am not sure you can use the Cygolite charger on other lights - hopefully you can, or else you've just taken another loss there.

The Cygolite actually is actually a reasonable deal for a bike-specific manufacturer at <$100 for 150 lumens, but still, it's almost an afterthought compared to the examples I've given above that cost exactly the same, if not less.

The Dinotte is probably the most "useable" bike-specific light IMO, at it's $150 for 2 hr runtime at 200 lumens - still a far cry from dual P7s running on medium.

As a non military person myself, I ONLY use the strobe function of the flash light.

Unlike most of you, I use my light in blinky mode (to be seen) since I live in a large city with enough street light to see the road.

For your reference, I have this MTE P7 sku13060 8-mode flashlight. I always have it on the 3rd mode (which I call the epileptic seizure mode). I think it blinks somewhere around 5 - 10x per second. I never really counted because I get a headache from looking at it. Sometimes I have to turn the light off for a few minutes because I'd get dizzy if I'm riding too long with it on.

I use a helmet mounted strobe (SolarForce L2) for daytime urban riding. I find that it makes me much more visible to cars. They are highly useful and I won't buy a helmet light (or drop-in) without one.

Huh? Not everyone gets to commute on well-lit urban roads.
I want to see Bambo the Deer, Rocky the suicide raccoon, Pete the bottomless pothole and all the rest of the goonies out there in the deep darkness that are waiting to ruin my day.

I'm sure when I bought the Cygolite 3-4 years ago, it was rather advanced. The bike lights were just starting to go off of Halogen and onto the LEDs. I've commuted with it, ridden the dark paths, dodging deer and racoons and ice at 15-18mph. Like I said, it does the job very nicely. I think I got it for around $80 - now I see it on the internet for around $60-65.

You're right that the batteries and charger aren't useful for anything else. I'm just sort of pointing out that the Cygolite isn't that much more expensive than a Lowe's task force light when you take into account battery and charger.

It would be nice if the difference between 'tactical' and MIL-Spec were made more clear.

Just because something is described as 'tactical' does not mean that it has been designed or built to meet some pre-defined standards related to function, ruggedness, quality and reliability. Anyone who has ever asked flashlight questions that started 'is this really...' or 'what's the best...' will recognise that there is considerable variability in the performance of these lights.

That said, if any light really WERE designed, built and validated to MIL spec standards, you could be assured that a price tag of $100 would be a bargain, simply because it would likely cost as much to produce each one.

As for the utility of features like 'tactical strobe' and the 'assault crown', I'd chalk it up to the individual user. A legal, metal rod that you can carry with you at night, curl your fist around, and topped with a nasty striking tool seizure - inducing strobe might be might just be enough to disorient an attacker in the dark, throw them off balance and get that momentary advantage to get the hell out of there. That's why my wife rides with one.

Alox: +1
Some of the "tactical" flashlights that I've seen aren't even up to the level of crappy civilian stuff. The word "tactical" has no legal meaning; I could sell a tactical ball of mud if I wanted to.

I got my Niterider Minewt usb for < $100 (barely) and I love it... good run times, over 3 hours with a drop off around 3:15, and easy charge via usb.

Mind you, I also love my Romisen that is my backup. I wouldn't be without either now and to think I used to commute with 2x blackburn quads. I'm so happy one of my quads flew off and was totally trashed during a rough ride; that was the push I needed to get some better lightning. I'm tempted by the Magicshine but not sure about the long term quality.

People can't even agree what `usable lighting' is. For example, I find that this 1w 50 lumen light makes plenty of light to see with, and lasts about 4 hours at maximum brightness. I wouldn't go offroading with it, but for road riding it's adequate -- it lights your path. If not enough light, I guess I could get seven more of them and rechargeable batteries and a few chargers for all of them for under $100, mount them all to my bike.

Though perhaps they don't qualify as a bike manufacturer? If not, the Planet Bike Blaze 1w is similar -- similar brightness, lasts longer, uses more convenient 2xAA rather than 4xAAA batteries, but costs considerably more. Still, you could get two for under $100.

I'm quite happy with my P7 lights and they're a great deal, granted, but as far as I know they don't go cheaper than $30 or so, and you need to spend $10 more for two batteries and $5-$12 more for a charger and $1.50 more for a mount. It's not quite $20.

I also have a Cygolite 135 lumen light that was $75 or so after sale and discounts, and it's very adequate. It lasts about 4 hours with the included NiMH battery. It puts out less light than the P7 flashlight, but the beam pattern is far superior. It's not a better bargain, but it's also bike specific and under $100 and puts out a lot of light exactly where you need it.

Tactical is a marketing term. What you really want to discuss is "mil-spec" or torches for proffesional LEO/Mill use. I only have experience with Inova, surefire and the DE P7. The reason some of these lights are so expensive is becuase of their durability. Would you trust your life to a P7 mounted to a rifle for weeks? I am not sure the quality of my P7 is even close to a US made mil-spec torch.

The new surefire e2d led fits in your pocket and can blast 200lumens with a tap of the tailcap. Combine its light output with some of its physical atributes and you have a great self defense tool.

There are also intresnically safe lights. These are designed for high hazard enviroments, think flammable/explosive atomsphere, e.g. mines or hazmat cleanup.

I just recently needed a lighting setup for a new bike I've gotten, and I did it before I found these forums. I looked at bike specific lights, and was very unimpressed with the price/performance ratio when it came to lights - I did some research, and found a good deal on a pair of flashlights - I got two of these for $52 shipped, spent $14 for six rcr123a batteries and a charger off ebay, and $5 for a helmet and a bike mount on dealextreme. I'm considering buying four more batteries for about six bucks, so I could throw 'em in my wedge pack.

Each light puts out 220 lumens for 2 hours, I've got one on my helmet and one on my handlebars. If I look like a dork because I have a "tactical" flashlight on my bike, I don't really care. I've got two 220 lumen lights so I don't die. Also, the eagletac lights don't have strobe mode, so I don't have to worry about that. All told I'm out $71, $77 if I decide to get more batteries so I have a four hour runtime instead of two. These are also waterproof, which is handy in Washington.

Also, these have a 14 hour runtime in standard mode if I need a "be seen" light without a "see" light.

I don't really feel any need to argue with people, this just seemed like the cheapest way to eat up some dark. And hey, if I'm going camping, I've got a couple pretty damn bright extra flashlights I can take with me. That's pretty cool too.

edit: In case anyone's curious, here's the two mounts I got off dealextreme and my ebay cheapie batteries. I've had good luck with the ebay batteries.

http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12000 (works good on the helmet)
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.15642
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...%3DI%26otn%3D2

No. They're waaaaay overpriced. In fact the last time I looked at a Surefire LED it didn't even have regulation - ie the circuit that keeps brightness constant as the battery runs down.

Fenix, for example, guaranteed a higher standard of toughness than Surefire the last time I checked. This "MilSpec" justification is mostly nonsense. Most soldiers wear Casio G-Shocks not "MilSpec" Marathons - exactly because the Casios are MUCH tougher.