1. I believe there have already been some posts in the thread that make it clear to me at least that some people just do not "get" it when it comes to the Brooks saddles. So be it. Ride what you want and I will too. I'm sure we can agree to that.
2. A reading of my posts shows 4500 miles of riding in a year and a 320 mile trip just completed in which I reported "the B-17 performed very well and was comfortable". While there have been mentions of brief periods of perineal pressure (especially in the very early rides in cold weather), I do not believe there is any mention of chronic "tender tush" anywhere. So let's not make up facts that are not in the thread shall we?

Finally- It seems like I just said this a week or two ago but I will repeat it again: Reports of great suffering and discomfort in this saddle evaluation/break-in are (again) being greatly exaggerated.

Ok, so as a newbie you explored and stumbled onto a formula that works for you. Congratulations!

Many of us are exploring now.

If you're suggesting such explorations are failures, or that to need such an exploration is a failure, shame on you for such an "I got mine, what's wrong with you!" attitude.

If you're suggesting the Brooks product concept is a failure, that is a value-driven judgement, and I could see how from your experience it appears so.

But the longevity of teh Brooks product line has shown that many people continue to see value in it, for reasons that have been hashed over in numerous places on BF. Selle San Marco (of course a prominent maker of saddles along the line of what you do like) thought the concept and the product basis to be strong enough to buy and save Brooks. Presumably this was seen as valuable to complement their line of modern saddles. Had they judged the concept to be a dead end, they were (and are) entitled to kill it.

So you're entitled to your opinion, but if I understand it, it is irrelevant to those of us looking to use a Brooks saddle, and who are glad to have some idea of what to expect of this old product with modern but old butts that need to be hardened up.

Episode 63- The "Epic Fail" Continues

After too many post-tour days off from riding (but justifiable due to horrible heat index here:)) I had a great early morning 25 mile ride today. I used the Imperial N that I finished the tour on... and it was great. Two distinct cheek impressions are now forming on it.

Although the B-17 was certainly adequate for my four days of touring on it and I would not hesitate to use it again for distance riding, I think the Imperial N is probably going to be my favorite saddle. I am even thinking hmmm.... what might a Swift be like?

If your collection gets tooooo large, I know where you can dispose of some of it! I gots more bikes....

All kidding aside, I am one who happens to think that Brooks is a wonderful saddle . .... You just have to give it, and yourself, time to grow together. Some of us take longer, maybe it's age related....

I think my next one will be honey colored, because I think they are a beautiful saddle, and should stand out more.

:DHah! Sounds like you are starting your own home for orphan and wayward Brooks there! :D Alas, I must keep all of mine for scientific purposes... possible follow-up testing and all that...

Postlude: After 673 attempts to photograph emerging cheek impressions on a black saddle, here is the best I can do for now. Readers will, I assume, trust that the impressions are, in fact, mine.

Yep, you can feel them a lot easier on a black saddle, than see them.

Proofide
 

billydonn, I'm getting ready to install a B17 on new Cannondale Quick. My understanding is that the proofide is applied on the underside of the saddle and the top side initially. I read that the top side should have Proofide applied periodically during the "break-in" period. Does the bottom side only get the one application? What I guess I'm really asking is, do you have to remove the seat periodically to apply Proofide to the bottom of the seat? This would be a pain in the yazoo.
What was your experience?

Curdog,
I think you are "supposed" to apply the Proofide to both the top and the underside of the saddle periodically. Hopefully you can get to most of it without removing seat from post... mostly I just yanked post from frame (loosten clamp first :D), flipped her over and did the best I could. I think you will find there are places where your fingers do not reach under a B-17, even if you take the post completely off... just do the best you can.

As far as I could tell, the Proofide did not noticeably affect saddle pliability. My saddles started to change after the Franklin Baseball Glove Oil got applied... but if/when you decide to do that, do NOT overdo it. The saddle leather absolutely drinks the stuff up before your very eyes in my experience and it is easy to think that you need to apply more because the leather seems thirsty. PM me if you get to the oil stage and want more specifics. Good luck.... although why anyone would want to go through this horror and suffering escapes me. ;)

Periodically, in this case, means once every couple of years.

And, it's real easy to "paint" the underside of the saddle, with a "flux" brush, avaialb le at almost every hardware store in the plumbing section. You can paint any place that is visible. The only spots you can't get to are under metal.

I do the underside annually, and the top a couple times a year. The top is like shining shoes with wax polish.

well that was an interesting read, what a bike nerd bunch we are, made me laugh sometimes.
especially the spread sheet (wink)

what this made me think the most is that this fellow started riding his B17 when it was fricken cold outside. I am certain this made a difference.
I am a lightweight, 140lbs, and started riding my new B17 in a hot and humid spell (30c + , so in teh 80s or maybe 90f) and I am certain that the sweating helped with it. One hour rides for 6 or 7 times with slightly sore sitbones at end of the hour. Did add a bit more proofide to the top and bottom "sitbone" areas towards teh end to soften up that specific area (combined with sweltering weather and my sweatiness) and then the sore sitbone area went away.
Yes, I am a lifelong biker, yet this was more early in my biking season. but this may have helped compared to the OP. And like him, not "torture" for me either.

I already mentioned in another thread that I didnt think starting with a new Brooks would be good in cold weather, it makes sense that the leather will be harder and less c ompliant, therefore hte dimples will take longer to form.

cheers

Wow! What memories... those were the days!:D

My 1977 Raleigh Pro came with a Brooks Professional. It was as hard as a board until I was caught in a sustained downpour during the USCF Arkansas State Road Racing Championship race that soaked both me and the saddle. After that it fit my ass like a glove.

still have my 30 year old Brooks Pro, still fine, did a saturation with Proofide, on it way back then..

but where I LIVE NOW the most used (trekking) bike has a Fizik Vitesse on it , that I can shove back
far enough for adequate set back (Brompton got high clearance rails bent, on the batch they sold last year, to order..
they can go to the factory in Italy and specify this stuff, we just are at the take it or leave it end,
as the retail consumer
B17 standard, came on the bike. riding, I was sitting on the rivets .
or [on zero set back Sus Post] inadaquate fit, too far forward for comfort..

More $ a Frame with a lower seat tube angle would help, the more $ will make it just a thought..

I won't tell anyone, if you don't... that was how I broke in one B17 I bought in London about 10 days before PBP2003.

That PBP was wet, and the saddle broke in very quickly. Alas, I had to give it to Machka after her bike (and B17 saddle) were stolen. So now I am back to breaking in a B17 on the tandem and a Swallow Ti on the CF Merlin... and it hasn't rained hard enough for either to progress the process rapidly.

Machka's also breaking in another new B17 on her Ti bike, and I've offered to douse it with a bucket of water several times before rides, but haven't been taken up on the offer yet.

Georgia summers have helped speed up the break in time on my Brooks saddles. No need for rain when there is a daily application of sweat in the mix.

My B17 became soaked on a rainy tour last summer. Around day 3 we stopped for a rest and I was concerned at how throughly wet it had become. We're talking really wet here. I was afraid I had ruined it. However, there was nothing to do but finish the ride. The saddle was comfortable before the ride but like ciocc-cat it now fits my butt like a glove. Pure butt nirvana. I sure Brooks does not recommend this kind of abuse but it worked.

Billy-are you still riding as much? The beginning of this was back in spring of 2009 I believe, almost two years back now. I hope biking is still part of your life, and i am curious which saddles you are using (and more importantly, liking still) after the time you wrote of your X, Y and I think a Z comparisons while getting ready for your big ride. Nebraska, it must be all snowy there now isnt it, Im not 100% sure how north it is, but I imagine no riding for you yet.
cheers

Believe me, theres no riding going on in Nebraska right now. It's supposed to be zero tonight and I am further south than Omaha. Ice & snow mix.

oh, 0F is about -18C....yup, thats chilly. had to look up an online calculator to see what it was in C. Ive lost my temp F comparisons, live with a mix still of lbs and kilos, mph and kph, cms and inches, but I dont think in F anymore.
I have a feeling that 0F would not be condusive to breaking in a Brooks, thats for sure.

Hi DJB: Oh yes I have been riding a lot... about 5k miles last year but without a multi-day tour. Have not been riding the Brooks saddles at all this year, mostly because I like to experiment and have found WTB saddles to my liking. Also, my typical rides have been in the 25 to 30 mile range and I can ride nearly any saddle for that amount of time. I put one of the Brooks on a trainer bike tonight for an intense 50 minute session (sprints and intervals and such) and it wasn't comfortable at all for some reason. I will probably play with the Brooks again in the spring when longer rides are in order in preparation for a big tour in June (Cycle Montana).

As Journeyman said above, we are locked in to a serious arctic blast right now (-3F tonight with 6 inches of snow on ground) and that means indoor riding for the next few weeks. Have been doing hard trainer rides with a group of whippersnapper (25 to 40ish) friends lately and it is kind of fun in a painful, suffery, sort of way. (I have at last found a way to keep younger riders from dropping me!) Maybe I will be faster this year! :):)

nice to hear, all this talk of seats is completely secondary to just being out there and enjoying oneself, with the bonus of it being really good for ones body and spirit. 5K miles, or 8K kms, that is more than I have ever done in a season, so hats off to you.
have a good season this year and be healthy

I own three Brooks saddles and enjoy each of them. One is a B-17 Standard I use on a Trek 520 (3,483 miles), second is a B-17 Narrow (5,824 miles) I use on a Carbon Trek Pilot, and last is a B-67 (1,802 miles) I use on my Gary Fisher MTB. I transferred the B-67 from a Trek 7300 Hybrid I use to own. I have had Brooks Saddles on my different bikes since 1954. I have transferred them from one bike to the next. I also use the neatsfoot oil method to soften my saddles. I have found that the break-in period isn't as painful as many riders suggest it is. Positioning of the saddle I believe is the key issue to comfort. I wouldn't own or ride any other brand of saddle. Yes, I am sold on Brooks saddles, and if they are properly taken care of they will last for many years. I have only worn out one B-17 in my life, and I have had two others stolen. If you own or plan on owning a Brooks Saddle, I hope you enjoy yours as much as I have over the 56 years I have been cycling.

Amen to that. My B17CS and Swift aren't mounted on bikes at the moment. I moved on to a Selle Anatomica, then to a Specialized Avatar. And now I can comfortably (no pun intended) say that I am done with musical 'chairs'.

Stumbled on this thread after just giving up on my Brooks B17 Imperial. Will now give it another try after trying the Neetsfoot oil. I am beginning to think at 275lbs. Nothing will be comfortable.
By the way Billydonn what are you now riding. Did you ever go back to Brooks?