After swapping out my 120 mm stem for a 100, riding in the drops feels perfect but I feel cramped on the hoods. I've had it that way for a couple of hundred miles, to see how I adjust to it, but my shoulders still tend to hunch up some times on the hoods. With the 120 the hoods feel ok but in the drops is a little awkward. Classic round shaped drops, not shallow or compact.

If it means anything, I can see the front axle way in front of the bars using the 100 stem, when riding hoods. My proportions are smack in the middle of average so assume there's nothing exceptional in that direction. What do you think, is it always a compromise or is there a tricky adjustment that might help?

There's not much difference in 20mm. Since you already have the 120 stem maybe just put it back on. When in doubt go longer IMO.

Compact bars on the 120.

+1. I don't use compact drops myself, but they're a good way to get both positions closer together.

You don't think I can have both the deeper drop and also be comfortable on the hoods? Drats.

I think it depends on what you're going for. I like how old-style drop bars stretch me out in the drops, a little less on the hoods, and allow for me to be much more upright on the tops, but it sounded like there was too much contrast for you.

It's typical for people to mount their levers too far up the hook or roll the bars back to far. How are yours? The tips of your levers should match the bottom of the drops.

The bottom of the hooks are parallel to the ground, but the tips of the hoods are a couple of cm higher than the bar top. Think I should move them down?

Pics?

What kind of hoods you working with? If they're C&V brake lever hoods you can get some modern brake levers that have brifter-style hoods. They give you an extra one or two cm reach.

Not as rounded as I remembered:


Lester, they're old Sora brifters.

That looks normal. I am just guessing at this point but I would try longer stem, shallower drops and a conventional radius rather than ergo profile. I guess if you raise the handlebar and make the stem longer you may get the same net result.

Riding, I seem to look straight down thru the head tube axis when the setup on my bike is good.

Aha an excuse to upgrade my boat-anchor handlebar. I hesitate to raise it since the drops feel fine, never better.

not sure what you're expecting? to have both the hoods and drops position to be the same? if so, then get a compact bar.
I find it annoying that on a compact bar, the hoods and drops position feels the same.
If you look at your pic of your brifter placement on the bar, that position is fairly typical for most. When on the hood you're actually almost a full inch forward of the actual bar. On a compact, if you rotate your arm downward from that hood position, you'll come onto the drops without any change in a perceived reach or torso angle. If that's what you want.
I find that the hoods and drop positions should offer a differnt torso position for me, so compact bars are an annoyance.
If you spend 90+% of your time on the hoods, then going into the drops may feel uncomfortable. It's a matter of what your accustomed to. If you make the drops'comfortable' and not improve flexibility and torso strength; then surely the hoods position will feel cramped.
I like traditional round bend bars, full drop. I set up to be 75 to 80+% of the time on the hoods, and 'train' to be comfortable on the drops, when I need max good aerodynamics.
AS for Brifter placement - purely a rider preference. If one has long fingers then moving them further up/back on the bar works fine. If one need sto reduce reach to the levers a bit, further down the bend will help that a bit. 'Correct' is what works for you.

I'm not looking for the same position both ways cyclezen. I'd rather use the drops for a lower more aggressive position.

I was experimenting with the shorter stem thinking it would improve my position in the drops. It feels like it did but objectively the reach is pretty short so I'll probably switch back to the 120 mm stem and ditch the ergo shaped bars, unless I happen to adjust better to the hoods the way it is now.

People say not to adjust reach with the saddle but I'm tempted to move it back a cm or so since it's slightly forward as it is, and see how that affects the situation.

I do hold to the saw "Don't adjust your saddle to make the bars fit..."
But I'm also not hard and fast on saddle position. I'm about 'Position the saddle to your preferred torso and leg position'.
Which means I can choose my saddle position based on what I want to achieve. If I wanted to race a lot of crits, I had my saddle at 5.7 cm behind BB and with an appropriate saddle height, found it best, for me, for this type of racing.
30 years later, I'm not racing anymore, but still riding hard, climbing a bunch more and have found that 7 cm behind BB currently works well for me. My old Colnago is still set at 5.7, and when I ride it I immediately feel the difference from my tarmac - not bad, just different - all good.
Both bike setups require a slight, but significant different setup of the stem and bars... I always work from the back to the front...

Shorter stem, saddle moved back now, it's unclear what I really accomplished except that it's slightly more "normal" looking. I'll say it fits better and call it a wrap. Thanks for the discussions all.