brakemeister

because he wants a lightweight bike ... which would eliminate the derrailleur version AND a lot of other suggestions...lol

badmother

On the trips you describe- when you are out wining and dining, where is the bike? Locked outside, waiting to take you back to where you sleep? Securely locked in your hotel or in a friends house/garden?

Ozonation

Missed that from the OP. Champignon... get out there and ride that bike!

Right... sure... of course.... only us Easterners in Ontario have BS, not like you Pacific coast types...

invisiblehand

No. I've actually ridden quite a few and 406 wheels ride better ... especially over non-smooth or off-road surfaces ... and there are far far far more excellent 406 tires compared to 349/305 tires. Especially if you're willing to test out the high-end BMX tires.

https://www.danscomp.com/shop-RACE/sg...ing+Tires.html
https://www.danscomp.com/products.php...estyle%20Tires

I have not thought about it much -- I'm not a frame builder -- but you probably run into geometry issues with a 349 wheel relative to a 406 wheel with some extreme low trail measurements.

Anyway, the OP should just ride as many bikes as possible with the two wheel sizes over a wide variety of surfaces.

champignon

Lots of great suggestions here and I do really appreciate them . . . . . In order to "activate" the warranty on my X27H, I need to get it set up by a professional bike shop and have a receipt for having done so, so says Dahon. My favorite bike shop is also a ski shop and the guy there is short handed and told me to hold off on bringing in the bike, so I've waited for him (also, nowhere to ride it here without risking getting killed on the ice coating the bike paths). He is going to take the bike in tomorrow, however, and then I'm hoping to take it to Boise (which is lower and normally warmer) on my next trip in 10 days, so I can test it out there.

All of this, of course, is neither here nor there . . . .

Another thought that just came into my head was that I could buy a folder in France and probably connive one of the hotels I'm a regular at there to store the bike for me in between trips. Not sure if they would do that, but if they would that would really eliminate the traveling with the bike on airplanes part of the problem. Given the fact that I spend 6-8 weeks a year there, in rural areas, I could justify having a bike there as long as it didn't cost a fortune. There's a French bike company that has introduced a new model, the specs of which are kind of unclear, the "Btwin Tilt," https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgFUv...PLAYER_bTwinTV

I'm assuming this is probably junk, but has anyone ever heard of this bike or had experience with this company? Their bikes are sold in a mass merchandise sporting goods chain in France, Decathalon.

Thanks

BassNotBass

I'd have to agree with the basic principles behind this argument even though I may be a stodgy old 406 fan. The differences between a 349 and 406 are, IMHO, pretty minor so the ride quality would be more a factor of tire construction and frame geometry and construction. As for the argument that there are more choices of 406 tires than 349s, there are more choices in the more popular 406 size but the fact that fantastic high quality tires are available in 349s makes the argument moot. I may have experimented with tires of different makes and models but I keep falling back on Schwalbes and the better grade Kendas. Ultimately my concern is to use tires that work well for touring and commuting, that being they roll well, have puncture protection and have a decent life-span. 349 sizes are covered in that respect as long as your MO is to ride your bike and not provide a broad spectrum of product reviews on all potential candidates for a particular size.

Dem hoops... dat rhetoric.

(the folding bike meme)

Diode100

Decathlon and their BTwin bikes are well known in continental europe and are good value for money. In the last couple of years they have broadened and improved their folder range and now offer interesting models at various spec levels. If you look at their website I'm sure you will find a model that will do what you want at a price you'll feel comfortable with.

https://www.decathlon.fr/C-343842-vel...et-electriques

If you go to much the same area of France each trip have you thought of enquiring at a local bike shop if they can hire you out something, or if you bought a bike through them, maybe they could store and service it for you, ready for your next visit ?

BassNotBass

I have to admit that they got my attention with the sample of "Along the Watchtower" to a beat that had me expecting to hear MC Solaar on vocals.

champignon

I've come back to the Strida several times over the last few weeks however each time I have easily talked myself out of the idea

My sense of the Strida, never having seen one in person, is that not only is it not designed for my intended use, but in this case the whole is less than the sum of the parts. There are many interesting and novel ideas and executions present, such as the Kevlar chain and very easy and fast fold, but in the end it deviates too far from what has evolved in "bikedom" over the last couple of hundred years. One has to assume that the evolution of bikes from their early origins to what we see (mostly) now is based on some sort of symbiosis between the human form and what mechanical forms humans are capable of producing. There are reasons related to human shape and function that explain why most of our bikes look very similar, and the fact that the Strida differs so radically from that norm, combined with the fact that the embrace of the Strida by the biking community has been way less than total, tells me something. Or so I think.

champignon

I am no stranger to the general post topic of "what should I buy" from a newbie coming into a forum of experienced users; it is something I have seen hundreds of times regarding the purchase of many different sorts of things that people become passionate about. And, it is very common for respondents to suggest something quite a bit more expensive than the OP asked about, because, hey, why not, they aren't going to have to pay for it, the OP will :-) I have also been quite liberal with other peoples' money when I have encountered questions such as this on other web forums . . . . .

This whole thread raises some issues about the general topic of traveling with a bike that I had not full thought through. I can see where travel with a bike could be a great thing, such as if one is going on a trip that is wholly bike centered, such as a planned tour of Provence on a bike, or knitting together the chateaux of the Loire by bicycle. But my question really has more to do with continuing visits to an adopted part of a country that I spend a couple of months a year in, in this case, Burgundy in France. I've already been to most of the places I would want to go; my trips now are much more centered on having a relationship with a particular area, with particular restaurants and hotels, and going back to these same places over and over again, with some side excursions perhaps to other areas that are not the main focus of the trips. Kind of like faking being a Burgundian for a few weeks, and then happily being allowed to go home at the end, after I have had enough.

So yes, I do want to keep my new X27H in good shape, because it was bought specifically to allow me to tool around to business appointments 8 or 9 months of the year instead of using my car, a way to increase my exercise, but fun enough that I would actually prefer to use the bike than my car. And I got a deal on the bike at the end of the season, which is why I bought it so recently (in snow season). Sure, I could use it for the airplane trips, but I'd just rather leave it in my business house and use it for getting around to business meetings. I might even decide to write it off as a business expense, given its planned usage, which would completely eliminate the chance to take it on trips.

champignon

It would be in my hotel room. As a folder, it would work fine like that, although could be tight in a cheap French hotel like a B&B.

Ozonation

To me, ironically, your intended situation argues for a better folding bike. Since you won't be touring per se, but rather going to places you've gone before, you're in some ways "commuting". If portability (in and out of small European cars), peace of mind (place it under your table), and ease of use (hopping from cafe to restaurant) are your primary considerations, then I'd argue a good folder will take you further. If you were just visiting, say once in the next ten years, you'd probably be better off just renting a bike at your destination. Instead, you'll be spending a few months in one general location, presumably on an annual basis. A better quality bike will save you aggravation in the long run, yet give you the ride performance you'll ultimately demand.

I still think a Brompton would fit your needs admirably, but if you can get a line on a locally branded folding bike with service support, so much the better.

However, this assumes that a folder actually meets your needs. Given your arguments whether or not a folder is the best for your circumstances, and your statement about your new X27H that:
Sure, I could use it for the airplane trips, but I'd just rather leave it in my business house and use it for getting around to business meetings.

... I suspect you're not entirely convinced a folder serves you the best when you consider it as a benefit-cost analysis: you're further wondering whether or not you really believe you would actually use a folder as intended. You might be better off, in some ways, with just buying a decent used full size bike at your destination, and storing it somewhere when you're back in the US as you argued earlier. Will you really need to throw it in a car that often? Are you more than likely just to ride somewhere from your hotel or base and then lock it up at that delectable restaurant? If you don't invest too much in it, then there will less regret if it gets stolen or damaged.

champignon

Thanks very much for this information. I am familiar with the Décathalon chain, being as it is everywhere in France, however I assumed that given where the bike is being sold that it was probably a cheap mass market product, like you might find in one of our large US sporting goods chains which focus on the mass market and not on selling better merchandise. The model that I found the most interesting would be this one:

https://www.decathlon.fr/velo-pliant-...d_8202739.html

There is a very cool video about it but the link doesn't work if you try to capture it from the Décathalon website. It is the last video, the one on the right, on the product page for the Tilt 9. I can't find out how much it weighs, but might not be important if I was able to leave it in France and just take it around with me in a car covering a compact part of the country.

It is good to hear that this company makes a decent quality bike. This is a real option and would eliminate the need to travel with a bike. It is however an imposition, and I'm not sure it would be easy for my hoteliers to find a place to store it for 4 or 5 months straight, in between my trips.

As to the idea of renting a bike, I haven't seen any folders for rent, and by the time I paid for 3 or 4 weeks of a rental, I could probably almost buy one. And I haven't encountered a bike store anywhere that would store your bike indefinitely, just because you bought it there . . . . .

thanks for the info and suggestions.

smallwheeler

badmother

Ok. Asking since this is important. If you want to take it with you into (private and public) buildings a lot we are talking Brompton. If you want to lock it outside a lot
(in public places) we are talking "as cheap and ugly looking as possible".

The Dahon curve Thor mentioned is a great bike but I newer tryed to pack mine in a suitcase (and I am not worryed about dismantling).

Been thinking that if you find the perfect bike for you at a perfect price plse tell us becouse more than one of us is going to be interested. I fear you do not- unless you buy used. The idea of storing a bike at your destination may work well for you.

champignon

Thanks again for your thoughtful post.

This may well be true, that I should get something better. I'm not doubting the utility of a folding bike; in fact, I can't see how I could get a full sized bike plus my luggage plus myself into the sort of rental car I rent in France; it just would not fit. It is either to change my style of trip, to start renting a much bigger car, or use a folder. That's the choice. Given that I am not very large, only 5'5" tall, the geometry of a folding bike should work for me.

If I was to get a Brompton, I am curious as to whether I could get the factory to deliver one to me at Heathrow Airport in late April, that I could pick up and check in as luggage for the remainder of my trip. It makes no sense to pay US pricing, pay to have it shipped over to the US, then to simply take it back there myself, risking damage in the process.

On the other hand, I enjoy buying things in France that American tourists do not generally buy. The sales people are always surprised that I am actually conversant in French, and they can't figure out that I'm an American until I tell them so -- Anglophones who speak comprehensible French are generally treated very well, because they are so rare, and the rarest of the rare are Americans who can speak passable French. So it is fun, if not inexpensive :-)

champignon

Can't see where taking a typical 20" folder into a hotel and into my room would present a problem. Into the Banque de France, or Bureau de Poste, or a Carrefour, maybe, but a hotel room, who would care?

None of the people in the hotels I frequent would do anything other than snicker. And they already think I am eccentric, this American who keeps coming back to hotels that don't get many American tourists, it would just add to my perceived eccentricity.

And yes, I am always looking for the perfect product at the perfect price; anything less is a compromise, and who likes to compromise?

Ozonation

Ahhh... tu parles francais? Tres bien. Sadly, my French, despite studying it for six years, is sorely lacking.

I have a better idea rather than ordering a Brompton from the UK. When I wanted to order mine, the closest Canadian dealer was in Toronto, Ontario, and they had literally none in stock other than one to test ride. They advised that if I ordered one, it would take a long time because Brompton UK was back ordered. The normal delivery time is five weeks. I heard from other forum members they literally waited for months.

It then occurred to me that each Brompton dealer stocks a couple of Bromptons of the most common configurations and most popular (or saleable) colours. Even better, all I would have to do is to pay tax and shipping from a Canadian Brompton dealer to me - relatively cheap when all said and done especially since it would be within Canada: import, duty, inspection, etc. have already been taken care of by the dealer. And I wouldn't have to wait 5+ weeks. Even better, the larger Brompton dealers have mechanics who can make any adjustments you might want. In my case, the dealer reduced the gearing on my wife's Brompton so that it was better for hills.

So, I phoned every Brompton dealer in Canada. A shop in Victoria, BC, had the ones we wanted - they even discounted my wife's bike because it was a demo that was ridden periodically by potential customers over the last couple of years but never sold. It was in great shape.

You're in the US and so have far more Brompton dealers to choose from. NYCE Wheels have a bunch of Bromptons in stock, ready to go (according to their website). I imagine there are a number of other dealers with some stock to choose from. Just do what I did and call a bunch of them up and see what's readily available - maybe they can even give you a deal on the case and accessories. I can't imagine shipping being that expensive.

Personally, with security the way it is, I wouldn't count on having a Brompton delivered to an airport, waiting to be picked up. If you had a friend in the UK or even France who could receive it on your behalf, maybe, but I would think you would to really break in the Brompton on home soil first.

In fact, make a trip out of it. If you wanted a weekend in New York, you could visit a place like NYCE Wheels and try out all the folding bikes they have - then, you'd really know what you want and like. I'm sure other forum members here can recommend other dealers.

badmother

Not thinking about hotells at all. More like Restaurants, bars, cinemas, museums and shops/shoppingcenters. Also house or flat of peopel who is not into bikes or folders and think they belong outside.

champignon

Good thoughts, but I almost never eat lunch in France, since I gain enough weight there just on dinner plus or minus a hotel breakfast or (gasp) McDonalds breakfast if I'm on the go, which would not be on a bike at that hour. McDonalds (McDo in French parlance) used to be the place to go for free WiFi, when there was hardly any free WiFi in France. You could buy a muffin and a coffee for a couple of Euros, and get to use the internet for free for a couple of hours. Speaking of McDo, they used to have ONE relatively healthy lunch item, a baked chicken "McWrap," which at less than 400 calories was both edible and not too expensive. So of course, they took it off the menu in favor of a McWrap with a fried chicken fingers. Dégeuelasse, if you ask me :-) And since I don't fancy myself as a tourist there any longer, I don't do much shopping or museum hopping, either, just hang out and hope to blend in. It also helps that French people in general are pretty lenient with tourists, especially in the countryside. They just assume you don't have any manners, which works really well in my case . . . .

Diode100

If you want to be taken for a local you have two choices, turn out as a immaculately presented club rider on a super sports road bike, or go to a local market and buy yourself something that hasn't seen a bike mechanic in decades and (probably) has a supermarket basket or an orange crate as a carrier, secured with gardening ties. nothing else will do - a folder will give you away instantly as a pretender.

Ekdog

I wonder how much, if any, difference in price there is for Bromptons from one country to another. I configured mine on the NYCE Wheels website, took the specs to my LBS here in Seville, and they gave me the the same price, within a few cents, of what it would have cost me in New York.

Diode100

Current UK Brompton prices:-

S2L £860

S3L WR £895

P6L £965

M6L £915

M3L £860

S6R £965

S3L £860

P6L £915

M3L WR £895

M2L £860

invisiblehand

It is true that that you only need one tire that fits the broad use of a bike unless perhaps you consider tube and tire availability during travel -- I'd almost certainly go with a Kojak, Scorcher or Comet in 349. But variety and lots of choice is nice luxury and pretty handy at times. With the understanding that I no longer have a 349-wheeled bike so I am not up to date on specifics, when I last checked the statement above is simply wrong for so many groups of tires. Off the top of my head, studded, knobby, wide, and folding. Wide, of course, is relative. For context, I generally use 40 mm wide tires but had to switch to wider tires with growing kids and pinch flats -- keeping PSI and comfort constant -- from riding up driveways. I think that there is one folding 349 tire now ... the aforementioned Kojak.

I agree that construction for most road riding is more important than size independent of how size affects frame geometry. But it still appears that the best 349 tires are still inferior to 406. For instance, I don't think 349 has anything like a Marathon Supreme.

BassNotBass

At today's conversion rate the M6L is $13 cheaper in New York City.