Hello builders and the lot of you,

I have a question about a bike I would like to have built, but curious what you guys think about it before I go putting money down and what not. Here we go:

I want a 29er touring/mountain bike. What does that mean?

I would like to have it built with a fork and all kinds of braze-ons so I can carry panniers and use some skinnier tires for touring which sounds great and I know it possible. BUT, I would like to be able to take off the rigid fork and put on a say 120-140mm travel fork and still have the angles not be so stretched out that it is like a chopper bike.

Two sets of tires and two forks for two bike being smashed into one. Is it possible or will the head/seat tube angles be too extreme one way or another? I would prefer something like a 68ish HTA with a suspension fork and then something near the 71 mark for the rigid jam.

Any thoughts? Steel bike also.

Thanks for letting use nobles pick your brains.

Craigcubed- Anything is possible Really with designing the rigid fork just so you can come close (or spot on, I'm not going to do the math) to your head angles and adjusting the rake will finalize the handling with the rigid one. Perhaps choosing a geometry with the suspension then seeing how much head tube drop equates with how much head angle change then seeing what a rigid fork will get you. Another aspect of the wheel/fork swap outs is the BB height changes and don't forget about the seat set back will move more forwards over the BB with the potential shorter rigid fork.

Perhaps the larger question is how you'll find all these changes and whether you'll be happy riding long hours with both set ups. By my take the body positioning change might be the biggest issue. Of course this depends on how much shorter the rigid fork is. Andy.

Ah I knew there was a reason I asked in here. I had thought about the seat position moving but the over all body position being able to be comfortable both ways does sound problematic.

In my head I imagine the rigid fork being an like a fixed 90mm fork just to keep things from going extreme but moving that to a 110 is possible to keep the angles and myself happy.

Thanks for the insight

Actually, I think most of those changes are complimentary. With a custom bike you can have a hard fork that has relatively the same geometry as your suspension fork, but to the extent that the touring bike has a lower BB steeper ST and HT, that all sounds fine.

The devil is in the details, not meaning it would be bad, but that the idea of approximation is more part of the rack bike build, not the custom one. You will be dealing with an individual who thinks that measuring parts to the thou is reasonable. Yet we are throwing together a bike that will be a sorta. I think that would probably only grab a serious builder if he could see there was a reason for it.

My bigger concern would be the complexity of rigging the bike so the changes can be made comfortably. That kind of rigging gets old. In many cases you will need duplicate everything, so why not just see it through and get another frame. The reality is, a Nashbar touring frame might be more to your liking than the one you will get through this process, and you could leave all the components that define it installed. If it were me I would want different seat, bars, shifters, brakes (or they have to be recabled every bar change), different pedals, and possibly cranks. That is a ton of rebuilding. There is a point where you can just change tires, but once you take it beyond that...

My thought is that you would just get a suspension corrected fork and leave the geometry the same. Maybe a little less trail than most mountain bike forks. Modern mountain bikes have slack head angles and high trail for self-centering of the steering.

I am building a similar bike, but I decided I will always have a rigid fork. I'm of medium build, and a 29er with suspension fork puts the top of the head tube higher than I want on a road bike.

I think all the comments to date are spot on. I'll add this wander;

My gut feel is that the outcome of attempting to make a bike that will do two rather different things is a bike that really isn't very good at either. The real 'oh my, oh my, OMG' moment of a truely nice custom fitted bike is in finally having a bike that fits you so perfectly, rides so exactly the way you always hoped to be able to do someday, and is so awesomely responsive that it seems to drive and steer itself where you wanted it go without even needing to consciously think about it. Your current approach, I suspect, will end up with you spending for that bike, but missing that moment. That would be a loss! Sort of like not showing up for that 4th date with a supermodel!

Best recommendation would be to have a serious long honest ponder on which type of riding you really enjoy the most and will do the most...and then get that custom bike for that specific purpose. Then just add an adequate rack bike to do the other job for a while. If luck smiles on you, sometime not too far out you may be able to get a really good custom bike for that second purpose also!

To be complete in life a real biker/cyclist needs a custom MTB, a custom touring bike, and a custom tandem (with the super model stoker...of course).

If above brings a tear to the eye...please deal with it discretely!!

+1 for ksisler's comments. This was the direction I was trying to get to with the last part of my post. Andy

Thanks for all of the comments. While I do understand trying to make one bike do something another is much better at is a hard thing and likely the best case scenario is to just have two I am not in a position to buy/store/use two bikes. I am not looking for the touring version of it to be a road bike by any means closer to a salsa fargo if you will. For touring the bar set up likely wont change much thus keeping the brakes and shifting all in tact.

using an H type bar will allow for many hand positions and mounts for touring items while being able to be cleaned up while in mtb mode.

but to be fair and take into consideration everyone's comments:

it is possible but is a stretch to make one bike do both of these disciplines well enough to make it worth it, correct?

the question I have is how often are you really going to want to change forks?

I'm not a good person to answer this question because my road bike works on just about everything for me. The only problems I really have had off-road with my road bike were on a rock garden. Then you probably want high ground clearance. Not so sure a suspension fork really buys you that much there, I guess I'll find out when I get my bike going. I am also building myself a mountain bike frame which will start out with a suspension corrected rigid fork.

Since it seems you are talking hardtail, people tell me it's best to limit the travel on the fork to 100mm

While it is hard to guess I would say rarely. I love to mtb and that would be it's main purpose until summer time comes around then with time off I will be able to set off on multi day adventures. Not a weekly thing or even monthly most likely.

in that case you can buy a hardtail 29er mountain bike and get a suspension corrected fork for it. There are lots of full rigid bikes that will take a suspension fork too, but that isn't as economic. Lots of choices.

Seems as though it ought to be possible to find a fork that locks out, or lock one out. And in addition, there are touring bikes with suspension forks, lots of them. Why bother changing anything other than the tires.

I was thinking about suggesting locking out the fork, but there are many reasons to change to a rigid fork: they are cheap, they can have brazeons that suspension forks never have, fenders are easier, racks are easier, and they weigh less.

The only problem with having a fork built for a pre built bike is that the bike that would fit my wants as a mtb likely doesn't have the amenities of a touring bike like braze ons and what not. Then I have to have those added and an off the shelf 29er mtb is most likely aluminum which makes adding those things that much harder. Well limited aluminum builders I should say.

what do you want beyond rack mounts and eyelets? Salsa Fargo V2 fork is suspension corrected, reasonably priced, and has those and a batch of water bottle bosses too. If you have something else that you want, it will be cheaper to have one of those modified than to have a new fork built

What you are asking for in the OP is actually fairly common nowadays, trying to find a bike that isn't suspension corrected limits your choices a lot.

it seems that the cost to make a custom like you want would probably be greater than the cost to get the MTB you want (as that seems to be your real focus) and an used bike for the touring. The use is no different one bike/convert vs two bikes. you might even do more touring if you don't have take the time to swap things out, just pump up and go so to speak. So storage is more the issue and the are lots of options there.

Well, I have spoken with a few frame builders in person now and all of them say pretty much what has been said here. So, I spent a day riding around Denver checking out bike shops and what not and low and behold I have found a bike that I love and will work.

Surly Krampus with a fox 32. And then a few tweaks and skinnier touring wheels and off I go. yay? We will see.

For us, there will be 650b, or 27.5 as some want to call it.
A 29er mtb is going to be too big for me especially with front suspension.
A friend just bought one, with dual suspension, big dollar rig, he loves it but forgot to double check the gear ratios with the bigger wheels when he moved up in wheel size. A new crank fixed that, but not a cheap lesson, the shop did not think of it either.