I used to run my handlebars slammed with only a single 5mm spacer to get the position I wanted but years of abusing my back in my youth(powerlifting, wrestling, etc) has started to catch up with me in the form of acouple bulging & torn discs in my lower back. So, I've needed to raise my riding position torelieve some lower back stress. I seemost bikes add extra spacers to keep the stem flipped down (negative rise), butas an engineer that doesn't make any sense since it adds extra weight (morespacers & steerer post) and flex (longer, less direct path from handlebarto front wheel). So don't laugh when yousee me riding stem flipped up Seriously though, am I missing any reasonother than style to run a stem flipped down (negative rise) if you can obtainthe same position by removing spacers?

You're an engineer?

Your stem clamps onto the steer tube. The steer tube is only so long. If you add a bunch of spacers under the stem you may not be left with enough steer tube to clamp the stem onto safely.

There's nothing functionally wrong with a stem that's angled up. Many stems even have the logos printed on them both ways, so neither way looks upside-down.

Occasionally, you may even see a pro whose stem points upward. This was Floyd Landis' bike.

Whether the stem is up/down or you are using the spacers, the handle bar height is what you are looking for. Seems to me that putting a few spacers under the bars is easier, quicker and will give you the results that you seek.
Maybe you are just over-thinking this problem a bit, an engineer's curse (I am an Engineer too)

You need to raise the handlebar height for comfort.
To do that, you want to remove spacers and flip the stem to effectively get the same bar height as before?

Did I read this correctly? If so, it makes 0 sense. If i didnt read it correctly, apologies as I really tried to understand your path of thinking.

How I read this post, my response is- who cares if spacers can be removed, that wont solve your issue. You need higher handlebars for a more upright riding position. Get a new stem thats +17 rise or more. Perhaps get a shorter stem too. Those 2 changes will effectively make the riding position more relaxed and upright.

An uncut tube, available spacers, and the stem pointing down... gives every buyer all their options. Flipping the stem (to raise the bars more), or cutting the tube and removing spacers (to lower the bar) are all appropriate options.

You can also look at new/replacement stems with a greater rise. And/or a shorter stem to help set you up a little.

I run the step flipped on my Charge Plug.

The reach will be different due to the HT angle. Also depending on the stem angle which might mitigate it. That's probably not an issue though (for sure not for me).

That stock position - spacers offset by stem flipped down - seems to be neutral position that most 'bell curve' folks would find comfortable. From there, you can raise (flip stem up) OR lower (swap spacers to top) to accommodate the 'tail' folks.

(edit: what Dave Cutter said)

I think OP is trying to raise his bars to accommodate an aging back. If (1) you're keeping the same bike, and (2) the steerer was cut so there was only room for a 5 mm spacer, then adding spacers isn't an option.


With modern 4-bolt faceplate stems, flipping the stem is eminently reasonable.


If there's not too much difference in bar height, 10 minutes in the garage/shop and you're done. You may need to recable, especially the front brake, if there's a significant change.


There will be no difference in handling for a given bar height how you get there. If some young sprout tries to give you grief over style points, well, this is a good chance to practice kiddy put-downs for when you get even older!

Can you post a picture, please?


I recently ordered a longer quill/stem for essentially this same reason. The stock quill/stem was very short. The 250mm quill/stem length will give me about an additional 110mm to raise up, which is substantial.

Flipping the stem raises the bars, obviously, and also moves them a bit closer. An engineer shouldn't have too much trouble with any of this.

Buying a 45 degree up angled threadless stem may be what you need.

I realize a longer stem will be required for a flipped up stem to equal the reach of a stem that is flipped down - raising a handlebar 5cm would affect reach enough that a longer stem may be in order as well, so I'm happy to buy a new one. This is more just a commentary on form over function that most people seem to observe.

I see nothing wrong with your engineering logic.

A slammed upwards pointing stem probably looks better than a normal stem with 2 inches of spacers too.

I think many new bikes come out of box with a lot of spacers simply for the adjustability it provides.

I agree. I'm not a mechanical engineer, but those kind of inefficiencies catch my eye and I think "why did they do that?"

This, simply.

The sellers tilt the stem down for that "racy" look, and add the spacers because so few riders can really ride a slammed stem.

You know about the "Post pics or we hunt you down" rule, right?

Be carefull there. Reach numbers will likely need to decrease as height increases. As you transition your torso to a more upright position, your arms move rearward with it. And too great a reach can be one of the most back/neck/shoulder pain inducing fit problems. In my experience the discomfort factor of too much reach is amplified as torso positions move more upright. Some experimentation may be in order. Good luck with the bike and the lyme.

Since I think it is typical for frame manufacturers to specify max spacer stack, I assume there is concern about the bending moment at the upper headset bearing. That would argue for a slammed stem compensated for with a riser stem with length adjusted appropriately. I suppose it was standard on quill stems for the stem to be horizontal so this "look" has become somewhat a norm.

scott s.
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Your spot on, IMO. Less spacers and a positive angle stem should in theory (albeit minor) be a stiffer and lighter setup for the reasons you pointed out.....aesthetics aside

As far as 'better handling', generally speaking, lower is going to better.

I view bar height and reach in terms of location along the steerer tube centerline and horizontal. (Not right angles I know and that probably drives some nuts, but the fact was - before threadless steerers - racing bikes all had horizontal quill stems of increments of 1cm and could be raised or lowered along the steerer.)

I disagree fundamentally with squid puppet. I find that shoulder location is key torso comfort and position on the bike. I like a comfortable bend in my arm. That sets the distance from my shoulders to the HBs. But I can pivot my arms. In practice, I find little difference between my HBs higher and further forward or closer and down, as long as that distance to my shoulders is the same. Very conveniently (for me at least), along say 6" of that arc which is almost a straight line, the slope of that line is 2 cm horizontally by 1 cm along the steerer. Yes, a very bastardized measuring system, but for application to bicycles, very practical.

Now, as I get older (or if I want to set up a bike as a "comfort" bike, I just raise that line. The slope doesn't change. (Yes, as I rotate my whole position back for the comfort bike, the slope does change some, but the effect of the slope change over 6" is second order and I ignore it.)

It sounds like you want that line raised. Flipping the stem wil do that (unless it is a 0 degree stem (90 degrees from the steerer). Since we don't know what your stem angle is, speculation on the effect of flipping it is just that. A 5 degree stem would have a small change in reach and height, a 45 degree stem would have a radical change.

Ben

You might want to post a photo, but I'm confused by the talk of removing spacers. Unless you are going to cut the steerer tube, you'll need exactly the same amount of spacers, regardless of which way the stem is flipped. Rereading your original post, I think you know this, but some of the responses mention removing the spacer and flipping the stem, which doesn't make sense to me.

Flipping a stem should take you all of 5-10 minutes, so it's an easy thing to try (though I recommend a torque wrench). My wife's bike is a bit big for her, and she was too stretched out, so I flipped her stem. Easy peasy. Most people I see on road bikes have their stems in the 'happy' position. Who cares about style points if it's comfortable.

I think everyone here understood that he meant removing spacers from Under the bars.

Yup, and it seems like most 'off-the-rack' bikes have a couple of spacers to allow for final fit adjustments.
We both might be 5'-10" and ride 56cm Synapses, but my setup and yours might be significantly different. Having the spacers gives that adjustabliity, because once you cut the steerer tube, that's it, you can't make it longer.
(And, putting the spacers on top of the stem, just doesn't look right)

Flipping the stem, can do some funny things to the handling if it moves the bars too far back.
I flipped the stem on my Cannondale F-XXX to make it less aggressive, since i haven't raced XC for a long time.
A '90's East Coast woods XC hardtail, built for technical climbing, it ran with about 4" of drop.
Flipping the stem brought the bars up, but it also made them 'flop' rather than 'swing' from side to side, and it made the front wheel feel like it wanted to 'tuck under,' which was a little too exciting on a bike that already had a 'quick' front end.
It's a Headshock front end, so no spacers; I ended up flipping the stem back negative, and installing a riser bar.