Why "Groupset"?
#76
aka Tom Reingold




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From: New York, NY, and High Falls, NY, USA
Bikes: 1962 Rudge Sports, 1971 Raleigh Super Course, 1971 Raleigh Pro Track, 1974 Raleigh International, 1975 Viscount Fixie, 1982 McLean, 1996 Lemond (Ti), 2002 Burley Zydeco tandem
I may appear to be unaccepting of the fact that language evolves. There are a lot of changes I welcome. I accept even the changes I don't like. But I'm allowed to say which ones I like.
An example of a fairly recent idiom I love. When someone gives an opinion and then finishes with, "I'm just sayin'." I laugh, because it adds no meaning, but it's a form of emphasis.
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Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
Tom Reingold, tom@noglider.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog
“When man invented the bicycle he reached the peak of his attainments.” — Elizabeth West, US author
Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
#78
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It's from the same people that brought you "chai tea latte" or "tea with milk tea milk"
But I'm actually ok with groupset. Sounds vaguely British.
EDIT: As a bit of a word nerd, I delved further. While Newspapers.com is by no means definitive, looks like "groupset" first started being used in the 1980s in, as I had guessed, the UK.
But I'm actually ok with groupset. Sounds vaguely British.
EDIT: As a bit of a word nerd, I delved further. While Newspapers.com is by no means definitive, looks like "groupset" first started being used in the 1980s in, as I had guessed, the UK.
#79
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True, but there are definitions in addition to physics.
Heat Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster
Many definitions as above. Physics, noun, verb
Heat Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster
That's not a universally accepted definition of heat. Heat is commonly defined as a form of energy that is transferred between bodies at different temperatures, i.e heat is a thing that is transferred, not the transfer itself. With this definition, it's reasonable to use the term heat transfer. (I've never met a physicist that had a problem with the term.)
Last edited by Camilo; 06-29-24 at 02:37 PM.
#80
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#81
Randomhead
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From: Happy Valley, Pennsylvania
delay or hold back in terms of progress, development, or accomplishment.
"our progress was ******** by unforeseen difficulties"
"our progress was ******** by unforeseen difficulties"
#82
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Yes, but given that heat transfer refers to a thermodynamic process, the physics definition is the relevant definition. The definition normally used by physicists establishes heat as a form of energy, i.e. a noun. Thus, heat transfer is a valid term in physics, and is used extensively.
Back to the discussion at hand. I refer to my furnace, ductwork, registers and thermostats as my "heatset".
#83
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That's not a universally accepted definition of heat. Heat is commonly defined as a form of energy that is transferred between bodies at different temperatures, i.e heat is a thing that is transferred, not the transfer itself. With this definition, it's reasonable to use the term heat transfer. (I've never met a physicist that had a problem with the term.)
Yes, but given that heat transfer refers to a thermodynamic process, the physics definition is the relevant definition. The definition normally used by physicists establishes heat as a form of energy, i.e. a noun. Thus, heat transfer is a valid term in physics, and is used extensively.
Still, that was a better class title than one called "Lumped Parameter Linear Systems" (me: "I have no idea what this class is about"), where, fortunately, in the first five minutes, the professor explained what the class is about, in very clear terms, and I did great in the class.
#84
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If you're discussing a term that's used in physics, in the context of physics, the physics definition is all that really matters.
#85
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Perhaps, but the definition I noted was expounded in day one of Fluid Dynamics and Heat Transfer by the professor (who I also took for thermodynamics). I've got game in those subjects but they were not my primary area of specialization in industry, so given that prof had a PhD and was a specialist in that area, I accepted his word for it. He didn't harp on it, but just pointed out with amusement, that, despite (in his words) the wrong term used in the actual title of the class, because that is most person's perception of it, that it's actually a redundancy in terms, or as I like to say, repetitively redundant.
#86
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I'd say that professor was in the minority among physicists regarding the phrase, and the fact that his Physics Department had no qualms using it in the title of the class is a pretty clear indication of that. Personally, I've never heard another physicist take issue with the term.
IIRC, I think the point he was trying to make, is that if you have a temperature differential, you will automatically have heat, i.e., the transfer of thermal energy.
Which can get a little confusing when someone mentions a HEAT round, which does involve liquid copper, but stands for High-Explosive Anti-Tank, essentially a version of a shaped-charge.
Last edited by Duragrouch; 06-29-24 at 06:02 PM.
#88
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IIRC, I think the point he was trying to make, is that if you have a temperature differential, you will automatically have heat, i.e., the transfer of thermal energy.
#89
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Regardless, the department that he was in clearly had no qualms about using the term in the title of the course.
Again, you and your professor are using a definition of heat that is not the widely accepted definition. Heat is generally defined as a form of energy, and that energy can be transferred from one location to another when a difference in temperature exists. That transfer of heat is called ... heat transfer.
Again, you and your professor are using a definition of heat that is not the widely accepted definition. Heat is generally defined as a form of energy, and that energy can be transferred from one location to another when a difference in temperature exists. That transfer of heat is called ... heat transfer.
#90
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Correct usage of an accepted term was a concession to job interviewers? That's just silly.
#91
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Last edited by Duragrouch; 06-29-24 at 08:58 PM.
#93
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I rode a 'Dale at the time so saw the sponsorship, but it wasn't until a few seconds ago that I learned what Saeco actually produces. That kind of stuff was totally off my radar at the time, plus no interwebby access to look up instantly. These days I could appreciate it, though I still go low-tech old-school, rather than press a button.
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#95
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You're really reaching on this one. Heat transfer is proper terminology -- it appears in the title of virtually every textbook on the subject and in the title of college courses because it's proper terminology. Your idea that the term is used for the benefit of job recruiters is laughable.
Looking now, that other class is no longer Lumped Parameter Linear Systems, but now Signals and Systems.
Last edited by Duragrouch; 06-29-24 at 10:40 PM.
#96
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Everybody has to be sick of this by now, so I'm done.
#97
Randomhead
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Professors can be weird. My heat transfer professor was, but not weird enough to try to say the name of the course was incorrect. My favorite thing he did was cut and past 4 problems from exams and put them together for the final. And back then, it was literal cut and past because you had to use a mimeograph machine to print the tests. So you could see the lines from where the cuts were. He also got fired after that term, which is a trick for a tenured professor.
I always tried not to be too weird. But I am afraid to go look at my page on "rate my professor."
I always tried not to be too weird. But I am afraid to go look at my page on "rate my professor."
#98
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I wasn't aware that the discussion was specifically about physics. Plus, you said "by definition" which, although true, is not the only definition. You might have said "to physicists it is defined as..." But that's enough for me. I hope to adhere to my 2 comment argument rule.
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