You and Ziemas are both wrong, it does happen in the real world and is on the increase, in fact in Japan it has sharply increased. Problem is you guys live in the make pretend world that nothing bad is going to happen because you locked your bike up with this or that lock. Fact is that picking is slowly becoming the way to steal bikes because the locks made today have become more and more difficult to break without a sizeable tool that will make a thief stand out. All one has to do is to use their brain as to what a pro thief is going to start doing, It's just as easy, if not easier and at least way cheaper, to learn to pick locks as to carry an assortment of lock destroyers to cover whatever they'll encounter.

https://www.kisia.or.kr/new/korean/su...9&sn=27&page=2

^^^^

No, I live in the real world of locking up in a major urban city center every day, not fantasizing about 'what ifs' on the internet from the safety of my bunker. Where's the proof of high end locking being picked with regularity in the real world? Certainly not in the bizarre link to an article you posted entitled 'Outlook For Asia Security Market in 2003'. What does that article have to do with bicycle security? Are you going to get one of the Explosive Detectors mentioned for your bike?





Your paranoid posts do a disservice to uninformed people looking for information on bicycle security. Maybe you need another layer of tinfoil.....

Ziemas, unfortunately in London bike locks being picked isn't that uncommon. Here amateurs strip bikes of parts overnight and pro's can go through most locks in a minute.

At my workplace we have several clips of security footage showing it happening including one where the guy turned up in cycling gear, climbed over the wall to the bike cage unpicked the bikes lock and left (bike cage has a twist opening inside, swipecard outside) all within 3 minutes. I believe that was a Kryptonite New Yorker...

I just use my lock to meet the needs of my insurance policy, if a good theif wants my bike they're going to get it whatever I do (if it's in the open).

Still, a good lock will mean there are easier targets than you so definitely still worth it. Rule is - keep the bike indoors overnight and lock up well to stop opportunists when you're out.

Where are the documented reports of this happening? There are plenty of documented reports of all manor of locks being defeated by all manner of tools, yet I've never heard of a high end one with a flat key cylinder being picked. Where's the proof?

Do you really expect me to believe that bicycle thieves are defeating electronic swipe card entrance systems and high end locks to steal a bicycle? Anyone with those skills would be after something a lot more valuable then what they could flog at Brick Lane for a few hundred.

The folks who claim that it is "easy" to open a top of the line Abus, OnGuard, or Kryptonite lock, have never personally done so, or they are simply lying...opening the best locks from those companies takes a good deal of time, skills, expensive tools, and experience.

In the "real" world, crooks develop an aversion to spending time in jail. So, when they steal bikes, they target bikes using cable locks, and the $5 chain locks and $10 u-locks sold at Wal-Mart. Such locks can be opened in five or ten seconds.

In contrast, a skilled crook, with expensive tools, and lots and lots of practice, is going to need five or ten minutes to open a top quality lock...a time span that permits an on-looker to call the police or the owner of the bike to return, ballbat in hand...

But, I would not lock a Trek Madone to the same post for eight hours a day, five days a week. If a crook sees that an expensive bike is at the same location everyday, all day, sooner or later, he may be tempted to take the risk and invest the time and effort to steal that bike. The owner of that bike may not lose it the first month, or the second month, but eventually...

Folks who must leave their bike locked out of their sight for more than an hour or two in an urban location need to have a "trashmo" bike...a bike that is too old or too ugly to steal, yet rides as nicely as their best bike.

My favorite "trashmo" bike was a 1984ish Trek with a pro quality frame and fork, and pro quality wheels. A previous owner had spray-canned it an ugly green, and it had big dents, and lots of surface rust. It looked like it was worth $5, yet it rode as well as a new bike costing $1,000....great to ride, but no chance of it ever being stolen.

Right, so a crook is only going to steal bikes locked with $5 chain or cable locks or $10 U locks...where do you come from Mars? The only bikes I see locked up with locks like that are cheap ashe Walmart bikes that some 8 year old rides to school on. So a "professional" bike hacker is going to hock that bike he risked going to jail on for $5? Are you out of your mind?

And no, most locks can be defeated in less then 2 minutes by mechanical means, not picking. However with different locks on the market it now takes about 4 or 5, maybe more different types of tools to break a lock with the most effective tool being a tiny hydraulic jacks that pops the most expensive U-bolt lock like it was made of cardboard. but these tools are expensive, make noise, and cumbersome to carry around while trying to go undetected. This is why picking has increased in Japan and Europe.

Here's a web site to tell you how to break a Krypto lock rather quickly: https://www.totse.com/en/bad_ideas/sc.../takebike.html

Here's more for the doubtful: https://www.wired.com/wired/archive/1...ckbusters.html

You want documented reports, I gave you one site for Japan. I can't even find documented reports on the internet about bike locks being broken no alone picked!

freako, what is your problem?

At least for Sweden, almost all stolen bikes were either not locked at all, locked with a cheap cable lock, locked only to themselves (good lock or bad doesn't matter much in that situation) or locked with a good lock to something that was easy to cut (thin wire fence, for example). The number of thefts here of bikes locked to a secure bike stand with a hardened steel D-lock is vanishingly small. Most of those cases were bikes locked in secluded places during the night, and the typical method of breaking the locks is by either cutting through it with power tools or using a hydraulic jack.

The number of bike thefts where locks have been picked is so low that it's not in the statistics.

Maybe it's different where you live.

You do realize that the post about breaking U-locks is ancient and deals with cylinder locks that most major lock makers no longer use, don't you?

No one has doubted that lock can be picked; anything that a man can design another man can defeat, the question is does it happen in the real world? The answer is that bike thieves don't pick locks in the real world, they break them or cut them.

BTW, I'm in Europe and can tell you as CdCf did that most bike thefts are a crime of opportunity, the bikes were locked improperly or the bikes were locked with a low end lock. The same held true when I lived in the States, Canada, and Australia.

You seem to be a prisoner of the 'what ifs' and 'worst case scenarios' that are running around in your head. Those are the locks you should be concerned about defeating. Good luck breaking free.

the makers might not use that style anymore, but millions of bike riders still own and use those locks.

Where do you often see locks from the mid-1990s being used? Thieves are going to use techniques to break the latest in locks, which I'm sure will also be able to defeat 10 year old locks. It's a non-issue really.

all over the country. Not everyone buys a new lock every month. Msot people use the same lock they bought when they bought the bike years ago. Hell, i still have Kryptos massive wide (10" wide x 14" long) Ulock form the LATE 80's.

Many, many people returned their Kryptonite locks for new one during the much publicized return offer. Also, the folks who use old locks aren't the same folks riding high-end bikes and locking them up everyday; there are plenty of newer bikes locked up with low end locks for thieves to steal.

Do you still use your ancient lock to lock up your bike in high crime areas?

seeing as i posted a thread about the class action lawsuit against Krypto, and seeing as i'm a interviewed witness in said case, no i dont lock up my bikes in high crime areas with my old locks. I use them for non cycling stuff like my mower or other garden stuff. however you are simply going to have to accept that there are still millions of people using the old locks. I dont know of too many people int he General population OTHER than hardcore cyclists that routinely buy new locks whenever a new design comes out.

So it's people riding low value bikes that don't ride them often which are using older locks. Doesn't sound like a major theft risk to me.

ANY bike is at risk for theft! curious as to where you live.....because here in Vancouver even cheap azz bum bikes get stolen.....

Just as it says under my name, Riga, Latvia, although I have lived all over the world.

Professional bike thieves (the topic of this discussion) aren't stealing bum bikes, junkies are.

we have about 95% junkies here, 5% pro thieves. , i missed the "pro bike thieves" part of the thread, going back now to read.

cheers.

I think it's pretty clear through context with all the talk of high-end locks being picked and swipe card doors being bypassed that we're not talking about tweekers with a prybar.

Hi everyone

interesting thread

Can you specialists please review these two locks, they are the most expensive ones which I can afford on a very stretched budget

U lock
https://www.evanscycles.com/product.jsp?style=12366

Chain lock (Is this easy to pick? )
https://www.evanscycles.com/product.jsp?style=11053



I will leave the chain at my workplace and carry the U Lock around with a long Kryptonite Kryptoflex 7ft to secure the wheels.

^^^^

I posted in the thread you started. Check out what I had to say there.

You right!

But that wasn't my arguement. My arguement was whether or not a decent lock and be overcomed and the methods use, to which I replied picking is increasing as the method of choice because breaking locks have become increasingly difficult; although if you looked at my above web sites, one of them tells you how you can easily break an expensive U-Lock from Kryto. And I mentioned the hydraulic jack situation as well.

Most people buy inexpensive locks thinking no one will steal their bikes, or lock the bike up improperly; but it only takes one time before they learn their lesson!

I ride my bikes to sort of places all the time and only lock them with a Abus lock and a thick cable...THAT'S IT!!! But, I park and lock the bikes in very high traffic areas and only in daylight and never had a bike stolen in over 40 years of doing this. I did have a bike stolen once when someone broke into my house through a window about 20 years ago but that's not really the same issue.

That cable and Abus lock I have is over 30 years old; but I don't have the need for a better lock...just as most people don't either.

I brought my lock in the early 90s. One of the keys wore out from being in my pocket all the time but the lock works about as well as it did the day I brought it. They are not delicate instruments they are designed after all to prevent someone taking what they are locked to. I wouldn't be surprised if it was still working fine after 50 years.

If you keep it reasonably dry and give it a bit of lubrication there is no reason a lock couldn't be a once in a lifetime purchase for many cyclists.

Most of the locks I see are reasonably old. Most people couldn't care less about lock technology and don't want to think about their bike getting stolen.

I doubt many such people will make themselves known here because these threads just quickly descend into a pissing contest. Always the same few people trying to shout louder than everybody else because their view is the correct one. I think most of them like to hear the sound of their own voice more than they have any expertise with locks, after all how many saw the bic pen issue coming?

The link on how to pick a U-lock is ancient and totally useless today. Thieves break locks using brute force, not picking, is my my point.

locks do get picked though, you cannot deny that.