EricDJ

I had never heard about this until the recall notice came out. My bike was stolen 2 years ago off my balcony. Balcony bars were never cut, yet the Krypto locks were gone. Luckily after two years now, I saw someone riding my bike and had the police impound it so I could get the receipt from home with serial. I sold the bike on ebay. I used two locks. A u lock and a cable one from Krypto. One can be cut we know.

Luckily I got the bike back in good shape to recover some expenses. But I still lost 2 locks and my lighting. Real shame. I've been using Krypto since 89 with my first nice mountain bike. Have owned a couple of U locks of theirs and still have a coiled lock. Hard to feel safe now.

I have a new Airborne and haven't gotten new locks. I won't be leaving it outside when coming in for a second. I may have part of one of my U locks around here somewhere, reason I had to buy a second one was that the first ones U part fell down a long drop when I was unlocking it from a rail. Not worth risking deat to get it back.

Raiyn

Just clicked over a half million views

[bEn]

Thats got to be the biggest thread right? Well the most "viewed".

sicknick_21

k thanks for the info

JohnZ

I just rode my new Giant FCR4 to the drugstore to buy my wife an anniversary card. I locked the bike up to the bike rack with a Kryptonite mini U-lock (evolution, I think). I went in to the store for 10 minutes max. When I came out, I could not open the lock! I could turn it half way, but not all the way. I walked the 4 miles home, got my car, drove to the office where I had the extra keys.

The extra keys did not work either. Now, I am waiting for a locksmith to arrive, and he says the lock will be destroyed by his drilling, and it will cost me $75 minimum!

Needless to say, I am furious. The u-lock was fairly new (3 weeks), and had worked fine on previous occasions. I checked the inside for tampering and found no evidence.

I will never buy another kryptonite product again. Hopefully they will refund the cost of the lock and the locksmith. I'll let you know how this turns out. At least I got the anniversary card...

alanbikehouston

You don't need a locksmith. You simply need to understand the new flat key mechanism used by BOTH OnGuard and Kryptonite on their 2005 model U-locks. The keyway where you insert the key has rotating plates. If someone tries to pick the lock, the plates rotate and make picking more difficult.

However, if you are inserting the key, and begin to turn the key before the key has passed the bottom plate, the plates rotate, and the lock refuses to open. You can also turn the plates by turning the key slightly as you withdraw the key from the keyway.

Both OnGuard and Kryptonite place a red warning sticker on their 2005 locks, warning owners to insert the key fully before beginning to turn the key. However, until you "play around" with the lock a bit, you won't understand how to prevent accidently plate rotation, or how to cure it.

If all of the plates are aligned correctly, when you look into the keyway you will see a rectangular open box with smooth sides that extends to the bottom of the crossbar. If a plate has rotated out of place, you will see a jagged edge along one side of the keyway.

The solution sounds complicated, but takes just five or ten seconds after you have practiced. You take the tip of the key and gently rotate the top plate so it is perfectly aligned with the second plate. Then you stick the key a bit deeper, and rotate the second plate so that it is perfectly aligned with the third plate. Then do the fourth plate, and the fifth plate. When all of the plates are aligned, the key turns very easily. If the key resists turning, or you must use force to turn the key: STOP...the key is NOT at the bottom of the keyway, and you will break the key.

When I got my first "flat key" locks, I accidently jammed them a couple of times. After I discover HOW I was jamming them, and realigned the plates, I've never had the slightest problem. Just work the key ALL the way to the bottom and turn the key lightly and the lock pops open.

Any COMPETENT locksmith understands locks with rotating plate lock mechanisms, and knows how to realign the rotating plates in just a few seconds. If your locksmith damaged your lock while opening it, he is either a crook or a moron, and he should refund his fee and buy you a new lock.

Brian

$75 minimum? Can you offer some sketchy character $20 to open it? Gotta be some thief lurking nearby. By the way, how can you be online and waiting for the locksmith at the same time?

JohnZ

(During previous post, I was on my computer at home, waiting for the locksmith to tell me that he was nearby. When he did, I drove to the bike to meet him.)

Anyhow, he had to cut through the bike rack, take the bike back to his shop, and slice through the lock. He charged me $85. I'm going to talk to the bike rack owner tomorrow.

Hope you have better luck with your Kryptonite U-lock than I did.

alanbikehouston

There is NO luck involved with opening the new lock designs from both OnGuard and Kryptonite. Simply read the instructions that come with the lock. If you begin to turn the key before the key is firmly pressed against the bottom of the keyway, you will move some of the rotating "anti-pick" plates. The lock won't open.

Just take the tip of your key, and align each rotating plate with the plate below it. That takes less than ten seconds. Insert the key to the bottom of the keyway, and the key will turn easily and the lock opens.

If your locksmith did not recognize this was a rotating plate lock mechanism he is an idiot. If he DID recognize it, and then used cutting tools to remove the lock, he is a thief. Either way, Mr. Locksmith owes you a new bike lock. Cut the rack? In my city, if the locksmith cut a rack without the permission of the rack's owner, he would be arrested.

Where the heck did you find "Bozo the Locksmith"?

belfast-biker

I have to concur - I had a problem with my newly replaced Evolution, did exactly what bozo's customer had done, put it in, not all the way, turned, no joy, spent the next minute trying to open lock, cursing.

Finally took a breath, jammed it firmly in all the way, wiggled, and it turned.


Shoulda called it the Kryptonite Woman™.

But now that I know how to handle her, um, it, there won't be any problems from here on.

Inoplanetyanin

I see that a lot of people still believe in chains here, for that matter in U-locks!

All of those can be easily cut with new bolt cutters!

While looking at chains in home depot, I was able to easily cut a finger thick chain! The U-lock is the same thing.

Best choice seems to be a u-lock with combination joint lock. The secret is to have it of bigger diametr than bolt cutters can grab!

Oh, and I also use of these

belfast-biker

I doubt my Abus Granit (12mm hexagonal hardened to the core, none of this case hardened nonsense) chain and lock could be "easily cut", especially as I've inter-twined it with as thick a rope as I could fit through the links, purely to jam boltcutters.

That said, it's heavy at about a stone, so I use it on the bike only when I don't have my new Kyrptonite Evolution. It's more of a motorbike/scooter lock.

Everything in bikes is a trade between weight and strength - nothing will withstand all attacks, not even whatever solution you were touting,

But a non-cheap lock from a decent company will put 90% of thefts off, since most bike thefts are by opportunistic non-professionals.

Anyhow, there exists a chain that IS resistant to all known bolt cutters - the 16mm *****. You'd need a stihl saw or lots of cutting discs and time with an angle ginder with a mains power source or a few spare batteries.

Apparently a bit on the lardy side though - when at 14kg, the lock weighs more than the bike you have to start asking yourself questions.

Inoplanetyanin

Just out of curiousity, check try those bolt cutters in Home Deppot. You will be surprized how thick of a steel they can cut.

alanbikehouston

There is simply zero need to "guess" which locks actually defeat crooks. "Cycling Plus" has published three major lock tests in the past eighteen months. And, test results are available on-line from Soldsecure.com...the locks that earned their "gold" rating really do work.

There are chain locks that work as well as U-locks...but the best chain locks weigh ten to fourteen pounds, compared with three pounds to five pounds for the best u-locks.

Locks with outstanding test results include:

- the Abus Granit 54 u-lock

- the Kryptonite New York 3000 u-lock

- the OnGuard Brute u-lock

- the Abus Granit chain with Abus Granit padlock

- the OnGuard Beast chain and padlock

- the Kryptonite New York chain and disc lock

- the Kryptonite Fahgettaboudit chain IF (and ONLY if) combined with a better padlock, such as the Abus Granit padlock


If someone wants to open a "gold" rated lock, they will need to bring power tools, be willing to make a LOT of noise, and have lots and lots of time and patience.

brokenrobot

Not a question of size so much as hardness. Good U-locks are built with metal of a hardness equal to the blades on those cutters... hardware store chain is made from much softer steel. Can't use a cutter on steel that's as hard or harder than its blades...

Inoplanetyanin

Think about this:

Take a newspaper and fold it many time untill it has a hard edge (angle). You can puncture thick layers of flat newspapers, even though they are of the same material.

It's all about mechanical advantage, surface and force per unit of area.

As long as they can grab around the chain or a u-lock, they can cut through it. If it was titanium or dimond, I don't know... but steel...

belfast-biker

I'm pretty sure your post about newspapers is irrelevant, and the previous posts about hardness and cycling plus tests aren't.

Inoplanetyanin

What's your "pretty sure" based on?

belfast-biker

I'm pretty sure your post is irrelevant coz it involves paper, and I'm pretty sure the previous posts about hardness and cycling plus tests aren't irrelevant because they're about steel hardness and bike lock tests respectively.

v1nce

Allright i read up untill page 13 or so and then called it quits. In case people are still looking for good affordable locks, I say Abus Steel-O-Chain 810 in combo with Axa SL-7. If you want to know why check my other post below (Post nr 25 in the thread). But some of the reasons: stronger, lighter, cheaper and more versatile than any KryptoCrap.

I never understood why people used those Krypto locks even before the Bic debacle, i guess it is probably to do with availability. I am lucky the locks i use are easily and cheaply purchased where i live.

https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...light=Axa+Sl-7

Good Luck!

snoopydoopydoo

what about the warranties on those krypto locks where if your bike gets stolen as the result of the lock, they will reimburst the value of your bike up to $2000, do they actually do that?

Inoplanetyanin

Paper or another material, it doesn't matter. What matters is that material is the same while area of force application varies.

Bolt cutter's blades are made of some of the hardest materials by definition. Price of bolt cutter (50$ and more is another evidence for that).

Just as with folder paper you can puncture flat paper sheet because force is concentrated on a small surface area, same with blades, they apply huge amount of force on a little surface and with materials being of the same hardness - IT CUTS THROUGH.

How do you interper the results of those tests? That there are uncuttable u-locks?

I think it's merely that some are harder to cut than others.

v1nce

Well, the main locks i linked to in my previous post was tested extensively with the very best bolt cutter. The Rockwell hardness of the links exceeded that of the cutter by far. The amount of pressure (in KiloNewton) needed to cut the links (and that's IF the boltcutter had been harder) exceeded the amount that would be needed to cut the links as well... So,... although nothing is uncuttable in theory (diamond tipped boltcutter ha ha) for all intents and practical purposes the lock i employ is uncuttable according to a controlled test.

So i have to disagree...

belfast-biker

What?!? But how can you argue against the super scientific paper study above?!?

You're talking about steel, but this study is paper, goddammit! Can't you see how much more relevant paper is?

alanbikehouston

Some people like to waste "bandwidth" with their "guesses" about which bike locks are the toughest to defeat. No need to guess. Results of tests by the ART Foundation and Soldsecure are available on-line. "Cycling Plus" publishes test results once or twice a year.

And, the same locks consistently get the highest ratings in actual tests against the tools "real world" crooks use. The Kryptonite New York 3000 U-lock. The OnGuard Brute U-lock. The best Abus U-locks. The best Kryptonite chains. The best OnGuard chains. The best Abus chains.

Simply select a "Gold" rated lock from the list at:

www.soldsecure.com/Leisure.htm


Crooks are not interested in attacking "Gold" rated locks. On a college campus, out of ten bikes at a rack, seven or eight have cheapo locks (cable locks, five dollar chains, and Wal-Mart U-locks) that can be opened in ten or twenty seconds. Crooks are not gonna waste ten minutes attacking a real lock when they could steal twenty bikes with crummy locks with the same effort.