FWIW, for roadies I would say its absolutely a question about effectiveness. And its rather simple: to pull up at the same time as you push down enables the rider to use both legs at the same time. Less fatigue on both legs actually. FWIW, I never met any serious rides with a different opinion on that subject. Keeping your feet in one place? Then you need nothing at all I would say...except pedals.

It's actually after you've ridden for quite a bit longer that the falls can come. At first, you are so focused on unclipping and not falling. After 2-3 months, it becomes second nature...almost! At that point, you're thinking about what to make for dinner that night, you come to an intersection and have to stop suddenly, forget about unclipping and BAM! over you go.

One thing I have learned the hard way...If another vehicle is already stopped at a 4 way stop...DO NOT try to avoid clipping out by creeping super slow to your stop sign while waiting for the car to go! CLIP OUT!!! I have been that lazy ass who stays clipped in, and the commuter freaked out like I was an alien or something and braked right in the intersection-even though I was probably 10 feet from my stop sign doing negative 2 miles an hour! I was on a downward slope to my right and had to do the silliest of movements to click out towards the incline as to not fall down the bank...Somehow I managed to crack my knee into my top tube when pulling my leg up and it hurt like hell and it was totally AWKWARD!

All too true. Even worse, I admit of still doing it. Creeping and awaiting the right moment to fire away. Really, really stupid.

I don't know who these "serious" riders are that you know but what you, and apparently they, are saying is just plain wrong. Just do a simple Google search on the mechanics of pedalling. There are a ton of references and articles resulting from in depth testing. This is not my personal opinion, it is a fact based on biomechanics and the laws of physics. Lance Armstrong's own trainer (C, Carmichael) was one of the preeminent trainers who recognized and proved via testing that "pulling up" on the upstroke was not only fruitless, but detrimental. But believe whatever you want. I mean FWIW, some people still think Elvis is alive.

https://thesportfactory.com/site/trai...iency_44.shtml

It is easier to do what he's describing when you are clipped in. It is not impossible to do it with platforms, just less efficient. Forgive me for previously describing this as 'mixing with your feet'.

FWIW, I got clipless to replace my antiquated system for foot retention (toe clips). I did not get it for more power (though I notice I go faster with clipless), I got it for foot retention.

Aren't you young to have your feet fall off? For 41 years, mine have remained rigidly attached.

I lol'd.

I had an awful mental picture of one of your feet popping off and bouncing down the road. At least with clipless, you can find it attached to your crank.

That is one facet of pedalling that some espouse, but it is not universally accepted amoung biomechanical specialists as providing great benefit, ie, the backstroke. Testing has not borne it out conclusively. The biggest benefit to efficiency is unweighting the foot/leg on the upstroke (but not pulling). The backstroke proponents believe that poo wiping, as Lemond describes it, contributes to this. But you do not need clip-ins to do it anyway. The vast majority of cyclists, including myself (most definetly) and probably everyone on this board, don't have great pedalling form at any rate, clip-ins or not. Great pedalling efficiency is not easy and many top level pros struggle with it.

But this was never the question as I believe pulling up on the upstroke was the question, or issue, or questionable practice, or whatever... I never said that clip-ins did not provide any benefits.

Toe cups



Will keep your feet on the pedal. Stick in any footwear you like. They'll accept anything from sandals to boots (within reason). Getting out is easy. Anyway but forward will get you out. Only $6 a pair. The only downside is having to do the 'flip'. You get used to that pretty quickly though.

If you're interested in foot retention, this should be your first port of call in my opinion.

I had toe clips, which I loved for the foot retention. But I hated actually having something on my feet. I love the feeling of the clipless system that I installed, as there is nothing to push down on my toes. If you had read the thread fully, you would have seen that I considered toe clips/cups.

Your suggestions are rather hilarious, but here goes;
FWIW, your kind of second-hand arguments absolutely suggests that Elvis is alive. I mean, theres departments and multi-million foundings that still thrive on that natures decline is natural. Your source means nothing to me. Join a local bike club, have a small talk with other riders. Riders who appreciate speed and effectiveness. Lets see what they think about your biomechanics. Having your feet fixated is just the side effect of wanting more pedalling power.
Anything else you´ve discoverd while you´re at it?

My comment wasn't aimed at you in particular. I just thought I'd chip in given that the thread was moving towards a discussion of the benefits of foot retention in general.

Second hand ?? .... OK, whatever .... LOL.

After 50 miles on clipless (25 more yesterday), I still haven not fallen. I almost fell yesterday, when I stopped behind a cyclist, and tried to pull my foot out of a (nonexistent) toe clip. when I pulled my foot up and backwards to get it out of the (nonexistent) toe clip, it just moved the pedal+crank, it would not let my foot go. I almost fell at this point, but there was a railing for me to hold on to. Had that railing not been there, I would have toppled over.