My SRAM X.7 has taken abuse in the form of me laying the bike down going 18 mph, pegging a rock with the derailluer, and the hanger bent, not the derailluer itself. They are bombproof. I have never used a real Shimano system (Altus doesn't count), but from what I have seen and heard about, they are not that tough.

I have in the past ripped apart a Sram Derailleur. Remember the 9.0sl with the Grilion (plastic parts)? I picked up a stick and ripped the lower part of swing link right off the link plates.

It's not really fair or accurate to say how strong a derailleur is when getting ripped off by a rock.

Both companies make solid and strong components.

It all boils down to preference.

thats right,

I've broken derailleurs from both companies. although I've yet to explain how the X.9 exploded during a race last year..
that one has me baffeled

I've snapped Shi*No chains at virgin links in the past, but I've never had a powerlink come undone, nor have I ever had a problem with snapping SRAM chains.

No sir, Flippy levers and Rapid Rise were solutions looking for a problem.

Actually Gripsh*tters were problems looking for a solution.

Amen brother!

I can't get used to jumping with gripshifts. I have a set on my hardtail and I'm constantly shifting gears.

The solution came in the form of their trigger system. Flippy levers suck period. Why do you think they still offer triggers? Why do you think that the Saint line is coming out with a trigger system for it's operation?
Never have, never will like flippy levers

actually, SAINT has the option of both flippy shifters and Triggers
as does XT, LX, and HONE.
The Triggers can be used on XTR as well.

The reason triggers are still around is due to stupid journalists claiming that the flippy shifter locked you in to a totally Shimano groupset.
This has never been the case since Shimano has never stopped making Trigger shifters. They have always been an option.

what they did not decide was how thye would market the trigger shifters. Fortunately the market spoke and now one XT level shifter will be available for all the groupsets. even the Deore shifter will be replaced by this unit because Deore will also get the Flippy's.

SHimano still offers the user the best choice throughout it's component range. You can integrate completely or just use bits. Only Saint has a truelly Integrated approach.
Hubs work with derailleur workd with disc rotors. You can still use any 1:2 ratio shifter you want and disc brakes that can accomodate 203mm rotors which are pretty much every FR disc brake sold today..

They're coming out with a SAINT specific trigger system. Up until then you have to use shifters from another group as there are no "SAINT" shifters

Raiyn has it right. the gripshifters are crap but folks need to get over them, trigger shifters are lightyears past . I can't say enough about them, plus they are far more cost efficient than shimano

Just completed our first ride after switching over from Shimano XTR Rapidfire shifting to SRAM X.0 Gripshift on our Ventana F/S off-road tandem... Amazing!

Our '98 Cannondale RT3000 hardtail tandem had the 8 speed GripShift model-du-jour as the OEM shifting system and they worked quite well. When I built our first Ventana El Conquistador de Montanas full-suspension tandem in '00 I started with XT 9 speed and quickly downgraded to XT 8 speed after we blew up the 9 speed chains and folded cassettes; regardless, the shifters worked just fine and the front derailleur shifting seemed more intuitive. When I built up our '02 Ventana ECdM I went with XTR 8 speed and while it too was fine and dandy, after a bout with tendonitis last winter, I found that my right thumb would go numb on technical stuff where lots of shifting was required. The numbness radiated into my entire right hand and made riding painful. Along the way, one of our road tandem friends and his wife were drawn into the off-road tandem thing and demo'd a Fandango hardtail from MTBTandems.com at Tsali, NC at an off-road tandem gathering that had the SRAM 9.0 Gripshifters and derailleurs. He was impressed by how well they worked which, given his background and experience in cycling and as a pro-wrench, was noteworthy. They ultimately bought the demo tandem, less a few parts that he didn't need, but kept the SRAM 9.0 Gripshift and RD because he liked it so much during the demo rides.

About two weeks ago I finally got fed-up with the hand numbness while riding some of the local trails and had my bike bud set me up with the SRAM X.0 grip shifters. Again, all I can say is WOW; what a difference. Replacing the thumb and index finger movements with a wrist rotation left me with no hand problems today whatsoever. Moreover, the shifting didn't need a single tweak and was as crisp and responsive as anything I've ever experienced on an off-road tandem or personal MTB. Durability will obviously be something I'll have to keep an eye on; only time will tell.

So, with respect to Gripshift, I think it's a personal decision that may be influenced by a lot of individual things, not the least of which is ergonomics. Given that I have small hands to begin with, the Gripshift is just a more user-friendly system for me particularly with the problems I've had in my right arm and hand.

Just something to consider...

Ask us again in a couple more years. Shimano has a great history that SRAM hasn't had time to build yet.

Yes the SAINT specific trigger is mechanically the same as the Generic triger they will have as an option for all groups. It will just have SAINT branding to match the Group.
Printing and and colour are easily changed in production to suit either SAINT, HONE, XTR, XT or LX, all of which currently have Flippy Shifters

Again you miss the point. They aren't going to sell a "SAINT" flippy lever they're deliberately skipping it.

because they wanted to establish what that market wanted first.
XTR or XT flippy shifters were always the recommended shifters for this group till the market told them what they wanted.

hence now FR's will get the branded Trigger

The one and only time they listened to the market rather than telling the market what they wanted. Go collect your check from Shimano Tim you've earned it.

ooooo, nasty - Get your handbag mate. Dawn you, me, top of Lady Liberty


First time they listened?

not actually.
The market wante 9 speed because roadies had it. So they got it and then complained that it did'nt last. Funny enough, the consumer also moaned when 7speed became 8speed...

Disc brakes, Shimano were not into disc brakes, the market wanted, the market received.

OEM's - Help us redduce the skill needed and time involved with assembling a bike. So they got Shimano Total Integration (STi) which culminated in the lastest Shimano components which brake shift levers (shipped as assembled units from the factory for OEM's - no assembly)

we wanted stiff and light cranks with BB's that last, so we got outboard bearings and still we moan..


perhaps it's just in our nature to moan...

I'm pretty sure this sums it up! But who's complaining? Oh yeah, we are!