I must be officially now the old boomer yelling get off my lawn because I've had it up to here with people (99% children) riding these 80 pound e-motos on the IHT and even the roads, terrorizing trail users and cyclists on the road. It seems I can't go for a ride without one of these nitwits buzzing me while riding way too close in the bike lane, or zipping down the IHT at me, or past me at speeds at least double the 15mph speed limit. Even when out walking, I've almost been hit crossing the street because a gang of these e-motos (which are relatively silent) traveling at vehicle speeds come flying out of nowhere. Does anyone know the laws regarding the use of these things? They are big enough, fast enough, and heavy enough to warrant an M1 endorsement on a CADL as far as I'm concerned. I don't know if that's the case, but there is ZERO enforcement of speed limits and the vehicle code from what I've seen. It's only going to get worse...I thought if my time was coming, it would be at the hands of a distracted or drunk driver, now it seems more likely I'll have an incident with one of these e-moto riding children who have very little sense.

I'll go shake my fist angrily at a cloud now.

Abusers of e-bikes, especially on sidewalks, are increasingly a menace to cyclists, pedestrians, motorists, and themselves - you know, pretty much everybody. You are not the only one who has this (well-justified) complaint. Kids are among the worst abusers (no kid under 16 should be allowed to ride any motorized vehicle capable of going over 15mph, no kid under 16 should allowed to ride any throttle-controlled motorized vehicle at all, and motorized vehicles should never - and I mean never - be permitted on a sidewalk unless expressly signed otherwise), but plenty of their elders are equally clueless. (I am not including motorized wheelchairs or similar mobility devices in this rant.)

In addition to the risk - and the increasing reality - of injuries caused by e-bike abusers, I fear there may be another bad result. The law (and I mean the Vehicle Code) has not caught up with e-bikes. There will be legislation proposed to deal with and regulate them. My fear is that the need to regulate two-wheeled e-bikes will lead to lumping other two-wheeled vehicles - i.e. regular bikes - in with any limiting regulations. Certainly, the bike-hating public (and we all know they are out there) will pressure their legislators to impose more limitations on bicycles as well as well as on e-bikes.

I do not think most people/drivers are bicycle-hating. I think it is small minority who are. I think the vast majority of people/drivers are bicycle-indifferent, with the next largest group being bicycle-friendly. But given a chance, the haters will be more vocal and more demanding. Having e-bike abusers pissing people off will give the bicycle haters an opportunity and excuse to go after us all well. I fear we may have to become more activist than we have been in the past to protect bicycle access that has been on the books since before we were born.

OP, I hope this Marin law starts a trend:
March 25, 2025. Marin County will soon become one of the first counties in California to regulate the use of electric bikes for children under 16.
https://www.ktvu.com/news/marin-coun...e-e-bikes-kids

The availability of low-cost Class 2 eBikes online is part of the problem. Furthermore, the parents purchasing, or allowing the purchase, of these Class 2 eBikes, for their children is also the problem. They are very uniformed of what they are actually buying!


Edit: I had to look up "IHT" to understand the reference in the original post. I figured it was a Multi-use Trail/Path. IHT = Iron Horse Trail in Concord, CA
https://www.ebparks.org/trails/interpark/iron-horse

There was a rather long evaluation study of ebikes on the Iron Horse and Canal Trails (both get used quite a bit for schools) - apparently they didn't find enough to worry about.

Advocacy groups are trying to get local laws banning them from areas where they've been a problem and limiting who can ride them (by age group).

What I see in the Sac region are motor-driven cycles operated (mostly adults) as ebikes, where they're clearly not allowed. They can be huge. Have yet to see any rules enforcement on our bike paths. Riders for the most don't show good bike handling and control skills, making them a de facto hazard. Dress goes from one extreme to the other: zero protective gear/full moto gear with fullface helmets. Boomboxes are popular.

Then there are whatever those one-wheel gizmos are. Ridden nearly universally by young dudes, again with full moto kits. I've paced some approaching 30.

E bikes under the legal definition have so many types and riders I don't find a predominant rider type, other than the Class 2 throttle bikes seem to attract the least-skilled riders. Lots have clearly been jail-broken past the 20 mph ceiling.

https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/handbo...cle-operation/

Here in SoCal the MUPS are notorious for all kinds of shenanigans including full scale dune buggies, gas mini-motorcycles and even cars and trucks using the MUPS as private roadways with LACo Public Works keeping open access gates. Once, I was even run off the LART by about 40 mini-motorcycles taking up the entire pavement playing chicken with oncoming cyclists. I gave up on the MUPS for the most part about 5 years ago. Just not worth the risk.

Don't blame you for being a bit angry. I wouldn't call it a "get off my lawn" stance. The traffic laws have effectively held this stance for decades. It's just newly applicable to e-Bikes that have become so popular.

Gross passing speeds and dangerous distances between passed lane occupants is criminal in every U.S. state where I've looked. It's a deadly threat, with motorized vehicles. And ugly incidents should be treated as such.

It's not as though such riders are completely unaware of the traffic laws. But with bikes it's not as though people go through a standardized and mandated training in order to operate the vehicles in public.

With the prevalence of cameras, including on-bike and on-vehicle cameras that owners are using, means that an increasing percentage of these types of riders will get caught and dealt with. Of course, bikes aren't required to have big, easily-recognized license plates, so it'll still be a crap shoot.

Don't know how to catch the worst of them. Hell, we've got all these motorcycle and car drivers who insist on traveling at insane speeds on public roads, and they've got plates that can be captured by cameras ... yet it still happens.

Wish there were easy solutions, here. Short of dedicated safe, wide, and speed-bump-infested bike lanes, I doubt there are many practical steps that can be taken.

I'm in So Cal, my local MUP is the Santa Ana River Trail and I stay off that on the weekends as there are e-bikes, e-scooters, gas-powered bicycles, 'TT' groups, pedestrians not aware of their surroundings or just ignoring others, just a mess of accidents waiting to happen. It'll only get worse as the school year ends and more people use it to get to the beach. Weekdays are a different matter and its a nice place to hammer out miles. Quite a few e-bikes and some scooters on weekdays, but they seem to be people heading to work and paying attention/respectful to those around them (similar with the pedal bicycle riders at that time); most of the pedestrians, dog walkers, and joggers seem to be cognizant of their surroundings, too.

I've got your solution in two words: Chuck Norris.

If only it were that simple. It never will be because the underlying problem isn't really the bikes (or A.I., or jet skis, etc. etc.), it's that there is an irreducible percentage of idiots who can't or simply won't consider how their actions affect others. The percentage is relatively constant, so the more people in a given area and the more people you encounter during a given activity, the more likely you are to encounter someone who behave like a jackass.

One of the things I drilled into my son when he was learning to drive is that every time he gets behind the wheel - Every. Single. Time - he will encounter at least one other person on the road (and usually several) who will do something unconscionably stupid that will put both my son and the idiot at risk, and it will be up to him to extract both himself and the idiot from the situation. It ain't fair, but it is the reality. I also figure that f I assume that everyone around me is trying to kill me - or is at least indifferent to the possibility - then I can only be pleasantly surprised when they don't.

They are all over in Briones, Quite the surprise when I am huffing up some steep incline on the gravel bike watching my HR going through the roof, and I hear a couple riders approaching from the rear talking in normal voices. Turn around only to see two guys on downhill/enduro e-bikes cruising up the hill w/full protective gear and full face helmets slung over their bars. A number of supporters will say it gets people on bikes that wouldn't be out there otherwise, I get that but I am seeing more new riders way into the interior of parks that likely wouldn't have the fitness to get out there w/o assistance and don't possess all the needed bike handling skills.

Its a shame isn’t it. We get out quite far to try and escape the other people and run across em not even carrying water and dressed like there walking the dog.

it's funny, a LOT of the more responsible (even if they're riding technically illegal vehicles) e-bike riders have these same sorts of complaints about road cyclists. they resist regulation on the power, weight, throttles of e-bikes by saying "roadies go far faster than 15/18/20 mph in packs without regard for other road or trail users.

we are in a grey period/zone where it's not clear if the right solution here is to regulate the vehicles, the use of them (with speed limits on bike lanes and all trails etc), or some combination of both. the problem with the latter is that it's pretty hard to enforce a comprehensive set of rules without some kind of licensing, registration, etc.

the are undoubtedly scofflaws out there, but i mostly see delivery riders/drivers in the city behaving badly with regard to sidewalks. i have ridden the IHT a few times and saw zero offensive behavior. i've ridden the mill valley - sausalito MUP hundreds of times and never had an e-bike/scooter/moped issue. the only issues i've ever had have been with dogs. i ride the shared paths in the city daily, in golden gate park and on the waterfront, and once had a close call with a onewheel rider and have had perhaps a dozen issues with dogs, leashed and off leashed. the only time i've ever been injured by another party while riding a bike was a dog that barrelled into me, off leash, at full speed on a shared path at crissy field. got pretty scraped up in the fall.

dogs are my pet peeve, it seems others are very vexed by "roadies," and still others believe they're under assault by e-bikes and scooters. is it possible we're all biased against "other" behavior or one type or another for unknown specific reasons?

It's every one's fault but mine. They can post a speed limit but nobody follows rules.

We have a stop sign on our corner. It may as well be removed.

Its selfishness.

Same thing around where I am, often. In the larger parks with miles-long MUPs in them, it can be very problematic, with a great percentage of users being the motorized/electrified-type cyclists.

Severe speed bumps can solve the speeding problem, more or less. If enough of them, and tall enough to matter for anyone traveling greater than the safe-and-sane speed for such paths.

At least they can provide a dramatic result for those preferring to run 2x+ the speed of other briskly-moving occupants of those MUPs and bike lanes. Not that it would feel like a good thing for those having to navigate up and over all those, I suppose, and not that a town/city would like the added cost of such. But it would sure get the attention of the idiots who insist on dangerous speeds through sections. (A bit like the tough bollards, which many run into due to speed/maneuvering problems they bring to such paths.)

Where I live, San Francisco East Bay, traffic enforcement is underwhelming, resulting in Rule of the Jungle on our streets.

If local law enforcement cannot stop the Stop Sign & Red Light Runners what hope do we have enforcement would improve the Scooter problem?

I know what you mean. Thoise Briones climbs are long and steep.

I'm in the west South Bay and most of the trails up here are Midpen which discourages eBikes, and that helps. Of course there are still eBikers on all of the trails.

Getting passed by eBikes can be a bummer. I try to be accepting and take some solace in the notion that I might be able to out-ride them. But that's a sort of crummy attitude, because that is all about the ego.

I like them when they are quiet and well maintained, and good looking machines. Some are pretty horrible though.

But the fact is, they are here to stay. I just deal with it.

I've been hearing reports of motorcyclists on our shiny new MUPs, with actual gas-powered Harleys. The last time, someone had to call the cops to get them to leave. Talk about entitled. At least the ones on e-motorbikes usually ride safely and don't speed.

Reading this thread almost makes me glad my town doesn't have bike trails.