I'm about to build up a road disc wheelset. I am considering trying tubeless but there is a "yuck" factor with the sealant. I worry about all the sticky build up on the inner rim that would have to somehow be removed when changing tires.
It seems that latex tubes would save some weight (over butyl) & permit slightly more supple ride (compared to butyl). They would require daily or every other day pumping. Not sure how this compares to tubeless.
What say ye?

Conti gp's or michelin power comps with latex are faster than anything tubeless, but with that setup you can still flat.

Reference?

There's not exactly a huge amount of testing on the current run of top tires, but Vittoria Corsa Speed tubeless seems extremely low-hysteresis in steel drum tests at least (i.e. bicyclerollingresistance).

Somewhat different benefits. If you're looking to just ride road, want something suppler than butyl, but don't want to deal with tubeless setup and sealant, then latex is a reasonable option. If you're looking for a more durable ride that can also be run at very low pressure (i.e. for gravel riding), latex tubes won't really bridge that gap.

If you go latex, the main thing is to be careful on the installation. Make sure the inside of your rim is free of abrasive stuff including bad edges on rim tape, and make extra sure to not pinch the tube between rim and tire when you inflate. Butyl nearly always "just works", whereas latex will seek out and find any installation issues. For this reason, I'd recommend still carrying a butyl as your spare tube.

Yes, tubed clinchers whether using butyl or latex are subject to pinch flats and puncture flats. Tubeless can't pinch flat and sealant prevents puncture flats.

The Michelin power is 9.1 watts at 18mph, does the Victoria beat that? I have no idea.

Again, reference?

X watts and Y speed doesn't mean anything without a heck of a lot of further context. Bicyclerollingresistance has the Vittoria at 7.7W at 18mph, but the comparison may not mean anything.

How so/or not?

You can't pinch a tube that doesn't exist.

You CAN cut the case between a sharp or high pressure road edge and a rim edge.

How often does that actually happen? Tons of people in the gravel and MTB communities run tubeless specifically because they can get away with super-low PSI across rough terrain without much trouble.

I once met someone who - no joke - rode his 23mm Conti 4 Seasons at about 30PSI. He said he experienced constant pinch flats. His tires were failing, but it wasn't from cuts; it was from the casing fabric fraying its way out through the sidewall rubber. It looked absolutely ridiculous, the tire sidewalls discolored and fuzzy all around. Otherwise the tire looked healthy.

You can pinch flat. That's why they make these. Granted, I think it would be pretty tough to do on a road bike.

I haven't ridden latex tubes, so I'm not sure how much smoother they roll. However, I do ride tubeless and the added flat protection is something that no other setup besides tire liners (which roll like ****) can match. I don't think the mess is anything to worry about. When I did my last tire change I just used Simple Green and an old toothbrush and everything was fine.

It does not happen that often as they are run with higher pressures / used on smoother roads.

MTB/gravel are not 23-25mm wide. That is a different tire/setup, and not a road setup.

Put 60PSI on a tubular vs 60 PSI on a tubeless (in a road tire) on a rough road and you would see different results. Just that - people don't do that for tubeless, while they do for tubulars.

To the OP, my son and I only ride latex tubes in clinchers for all but racing where he rides tubulars (I don't race).
They are noticeable .

I'm sorry but "yuck" factor? Come on guys, when you dismount a tubeless tire after some time you simply hose the tire and rim off. Yes there will be some left over sealant that has dried up usually around the bead but it comes right off with a sponge or brush. I think you'd be crazy not to at least try it.

While I'm certainly far from a tubeless hater, I can offer first hand experience that this statement is not true. I've done it. Impact was big enough that I'd thought I'd broken my wheel, but didn't. Classic snakebite, right through the tire carcass. Not sealed by sealant.

That'll teach penman to speak in absolutes!

That's not a classic snakebite. A classic snakebite only cuts the tube, not the tire. Cutting the tire against the rim requires an amount of force which-- surprise, surprise-- has nothing to due with the type of tube or the absence of one.

Saying tubeless tires pinch flat/snakebite only confuses the issues for those who do not know. I hope you stop saying it.

I'll be happy to stop saying it when you tell me what I should call it when the tubeless tire is punctured in the classic snakebite pattern.

Don't really get what you're saying with the "surprise, surprise" bit. This happened with a lot of force. There is no doubt a tubed tire would have pinch flatted in this instance too.

Whatever semantics aside, tubeless tires can pinch flat.

Lots of info here: Bicycle Rolling Resistance | Rolling Resistance Tests

Agreed.

Phrasing the issue as latex as a "cleaner alternative" to tubeless is utterly ridiculous for a number of reasons, not the least of which is that it misses the point of running either option.

Physical disabilities and bad decision-making aside, dealing with sealant is not yucky nor messy (and by 'dealing with' I mean installing, using, removing, cleaning up, etc.).

I've been running road tubeless for three years, and I've never done anything other than run a rag around a rim to clean one up. I have pulled, plucked and peeled dried sealant from the inside of a tire casing, but that's me being particular, not a matter of necessity. I've had sealant spray on the back side of the seat tube, but it just rubs off with hand friction. Sealant, if you were to get it anywhere else, e.g. on hands, the floor, on the side of the rim, clothes, just wipes off.

Have the right tools for the job, including some rags, and you'll be good.

Latex tubes are the best, but lose air quickly. Very quickly. But I'd still prefer them to tubeless. My one experience with tubeless showed that they CAN and DO flat, and when that happens on the road you need to add a tube to get home. Also, the damned things fit so tight changing them or adding that tube is a GIANT pain in the ass. Lastly, once you flat a tubeless, throw it away. Patching is a waste of time. My current setup is Conti GP 4000s II with Race Light tubes. Close to Latex without the air loss. And very easy to maintain.

You understand my point exactly, that hitting something so hard the tire cuts has nothing to do with whether there is a butyl tube, a latex tube, or no tube inside it. It's like talking about the relative merits of gas or wood grills and then blaming the heat source for overcooking your steak; it's not to do with the heat source, but rather user error.

Again, decades of cycling tradition has defined pinch flatting as cutting the tube between the tire and rim. Of course you-- not me, btw-- could 'pinch flat so hard you cut the casing,' but to simply call that pinch flatting in a conversation where people are trying to understand the merits of various wheel systems does nothing but obfuscate the issues.

What you should call cutting the tire is 'cutting the tire.'

I will also add to this conversation that installing latex tubes is usually a PITA. They're so flimsy and light they're easy to twist and pinch on install, and the extra fuss in handling them to avoid it is just a hassle. They do ride sweet, though.

I will also add to this conversation that 'tight fitting tires' are common to both clinchers and tubeless, and it cannot be said that one is worse than the other in that regard.

If you thought otherwise previously, that was a huge mistake. It is also the the most common misconception, that tubeless means flat-proof, and the source of much of the frustration around tubeless.

I was under no illusions about tubeless, or any other hunk of rubber. But a previous comment in this thread claimed that you couldn't pinch flat (you can) and the sealant will plug punctures (yes, but only really, really small ones).

I'll stick with my current setup. Rides really nice, and VERY easy to maintain. Tubeless, in its current form, is just a huge pain in the ass. You need a crow bar to get the damned things off. And I just loved having to dig that valve out to use a tube in order to get home.