So here's the issue. I'm a small guy, about 5 feet 4.5" which would, by all usual accounts, put me on a 49 or 50cm c-t seat tube. right? But i've taken my inseam measuments and my standover is just shy of 28 inches. Yes, from attempting to get into cycling i have discovered that i have freakishly short legs and a long torso.

I read that for 700c wheels, the minumum standover is 30 inches. I'd imagine that holds true no matter what the size of the frame? So do i defintely have to go with 650c wheels? Is there any way to avoid a sloping top tube? My torso is proportionally a good deal longer than normal given my height/inseam numbers so what kind of numbers should i really be looking for? Like a 48 c-t seat tube and 51/52 c-t top? Any suggestions for a good used bike ($600 - $800 range) that comes in that kind of size?

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

well... i'm 5'3" and have 700 wheels on both my bikes.. however both are compact geometry with sloping tubes!

It is possible to get a fairly low standover with 700C wheels. The bigger problem is top tube length. If you have a short torso or short arms, then smaller wheels make it easier for the frame designer to shorten the top tube, thus making the reach more comfortable for you.

There are a couple of recent threads on bikes for 5'2" women that have good info on some of the issues with 700 vs 650cc wheels. BF people had some good comments about how the choice can affect frame geometry, tow overlap, etc. Even thought you're obviously not looking for WSD bikes, it may give you some insight into the geometry issues with smaller frames.

I don't know about used bikes in the $600-800 price range. However, in testing bikes for myself, (female, 5'3" and 29" inseam), I found that some of the Giant bikes seemed to have a longish TT compared with other bikes I tested. I didn't go for one of those because I needed a much shorter TT, but if you have a long torso, then it might be worth at least looking at their website. The bikes I looked at from Giant all had sloping top tubes however.

Well, 650C wheeled road bikes tend to be built for women who tend to have longer legs and shorter torsos than men of the same height. So I think you might have difficulty finding a 650C bike with a top tube that's long enough. That may also be an issue with a 700C wheeled bike - finding a frame that's short enough vertically yet long enough horizontally. But you can always go compact (sloping top tube) or just go up a size and not have as much handlebar drop.

My gut feel is that you might want a top tube longer than 51/52cm. It depends on the length of your arms, how low your handlebars will be, etc. But as a point of reference, I am 68.5" with a 33.5" inseam making my crotch-to-top-of-head 35" which is even shorter than yours (36.5"). I ride road bikes with 55/56cm top tubes.

First off, forget about seat tube length, or anything WSD. WSD bikes are usually designed with a shorter top tube, since womens torsos are usually shorter in relation to their legs compared to men. For the OP, a WSD would not be the answer, since it is working in the opposite direction of where he needs to go.

What would work best in his case would be a standard 700c frame with proper top tube length, since top tube length really is most important. For him, having shorter legs is no big deal. A compact frame with a proper length sloping top tube is all he would need.

Since you have a long torso, something like a Trek Pilot with a 52-54cm top tube (just a guess) is probably in your area. Figure out what Top Tube length you need first, and go from there.

https://www2.trekbikes.com/bikes/bike...id=1407000&f=2

https://www2.trekbikes.com/bikes/bike...id=1404000&f=2

In the case of a Trek Pilot, you'd simply need to lower the saddle. You could also flip the stem to drop the bars for a more aggressive posture, if that is what you desire.

Cool, thanks everyone... i'll check around to see if i can find some other threads about this, but from what i gather I'm going to want to stick with the 700c wheels and have no choice really but to find a sloping top tube. Given my torso length i would be looking for a top tube of about 52cm or maybe more. The smallest size of the treks that Patriot posted are "50cm" with 52cm top tubes, and standover heights of 28.4" That will likely be a snug fit under the boys, although it's not like i'll have to worry too much about falling that way.

To be sure though, a sloping top tube is really my only option given my legs vs torso dimensions, correct?

I don't think you are absolutely resticted to a sloping top tube frame. There may be some level top tube frames out there that will fit you great. But there will be many more with sloping top tube that will work so your selection of those will be greater.

Correct.

I was also thinking a Giant OCR-3 in size Small. It has a 52.5cm top tube, but a 46cm seat tube +27cm for BB/ground clearance, and you have a standover height around 28".

https://www.giant-bicycle.com/us/030....05&model=11027

That's cutting close, but it may work. You may want to go to your LBS and see if they can help you out, since you have measurements that are really going to need a little more care in ensuring you have a proper fit. They can order a bike, and see if it fits. If it doesn't, you don't lose any money for them trying.

Treks seem to be vertically short and horizontally long bikes. The Trek aluminum series comes in a "43" which has an effective 52.7cm top tube and standover of 27.4" https://www2.trekbikes.com/bikes/bike...id=1413000&f=4

Trek 1000 was my first bike and I was only 5'3"ish at the time.

You need to be careful of recreational bikes like the Giant OCR or Specialized Roubaix. They have taller head tubes, which may make the handlebars too tall if your saddle is low. You should also look at racing-style bikes like the Giant TCR which also has a slopping top tube, but with a lower front end.

I'd say go get fitted by a professional, like the guys who do serotta size fits. Get your theoretical frame fit and then pick a bike that suits.

I'm 5'8 and had a custom Seven Alaris built, even at that height I had to make some compromises - the bike has a fair amount of toe overlap because I didn't want to compromise on the geometry (some frame builders would steepen the seat angles and slacken the head angles to avoid toe overlap on small frames). If you can live with it, I'd say that 650C with compact geometry would be the ideal, but if you really don't like the idea then some of the 700C compact frame suggestions above sound okay. Just be aware of what your ideal top tube, saddle to bar drop and standover should be and don't compromise on this no matter what frame you get.

Sorry, you're right, I meant to said the TCR. You're right, they do have taller head tubes.

The TCR 1 or 2 may be a better choice. I think he's looking for a less expensive option than the composite versions.

I'm 5'2" and when I got a road bike, I wanted one with 700c wheels. I got a 42cm Surly Pacer frame and had it built up. I've been riding it for 3 years and it's great. No toe overlap. Stand over is about 71.5cm

Hey JRider. I'm almost exactly the same size and proportions as you and I have 2 road bikes that fit me very well; both are 700c. One is a sloping top tube, and the other is level.

First, standover height is almost meaningless in relationship to how the bike actually rides. If you check out the geometries of some of the best frames (DeRosa, Pinarello, Look, Colnago, etc), I doubt they even list the standover height. What's more important is top tube length, seattube angle/setback, headtube angle/trail. I suggest having someone help you take your body measurements and run them through a good fit system like they have at Wrench Science (the fit system link is on the right side of the page):

https://www.wrenchscience.com/WS1/default.asp

Then use the results and compare them to frame geometries you can find on various manufacturers websites; see which geometries fit your body proportions best. Also consider your preferred riding style. For example, I ride in the drops quite a bit and prefer an aggressive TT (time trial) type position, so I like bikes with steeper seattube angles (74-76 degrees), like the Felts (in a 50 c-t size).

On the question of sloping top tube or level, that also isn't going to make much REAL difference in the way the bike rides. Either way, what matters is the shape of the triangle formed by the saddle+bottom bracket+handlebars. If you prefer the looks of a level top tube better, but you don't like the looks of having a very short seatpost, you still have options. For example, my Bertoni's (level TT) seattube is 49cm (c-t), but the bottom bracket drop (bb's vertical distance from the horizontal plane between the two axles) is only 6.0 cm instead of the more common 7.0 cm. Fits me great and still looks good IMHO.

Anyway, all this to say you've got plenty of options in 700c sizes. Test riding as many as you can before you buy will also give you a good idea of what will work.

Cheers! - RJ

The borderline for a 650c bike is roughly a rider of 5'2". You are easily within the 700c range, esp as you dont need a short bike.

A compact style bike with a sloping TT sounds about right for you, but note that you may be using a larger size than usual for your standover (for the extra length). Larger bikes may have longer head-tube and place the bars higher. This is esp true on less racy models such as the Trek Pilot or Specilized Sequioa.

Decide where you want your points of contact (pedals/saddle/bars) then pick a frame that allows you to position the POCs without going to extremes of stem or seatpost.
Note that with small legs, you may benefit from short cranks. 170mm are std for med males. 160-165 may feel better for you.

I just got around to doing the sizing chart on wrenchscience and here are the results:
Your Handlebar Width is :: 38cm Center-to-Center
Your Overall Reach is :: 63.69cm Center-to-Center (TT+stem)
Your Frame Size is :: 48cm Center-to-Top / 46cm Center-to-Center
Your Recommended Saddle Height is :: 62.8cm

I clicked onward to the frames they have that would fit me and there were only a few titanium and carbon options. All too expensive for me. Originally, I had been searching for a steel frame (maybe a mid-90's+ italian/japanese, lugged) but at this point it looks like aluminum may be my best bet size-wise. Anyone think this Lemond might fit me anyway? 49cm Lemond Zurich on Ebay

If the 2006 size chart for sloping top tubes holds true for the 2003 then it would go something like this:



So c-c on the 49 is actually only 45.3cm? That would be just about perfect based on the wrenchscience info. The effective TT c-c would be 52.5 which also seems right on. So maybe i'm not going to have to stay away from steel.

Anyway, i'm a thoroughly confused bike noob now and it seems i'm going to have to just hop on a few of these bikes to get a more accurate picture of what size frame i can handle. As long as i get the effective TT length right, will it really matter if i can't comfortably stand over it?

I do have 165mm cranks of my mountain bike so i'll probably get the same for whatever road bike i end up with.

Thanks again all.

there is only one thing for it, give up cycling...

That bike frame may work. You better ask the seller what the standover is. If it is the right height, then you may need to get yourself a longer stem (like a 120mm), and set the seat back all the way, since you have a long torso.

If you want it to stay aggressive in posture, just make sure your new longer stem will be something like a -17deg, so it will be level with the top tube, and not pointed upward like the one the seller has on there.

So then standover IS going to be an important figure afterall? If it is the same as the sizing on the '06 lemond chart then the standover is 72.8 and that's approximately 2cm too big. I'll ask the seller though... and yeah i had already anticipated needing a longer stem.

JRider- Don't be too worried about the standover height. I have an inseam of only 29" according to the Wrench Science measurement method, the level-top-tube-bike I ride (Bertoni) has a standover of 76.0 cm, and I have ZERO problems riding it; it's a great fit! The times where you're standing with both feet on the ground and the bike straight up between your legs are so few... especially compared to the hundreds of hours you'll spend on the pedals. The LeMond 49 shouldn't be any problem. What's you inseam according to the Wrench Science measurement?

- RJ

I'm just shy of 28" on the standover (about 27.8") which is 70.6cm. Very few frames seem to have a standover that low. I'm worried that the 49cm lemond will be the level TT geometry (rather than the sloping geometry of the 06 zurich - anyone know for sure which it is?) and the standover could be as high as 75 or even 76cm. I realize it won't happen often, but if i'm just riding around town on it that standover issue might not be much fun.

Eh, I'm 5' 6" and have no problem with 54cm frame, albeit a 90mm stem. Have you tried a 52 cm bike? Standover is not THAT important, and you get about a inch extra with shoes + only one foot on the ground.

Dunno about you, but I spend most of my time riding, not standing over the bike.

JRider,

Normally, the standover isn't that big of a concern, since for most people the proportion of inseam to torso is similar, and frames are manufactured accordingly to accomedate the majority of people. You appear to be one of the rare cases where the common frame geometry used, just doesn't work as well for you. In your case, you made mention of your shorter legs, and was concerned about possible injury, etc. So, that is why I mention it.

Reach measurement is almost always the most important factor, and still is here, you just have to find a frame that you feel you will be comfortable with. If you feel you won't have a problem with the standover being a little higher than your inseam, then you will get used to it. You just have to be a bit more careful when mounting and dismounting.

In the future, when/if you decide, you may eventually have the funds to purchase a higher end frame that will fit better, or perhaps even have a custom frame made specifically to your personal measurements.

From the Ebay auction you posted, if you think you can learn to ride the bike with the standover a little high, then something like that nice Lemond seems to be a good choice.