I am usually the guy answering these questions but it seems like SRAM upgrades stuff every model year and I've lost the plot a bit.

Are Force and Red shifting now identical? I thought used to be that only Red had the zero-loss shifting.

Red is ZeroLoss front and rear, Force is ZeroLoss front only.

Well that's what I thought too, but on SRAM's Force web site it says: "Also added is Zero Loss shifting, which engages front shifts immediately." Ahh ... front shifts only for Force?

I thought Force had the zero loss only on the front, while Red has it on both.

Could be wrong though.

Sorry. I only know about the rear for sure. I tried Force for a couple of months.

DigitalN is correct. Can't wait to get rid of my Force. Go Red (great stuff) or go Shimano.

you are correct

Apex, Rival, and Force all have Zero Loss on the front. Red has Zero Loss (and a more stout innards) for the RHS

It's worth the $$$, IMHO

I just sold my Force Shifters and replaced them with Red. Having ridden with Force for a couple of years I noticed the performance improvement immediately after the change. Red shifters are the only way to go if you are a fan of double tap shifting. Lp

I'd rather run Force than go Shimano.

The cost difference for Red is hardly that much, and you won't be wondering/kicking yourself down the road why you didn't just get Red to begin with.

not to mention that they don't break.

rival & force are notorious for having the innards snap

Just mix it, red shifters, force crank, rival everything else. Unless your made of money

Have any of you Red riders felt that it was too easy to shift? That is, have you ever clicked off a shift accidentally?

no...it took me a hour to make the mental switch from DA7800 to SRAM Red...a week to learn the subtle shifting tricks...now I can ride the DA or the Red bike without thinking about the shifting....but I have to say that I prefer the shorter throw of the Red shifters

I'd likely prefer it, too, although I'd have a hard time ditching my nearly-new 7800 shifters (maybe I should just put them on another bike). I've been able to try riding Rival instead of Red, and although I think Red's zero loss rear shifting feels awesome in the store, sometimes I wonder if it's so hair-trigger that it'll shift with an errant sneeze.

I was playing with some Rival and Red shifters today. The only difference I felt was that the amount of play before engagement on the Red is a bit less. Once you click the lever...its the same.

I'm running Red all round.

Yes, Red is where it's at when it comes to the shifters. Everything else can be substituted with Rival/Force, which are still very light compared to Shimano components, but Red shifters are a must if you are running SRAM. My last bike had a full Rival group, and my new bike has full Red. The shifters are the only place (other than weight) where Red provides any noticeable difference in performance. That difference, however, is totally worth the money. I used to want Di2, but honestly Red shifting is so damn fast and trouble free that I really don't want Di2 anymore. The zero loss on the right shifter allows for rear shifting that's just as fast as Di2.

Di2 obviously offers the best shifting out of any component group out there, but Red is still so close that it makes justifying the price of Di2 very difficult. Ultegra 6700 and DA 7900 suck IMO. The only thing I like about 7900 is the no trim feature. Heck, I'd take Rival over 7900 any day.

Yes, but that amount of play, although still MUCH shorter than Shimano, requires more wrist action than Red does. You are right that once you get to the point where it clicks it will feel the same, but that virtually instant click of Red makes it much better overall.

And Apex/XX/any-ten-speed-Sram-stuff, as long as I understand things right. Which is all pretty awesome, too.

Why do you think I'm running Red?

I agree that the one thing to have is the Red shifters. I don't think its as much of a difference compared to the pre 08 front shifting. Nice to have buuut...not that big a deal if it came down to budget.

Speaking of being poor, is there any reason not to ONLY upgrade my right brifter?

I don't imagine my bike will veer left on its own due to the extra 12 grams.

that's the set up i'm running: i broke my LHS red shifter and replaced it with a rival (post 2009) LHS shifter

Lol...isn't that like wearing a different shoe on each feet?

sure.

and i once ran two powertap cervo units

ride with fenders

had my DMT prisma shoes clipped into cheapo wellgo pedals

and bunch of other fredilicious things