And what I'm "on about" is your "If you spent a little time on platforms..." bit. Yeah, I have, from before puberty through college. I'll even count last Friday since I can't add in tomorrow morning when I ride to work yet again on my platform-equipped commuter bike.

Look, guys, I'm not being ignorant here. The only pedal variation I haven't used yet is toeclips and straps with dedicated, hard-soled, cleated cycling shoes. I hardly count Power Grips as different enough from regular clips with regular shoes, either.

Oh, gotcha. It is a skill you can lose. I rode from 1988-2005 with some kinda foot retention for practically every bike ride. Then I started buying cheap bikes and fixing them up and I did a lot of test riding and I did find it really sketchy at first. Then a couple of years ago I scored a bike with some nice GT platforms and that made it much easier.

The "spend a little time on..." post was in response to bikerjp's post about having trouble keeping feet on pedals, BTW.

In addition, you seem to be in mega troll mode. WUWT?

So I'd have to relearn pushing my feet onto the pedals on every upstroke... or unlearn the opportunity to lift my feet on the upstroke?

That still seems more like regression than progression.

I'm on a roll tonight probably because my wife's got a head start on Christmas vacation and, being home alone, I've got nothing else to do. :p

Yes, in my opinion, it's absolutely worth it.

I have clipless pedals on all my bikes except for my commuter/errand bike. I just want to be able to wear normal shoes on that one.

imo clipless pedals are one of the best upgrades you can get for cycling, of any kind.

Absolutely.
Old style toe clips are way better than nothing, and clipless are way better than toe clips & straps.


Yes, any sort of climbing will benefit greatly from "attached shoes".

If I were to putter around town casually on a bike for a few miles, then I can see riding in street shoes.

But doing 55 miles of hills yesterday would have been miserable and slower without clipless pedals. Being able to pull up while climbing makes a big difference.

No, they aren't.

I got 4th in a climbing race in loafers and Look Keo pedals a while back. If I had a brain and had remembered my shoes I might have won it. Sprinting was greatly compromised (though I still beat some guys), and climbing was no bucket of fun.

People pull out of pedals on the upstroke in sprints, you lose that power on platform pedals. When I do sprint and shorter distance events on the track I use clipless and toe straps. Huge amount of force generated there and even with the pedal adjusted to maximum resistance, I was still pulling out.

Let's see the studies.

I'm betting that you are referring to studies which show that you don't actually produce power pulling up on the pedal, but at most are partially unweighting it.

That's far from saying that in the real world you can't ride faster with your feat clipped in than you can with street shoes on platforms.

I can imagine if Hoy (or any other pro) doesn't use straps with clipless he would pop out the first couple of lunges off the line of a pursuit.

See post #34. I like Racer EX's anecdote better, though. He didn't even have good platforms OR good shoes and didn't being unclipped slow him down. I'm sure he would've been a LOT more comfortable and confident being clipped in or even just having good sneakers on good platforms.

I don't know anyone who rides platform pedals, clips or no clips, with carbon soled sneakers (or loafers :)). When the sole flexes, power is lost. We don't need a study to determine that.

I ride platforms in boots with a steel shank on rainy days. Not very flexy but I'm pretty slow in 'em. ;)

There are even platforms for weight weenies these days:

http://www.bikemag.com/files/2011/01...h_FSAped_4.jpg

Yeah, it did slow me down. Might have cost me the race.

And any study that say you (well, me anyway) don't produce power on the upstroke is seriously flawed (see "pulling out during a sprint").

That said you can still go pretty good on platform pedals sitting down. Standing to climb or sprint is a different story. If you're a casual rec rider clipless might help, or it might be very bad depending on how you're set up.

That's why you use this type of shoe:

http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/shoes.jpg

Yeah, I've got a set of Duegi's and a set if Diadora's from my 80's racing days at home. You missed the point. If you're going to wear cleated shoes, you might as well wear clipless.

Definitely - clipless is safer than slotted cleats.

That study doesn't begin to say what you want it to. It simply says they didn't find a significant efficiency advantage at submaximal efforts.

It doesn't say that you can't sprint, climb, and time trial faster with clipless pedals versus platforms.

It would be pretty easy to do a study measuring time on various TT courses, and maximum sprinting speed. I'd bet dollars to donuts, the clock would show an advantage to clipless.

As for my own anecdote, 2 years ago at the Tour of Bahamas I was 2nd in the Circuit race, 3rd on GC after the time trial, and only needed to finish the Road race with the group I was in to finish on th podium, when my cleat imploded. After riding 20 plus miles barefoot on speedplays I abandonded. Stif shoes, and clipless pedals are definitely advantageous.

Agree. I don't understand why people quote research or study but don't even know how to read it in the first place.

Ow! I had a pair of Dueggi's, I'd forgotten just how uncomfortable they were, especially on long rides. The cleats would squeak, and loosen up since they only had 1 screw, and you couldn't walk in them. In comparison, clipless shoes are a vast improvement. But you can wear a touring shoe or Chuck Taylor's and do just fine with toeclips.
Clipless is lighter, or course, and it's easy to wear booties for winter riding. I don't get a speed difference, but my efforts are "sub-optimal"

Why?

I still use those shoes on a regular basis.

Good for you. My toe strap days are over. Wanna buy my old ones?

I spend 98% of my time riding submaximally. Study applies to me.

Only if they're size 41.

Too big. Oh well.

I assume you meant 98% of your time riding at 60% of maximal aerobic power (Isn't that a recovery ride anyway?). Then sure it applies to you.

In Herman Cain voice: A HEH HEH HEH HEH HEH......no

For those of you considering clipless, let me tell you how it is:

The day you start using clipless, you will probably be disappointed that you did not gain 2 mph (just like you were when you got those new wheels). But....

After riding only a thousand miles clipless, try going back to platforms.

- That is when it becomes immediately and unequivocably obvious that clipless gives you more power.
- That is when you know you made the right choice.
- That is when you know that all the peeps who said clipless isn't any better were plum outta their gourds.
- That is when you can author awesome posts like this.

Ba-dum-*crash*