How fast do you pull?
06-16-13, 01:40 PM
#51
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: SE Minnesota
Posts: 12,275
Bikes: are better than yours.
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
3 Posts
You don't seem to have had any answers. This may be because it isn't possible to generalise about "typical" pulls, riders or wattages. And one has to remember that as you emerge from the draft to take the pull, the power you have to put out to maintain the pace increases substantially.
I have a problem with the emphatic statements that the object is to maintain a consistent effort rather than a consistent speed. Yes, that is true in that one does not want the guy on the front to hammer uphill in order to maintain speed, and thus put everyone on the rack. But the idea is to maintain a consistent effort for the group, not the individual. So if I am second wheel I might be doing 25 mph and putting out 240 w because I'm sheltered. As the front guy pulls off and exposes me to the wind I maintain my speed, which means that the guys behind me get to maintain a consistent effort, but requires me to put out (say) 280 w. So the guys behind me get to put out a consistent effort, but my effort has risen for as long as I am on the front. These figures aren't accurate but you get my drift.
I'm your age. You'd be surprised how much faster you can go in a paceline.
I have a problem with the emphatic statements that the object is to maintain a consistent effort rather than a consistent speed. Yes, that is true in that one does not want the guy on the front to hammer uphill in order to maintain speed, and thus put everyone on the rack. But the idea is to maintain a consistent effort for the group, not the individual. So if I am second wheel I might be doing 25 mph and putting out 240 w because I'm sheltered. As the front guy pulls off and exposes me to the wind I maintain my speed, which means that the guys behind me get to maintain a consistent effort, but requires me to put out (say) 280 w. So the guys behind me get to put out a consistent effort, but my effort has risen for as long as I am on the front. These figures aren't accurate but you get my drift.
I'm your age. You'd be surprised how much faster you can go in a paceline.
__________________
Telemachus has, indeed, sneezed.
Telemachus has, indeed, sneezed.
06-16-13, 01:49 PM
#52
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 9,201
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1186 Post(s)
Liked 289 Times
in
177 Posts
So...would a typical pull...for say 2 minutes..by a "typical rider" (recognizing variability as you noted) be a watt output of say 250-270 watts? I ask this as I'm curious (not being a categoried rider) but I'd like some measure of watt effort. If you asked me to go pull 25 mph for 1 minute...well you'd get one pull out of me for maybe a minute (assuming I could even roll with a 25 mph paceline...thats a big assumption and likely I couldn't) then I'd be gassed, dropped. I'm 58 and would love to ride at that speed but it'll take me another year just to average 17+ solo and having no friends or partners locally who ride faster I'm destined to go it alone. BTW, I use Bike Calculator to get an approximate estimate of my watt output.
Thanks for the comments.
Thanks for the comments.
If you want to get a rough idea of how hard riders are working you can explore Strava for your area and identify some group rides. Normally, a few riders will have power data you can look at.
06-16-13, 03:50 PM
#54
Voice of the Industry
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 12,572
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1188 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times
in
8 Posts
Wait a minute. You start a thread asking a very basic question and now you want to dismiss an important clarification? The reason the clarification is important is because it is a common n00b mistake to try to hold the speed over rollers with their eyes glued to their computers. So they surge uphill and stop pedalling going back down. Perhaps this, and not your age, is why you sensed irritation from the group.
All the solo riding in the world will not prepare you for working in a group. And if you're asking a question as basic as how hard to pull at the front, it would behoove you to adopt enough humility to try to learn. Either that, or stick to solo riding.
All the solo riding in the world will not prepare you for working in a group. And if you're asking a question as basic as how hard to pull at the front, it would behoove you to adopt enough humility to try to learn. Either that, or stick to solo riding.
06-16-13, 04:03 PM
#57
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Northern Ontario
Posts: 3,659
Bikes: Colnago Master XL, Bianchi Via Nirone 7, Marinoni Fango
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
06-16-13, 04:23 PM
#59
Administrator
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Delaware shore
Posts: 13,558
Bikes: Cervelo C5, Guru Photon, Waterford, Specialized CX
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1106 Post(s)
Liked 2,180 Times
in
1,470 Posts
06-16-13, 04:36 PM
#60
serious cyclist
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 21,147
Bikes: S1, R2, P2
Mentioned: 115 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9334 Post(s)
Liked 3,679 Times
in
2,026 Posts
06-16-13, 05:43 PM
#63
serious cyclist
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 21,147
Bikes: S1, R2, P2
Mentioned: 115 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9334 Post(s)
Liked 3,679 Times
in
2,026 Posts
Formula 1, on the other hand, is excellent. I'm quite upset there isn't a race this weekend.
06-16-13, 06:17 PM
#66
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Northern Ontario
Posts: 3,659
Bikes: Colnago Master XL, Bianchi Via Nirone 7, Marinoni Fango
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
06-16-13, 08:04 PM
#67
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Burnaby, BC
Posts: 4,144
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
3 Posts
Well if you're crashing someone else's party I guess you have two choices: kill it, have fun, make everyone suffer/blow yourself up and laugh about it with your mates at the pub after; or play nice, roll with the group, and maybe get invited back/make new friends.
Depends on the mood you're in I guess!
Depends on the mood you're in I guess!
06-16-13, 09:16 PM
#69
Administrator
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Delaware shore
Posts: 13,558
Bikes: Cervelo C5, Guru Photon, Waterford, Specialized CX
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1106 Post(s)
Liked 2,180 Times
in
1,470 Posts
06-16-13, 09:16 PM
#70
Administrator
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Delaware shore
Posts: 13,558
Bikes: Cervelo C5, Guru Photon, Waterford, Specialized CX
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1106 Post(s)
Liked 2,180 Times
in
1,470 Posts
06-16-13, 09:37 PM
#71
Other Worldly Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: The old Northwest Coast.
Posts: 1,540
Bikes: 1973 Motobecane Grand Jubilee, 1981 Centurion Super LeMans, 2010 Gary Fisher Wahoo, 2003 Colnago Dream Lux, 2014 Giant Defy 1, 2015 Framed Bikes Minnesota 3.0, several older family Treks
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 194 Post(s)
Liked 136 Times
in
53 Posts
06-16-13, 11:08 PM
#72
commu*ist spy
so... like... you move the gas pedal with your foot, and people go crazy over it? wow that's so interesting!
I think I get nascar now, but I still don't get pro wrestling.
I think I get nascar now, but I still don't get pro wrestling.
06-16-13, 11:32 PM
#73
Senior Member
Depends on the type of rotation you are in. If it's a continuous rotation, you just pull off once you are clear of the guy dropping back (to be clear, this is usually for a very fast paceline - usually faster than 25mph). If its not, you pull as long as your ability allows. A time trial specialist might be on the front for a minute or two or maybe longer. A sprinter like me might be on the front for 15 seconds or shorter. The objective is to move the line as a whole at a continuous which is faster than a single rider alone can manage.
To be clear on some things. It is about a continuous effort at the front. If the lead guy is pulling at 5W/kg, when you hit the front, you pull at 5W/kg (or W/CdA if flat terrain, though "constant speed" suffices for this case).
To be clear on some things. It is about a continuous effort at the front. If the lead guy is pulling at 5W/kg, when you hit the front, you pull at 5W/kg (or W/CdA if flat terrain, though "constant speed" suffices for this case).
__________________
Cat 2 Track, Cat 3 Road.
"If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter
Cat 2 Track, Cat 3 Road.
"If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter
06-16-13, 11:47 PM
#74
Senior Member
No offense, but most rec riders have no idea what "no gaps" means in a fast paceline. If guys were rotating off and rejoining the line in front of you, then there were gaps. Rec riders tend to measure "gaps" in terms of feet; racers tend to measure in terms of inches. The "communication" in a paceline is done less with words and more by positioning. If you are leaving a couple feet between you and the guy in front, then you are communicating that you are either not in the pace line or you are about to be dropped; either way, the guy dropping back will join in front of you. If you are tight to the guy in front, then the guy dropping back will not attempt to join the line in front of you (unless it's a race and he really wants the spot, of course).
__________________
Cat 2 Track, Cat 3 Road.
"If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter
Cat 2 Track, Cat 3 Road.
"If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter
06-17-13, 12:16 AM
#75
Senior Member
Rotating pacelines with strangers and yelling over maintaining speed and keeping the watts....
Sound booooooooooooooooooring.
Change the channel Marge!
Sound booooooooooooooooooring.
Change the channel Marge!