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Physics of Descending

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Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Physics of Descending

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Old 03-24-15 | 11:19 AM
  #101  
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Originally Posted by Brian Ratliff
Don't mistake physics for personal preferences. Heavier riders can play with their tires too, and deflated tires don't actually increase traction... it softens the suspension. Big difference. Traction is governed by normal force and surface material. Full stop.

A bigger rider is less affected by surface irregularities; that is simply a question of increased momentum. A bigger rider certainly can decrease tire pressure; they just have to go to larger tires.
Not simply a matter of momentum, nor personal preferences. The amount of pressure will dictate both the size of the contact patch and how elastic a deformation is, both of which affect how the tire will respond to surface irregularities.
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Old 03-24-15 | 11:31 AM
  #102  
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So now here is the second thought. If you make your ride in a loop and return to the same point how much of your ride is either up or down hill?
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Old 03-24-15 | 12:42 PM
  #103  
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Elevation gain/loss will be same, but a early short 25%section and a long gradual downhill I suspect would be faster going down the gradual. Time wise for the loop I mean. I dunno..

If there are no apexes in this story then it's no fun, so there.
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Old 03-24-15 | 12:46 PM
  #104  
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I'm sure tire choice would make a difference as well
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Old 03-24-15 | 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by zandoval
So now here is the second thought. If you make your ride in a loop and return to the same point how much of your ride is either up or down hill?
Depends on Crr.
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Old 03-24-15 | 01:22 PM
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The good thing about being a product of the West Virginia school system is I don't understand a word of this. I can't get upset or argue with anyone.
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Old 03-24-15 | 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by StanSeven
The good thing about being a product of the West Virginia school system is I don't understand a word of this. I can't get upset or argue with anyone.
i've found that cornering on a descent with a Sears & Roebuck wheelbarrow full of horse manure works best when running about 15PSI in the tire.


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Old 03-24-15 | 02:23 PM
  #108  
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If it was pig poop, would you, could you, corner faster?
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Old 03-24-15 | 02:40 PM
  #109  
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I have an orange bike....it goes down faster. That's a proven fact.
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Old 03-24-15 | 05:15 PM
  #110  
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Originally Posted by hueyhoolihan
i've found that cornering on a descent with a Sears & Roebuck wheelbarrow full of horse manure works best when running about 15PSI in the tire.


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Old 03-24-15 | 05:33 PM
  #111  
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Just a few weeks ago I had to do my Saturday morning ride alone, because my usual friends were busy doing yard work, and when I got to the top of one of my favorite hills (used to be able to call them climbs before San Francisco) and a ...big... guy had arrived at the top some time before. We both started descending together and I had to put my face in my stem bolts peddling at 100 cadence to keep up with him riding down with elbows locked on the tops looking around casually. He had stock alu wheels and I was sporting by Boyd 60s. My jersey fits nicely and his was on its way to a parachute.

I don't need equations to tell me that weight on the descent makes a substantial difference.
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Old 03-24-15 | 07:14 PM
  #112  
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Originally Posted by MikeyBoyAz
Just a few weeks ago I had to do my Saturday morning ride alone, because my usual friends were busy doing yard work, and when I got to the top of one of my favorite hills (used to be able to call them climbs before San Francisco) and a ...big... guy had arrived at the top some time before. We both started descending together and I had to put my face in my stem bolts peddling at 100 cadence to keep up with him riding down with elbows locked on the tops looking around casually. He had stock alu wheels and I was sporting by Boyd 60s. My jersey fits nicely and his was on its way to a parachute.

I don't need equations to tell me that weight on the descent makes a substantial difference.
that has happened to me so many times, face in the bolts, elbows in, everything and still spinning away just to keep up with guys just coasting.......but then on climbs heavier folks are sweating buckets and I can talk on the way up, so its a ying yang thing.
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Old 03-24-15 | 07:27 PM
  #113  
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Originally Posted by RChung
Depends on Crr.
This made me laugh, as CRR are my son's initials. It made me wonder what he was tampering with now.
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Old 03-24-15 | 11:22 PM
  #114  
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Originally Posted by djb
that has happened to me so many times, face in the bolts, elbows in, everything and still spinning away just to keep up with guys just coasting.......but then on climbs heavier folks are sweating buckets and I can talk on the way up, so its a ying yang thing.
Yeah, I dig the karma of the uphill. Sometimes though, I end up next to Very large guys at 50+ miles of riding and I am somehow only then passing them on the 4th big climb
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Old 03-25-15 | 04:41 AM
  #115  
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This thread is really going downhill.
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Old 03-25-15 | 08:08 AM
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Bicycle Quarterly did wind tunnel tests and at 22 mph going to full aero tuck with no pedaling and the knees tucked into the top tube created a 7 % reduction in drag coefficient. Meaning if your downhill will take you above 22 on coasting alone than don't waste a lot of time and energy spinning a high gear; get small and let mother earth pull you in.
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Old 03-25-15 | 08:59 AM
  #117  
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Originally Posted by MKahrl
Bicycle Quarterly did wind tunnel tests and at 22 mph going to full aero tuck with no pedaling and the knees tucked into the top tube created a 7 % reduction in drag coefficient. Meaning if your downhill will take you above 22 on coasting alone than don't waste a lot of time and energy spinning a high gear; get small and let mother earth pull you in.
This is so wrong it makes my head hurt.
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Old 03-25-15 | 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by RChung
This is so wrong it makes my head hurt.
Neither right nor wrong, just a perspective.

FWIW reducing wind drag by 7% at 22mph is worth about 1 more mph. Someone who can turn his cranks effectively should be able to do better than that. (if he wants)
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Old 03-25-15 | 09:25 AM
  #119  
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Originally Posted by FBinNY
Neither right nor wrong, just a perspective.

FWIW reducing wind drag by 7% at 22mph is worth about 1 more mph. Someone who can turn his cranks effectively should be able to do better than that. (if he wants)
More like .5 mph, or the equivalent of about 17 extra watts at that speed so I can understand where Rchung is coming from.

Time trialing and optimizing power, it might be a waste to push your speed downhill. But that would imply that you're time trialing with a 22mph top end ...

Seems like a full tuck would be worth more than 7% drag.
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