Parts no one misses on New Bikes...
08-09-23, 05:12 AM
#51
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That's not true but fads at the top end churn a lot faster than the middle of the market. The last bike I can remember with canti brakes was that weird stab Surly made at a rando bike (but with a super stiff fork). Cottered cranks might not be totally dead but they are in the USA.
There is a sort of bike I think of as an Asian-standard bike. If you look at a smaller brand copy of a bike like a Trek FX or Marlin, you find a lot of the same frame features across bike genres. Today they most likely have post mount disc brakes and an English bottom bracket, vertical dropouts for a 135 hub, and a Campagnolo style derailleur hanger. By now they probably have a tapered head tube... cheaper ones have a straight head tube, or a 44mm if they are hedging. It will have fender eyes and at least one bottle mount, and it might have more. Shimano alone can sell you an enormous variety of components that will mount up to that basic frame.
There are a lot of things about bikes that can be changed really quickly - anything that allows different size frames also basically allows different size wheels and frame geometry, for example. Wheel diameter is just a setting on the bender. Probably the most difficult thing is getting tire molds cut and tires made, because that requires big expensive factory work. Rim extrusions are probably pretty expensive to get going and special butted tubing and spokes are not things you can just buy from a sheet metal company, and that's why they have limited suppliers. But everything else to build a bike is basic machine shop and welding.
That's why there's a few component brands, a few dozen tire and wheel and tubing brands, and hundreds of bike brands.
There is a sort of bike I think of as an Asian-standard bike. If you look at a smaller brand copy of a bike like a Trek FX or Marlin, you find a lot of the same frame features across bike genres. Today they most likely have post mount disc brakes and an English bottom bracket, vertical dropouts for a 135 hub, and a Campagnolo style derailleur hanger. By now they probably have a tapered head tube... cheaper ones have a straight head tube, or a 44mm if they are hedging. It will have fender eyes and at least one bottle mount, and it might have more. Shimano alone can sell you an enormous variety of components that will mount up to that basic frame.
There are a lot of things about bikes that can be changed really quickly - anything that allows different size frames also basically allows different size wheels and frame geometry, for example. Wheel diameter is just a setting on the bender. Probably the most difficult thing is getting tire molds cut and tires made, because that requires big expensive factory work. Rim extrusions are probably pretty expensive to get going and special butted tubing and spokes are not things you can just buy from a sheet metal company, and that's why they have limited suppliers. But everything else to build a bike is basic machine shop and welding.
That's why there's a few component brands, a few dozen tire and wheel and tubing brands, and hundreds of bike brands.
08-09-23, 09:08 AM
#52
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i'll start the list with... Cottered Cranksets and their tapered cotter Bolts.
i have spent countless hours trying to remove the bolts... only to find that the crank arm is far more stuck in place than the bolt ever was....
if someone brings an old raleigh three speed by with a bad bottom bracket,, i tell them, up front, that it's not worth fixing, and that the Crank is stuck to the spindle, so it may need to be CUT with a grinder to be removed.... some insist and persist, due to sentimental wants, then gripe about the repair bill.
i have spent countless hours trying to remove the bolts... only to find that the crank arm is far more stuck in place than the bolt ever was....
if someone brings an old raleigh three speed by with a bad bottom bracket,, i tell them, up front, that it's not worth fixing, and that the Crank is stuck to the spindle, so it may need to be CUT with a grinder to be removed.... some insist and persist, due to sentimental wants, then gripe about the repair bill.
Last edited by Reynolds; 08-09-23 at 09:12 AM.
08-09-23, 08:34 PM
#53
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If we are including BSOs and entry level bikes, this is true.
Bit If we are talking about mid level and higher MTB, Road, and Gravel, then quill stems, square taper, freewheels, and 8 speed are rare on new bikes. Extinct on MTBs. You mostly find them from places like Rivendell, VO, and Rene Herse… companies with a vintage vibe.
Tubes are basically dead for mid to upper end MTB, with not many holdouts. The last two mtbs we bought came setup tubeless. No tubes included. But even when they come set up with tubes, they are nearly always tubeless compatible, and you just need to set them up. In fact most shops will do this for you before you even pick the bike up.
QR is exceedingly rare on mid-level MTB, and getting uncommon for mid level gravel and road.
Cables are certainly common as dirt. I think those going away is more aspirational on some peoples’ part.
Bit If we are talking about mid level and higher MTB, Road, and Gravel, then quill stems, square taper, freewheels, and 8 speed are rare on new bikes. Extinct on MTBs. You mostly find them from places like Rivendell, VO, and Rene Herse… companies with a vintage vibe.
Tubes are basically dead for mid to upper end MTB, with not many holdouts. The last two mtbs we bought came setup tubeless. No tubes included. But even when they come set up with tubes, they are nearly always tubeless compatible, and you just need to set them up. In fact most shops will do this for you before you even pick the bike up.
QR is exceedingly rare on mid-level MTB, and getting uncommon for mid level gravel and road.
Cables are certainly common as dirt. I think those going away is more aspirational on some peoples’ part.
Trek uses a lot of quill stems still including on e-bikes and I see them elsewhere. Yes VO and similar are big proponents of them still and they are not as common as they once were but I still see them on new bikes and that is what I am counting here not just certain new bikes.
Tubes come in every single bike so not dead. Yes things are increasingly going tubeless ready but everything still comes with tubes.
Essentially yes things are maybe less common on the high end but there are tons of new bikes with some of this stuff. It is not dead yet. I think if we talk about high end only then everything said would generally be true but this is a thread on just new bikes technically.
08-10-23, 04:39 AM
#54
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I am just counting new bikes.
Trek uses a lot of quill stems still including on e-bikes and I see them elsewhere. Yes VO and similar are big proponents of them still and they are not as common as they once were but I still see them on new bikes and that is what I am counting here not just certain new bikes.
Tubes come in every single bike so not dead. Yes things are increasingly going tubeless ready but everything still comes with tubes.
Essentially yes things are maybe less common on the high end but there are tons of new bikes with some of this stuff. It is not dead yet. I think if we talk about high end only then everything said would generally be true but this is a thread on just new bikes technically.
Trek uses a lot of quill stems still including on e-bikes and I see them elsewhere. Yes VO and similar are big proponents of them still and they are not as common as they once were but I still see them on new bikes and that is what I am counting here not just certain new bikes.
Tubes come in every single bike so not dead. Yes things are increasingly going tubeless ready but everything still comes with tubes.
Essentially yes things are maybe less common on the high end but there are tons of new bikes with some of this stuff. It is not dead yet. I think if we talk about high end only then everything said would generally be true but this is a thread on just new bikes technically.
Oh and just to repeat that not every single bike comes with tubes. Order a mid-range Giant and chances are it will arrive set up fully tubeless with sealant.
08-10-23, 06:08 AM
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Freewheels, I hated freewheels. After the freewheel got larger than 5 speed the gear range widened and those suckers would get on there so tight that it was nearly impossible to remove them.
good riddance!
good riddance!
08-10-23, 06:28 AM
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I am just counting new bikes.
Trek uses a lot of quill stems still including on e-bikes and I see them elsewhere. Yes VO and similar are big proponents of them still and they are not as common as they once were but I still see them on new bikes and that is what I am counting here not just certain new bikes.
Tubes come in every single bike so not dead. Yes things are increasingly going tubeless ready but everything still comes with tubes.
Essentially yes things are maybe less common on the high end but there are tons of new bikes with some of this stuff. It is not dead yet. I think if we talk about high end only then everything said would generally be true but this is a thread on just new bikes technically.
Trek uses a lot of quill stems still including on e-bikes and I see them elsewhere. Yes VO and similar are big proponents of them still and they are not as common as they once were but I still see them on new bikes and that is what I am counting here not just certain new bikes.
Tubes come in every single bike so not dead. Yes things are increasingly going tubeless ready but everything still comes with tubes.
Essentially yes things are maybe less common on the high end but there are tons of new bikes with some of this stuff. It is not dead yet. I think if we talk about high end only then everything said would generally be true but this is a thread on just new bikes technically.
I assume people are talking about things no longer on bikes of the type and price range they are looking at buying.
I would take “tubes” as meaning tires/rims that can’t be run tubeless. For obvious reasons, manufacturers can’t ship them tubeless, but as I pointed out earlier two recent bikes, we bought actually came set up tubeless. No tubes included.
08-10-23, 07:16 AM
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Well since literally anything is out there if you look hard enough, this becomes an exercise in silliness.
I assume people are talking about things no longer on bikes of the type and price range they are looking at buying.
I would take “tubes” as meaning tires/rims that can’t be run tubeless. For obvious reasons, manufacturers can’t ship them tubeless, but as I pointed out earlier two recent bikes, we bought actually came set up tubeless. No tubes included.
I assume people are talking about things no longer on bikes of the type and price range they are looking at buying.
I would take “tubes” as meaning tires/rims that can’t be run tubeless. For obvious reasons, manufacturers can’t ship them tubeless, but as I pointed out earlier two recent bikes, we bought actually came set up tubeless. No tubes included.
08-10-23, 07:55 AM
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Surprising to me as well. In my experience with tubeless ready without sealant, it is pretty hit or miss how long they hold air. Some sealant is often needed to completely seal the bead.
08-10-23, 08:11 AM
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Suits me that the end is in sight for PF bottom brackets. Also QRs with disc brakes, the multitude of disc caliper mounting standards and frames that are limited to 23mm tires.
08-10-23, 09:21 AM
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Interesting. Are you a Giant dealer? I ask because a friend of mine bought a Liv Intrigue from a dealer in PA in 2020, and it had tubes in it. I remember I was miffed that they did not set it up tubeless for her, but she was too clueless to ask about it.. Maybe the dealer added tubes instead of sealant?
Surprising to me as well. In my experience with tubeless ready without sealant, it is pretty hit or miss how long they hold air. Some sealant is often needed to completely seal the bead.
Surprising to me as well. In my experience with tubeless ready without sealant, it is pretty hit or miss how long they hold air. Some sealant is often needed to completely seal the bead.
08-10-23, 08:27 PM
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Does it not make more sense to talk about things we might miss on our own specific new bikes? If your new bike has a quill stem then of course you are not going to miss quill stems. But there are zero bikes of the type that I ride that still use a quill stem, so I could possibly miss them right? It doesn’t matter whether or not they are still used on other bikes that are not in direct competition. Another example would be a 2x mtb drivetrain. I’m sure they are still out there, but not on any mtb of the type and price point I ride. So I could potentially miss 2x mtb drivetrains right?
Oh and just to repeat that not every single bike comes with tubes. Order a mid-range Giant and chances are it will arrive set up fully tubeless with sealant.
Oh and just to repeat that not every single bike comes with tubes. Order a mid-range Giant and chances are it will arrive set up fully tubeless with sealant.
08-11-23, 12:21 AM
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A great cost-effective option for that MTB/roadie you want to convert to a utility/commuter bicycle. No need to put a costly set of shifters/brifters on one of those bicycles.
The old screw-on freewheel gear clusters were a PITA to remove, cassettes work much better!
I like QR wheel attachment systems, just easier to get on/off to fix a flat. Square Taper bottom brackets, rim brakes, cabled brake & shifting systems all work fine and are easy to maintain with a basic set of tools.
The old screw-on freewheel gear clusters were a PITA to remove, cassettes work much better!
I like QR wheel attachment systems, just easier to get on/off to fix a flat. Square Taper bottom brackets, rim brakes, cabled brake & shifting systems all work fine and are easy to maintain with a basic set of tools.
08-11-23, 12:28 AM
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This is a GREAT thread! I was thinking of making a LONG list of things without looking at the replies, bu I couldn't resist reading through it, which brought back so many memories!
Steel rims and crappy centerpull brakes. YOWZA! in the rain!!!
Downtube friction shifters.
Here's a few of mine that no one mentioned yet:
Steel rims and crappy centerpull brakes. YOWZA! in the rain!!!
Downtube friction shifters.
Here's a few of mine that no one mentioned yet:
- "Safety" brake levers! Ha, so lame they made cycling MORE dangerous!
- Upturned road handlebars.
- Rusted-in-place front derailleurs.
- Firenze! NO, NOT THAT!!!!!
- Crappy stamped sheet metal pedals.
- Friction stem shifters.
- Overhauling coaster brake hubs!
- Accidentally stomping on a metal toe clip and having it bend down onto your pedal and having to stop to bend it back up. (But those trusty toe clips & straps saved my life when I was 16. I almost ALWAYS jack-rabbited my starts. At a red light, I fumbled my toe clip and had to hesitate. A second later, a MASSIVE early 70's land yacht went BLAZING through the red light at what seemed like 50mph. Had I did my usual start and not fumble my toe clip, I'd probably have been killed.)
- Learning that barcon shifter internal wedge bolts are REVERSE thread!
08-11-23, 05:32 AM
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Flat bar grips that are not lock-on grips.
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08-11-23, 05:39 AM
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I cannot believe that Giant is actually putting a bike in a box with sealant in the tires that could sit for months and months. I could see maybe them doing it without sealant sure but it just seems silly because you could easily have a nice flat tire leaking fluid into the box and ruining it and other boxes quite easily and causing a major nightmare headache for a shop or end user.
08-11-23, 08:34 AM
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No I’m not a dealer. Just own a 2019 Giant Defy and found out that’s how they ship them. I would guess this particular dealer fitted the tubes as it would seem a bit odd for Giant to supply road bikes fully tubeless and MTBs with tubes. But maybe they do, I don’t know. Maybe the dealer just ran out of sealant. 2020 was that sort of year!
08-11-23, 07:21 PM
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08-12-23, 08:07 AM
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08-12-23, 08:26 AM
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But the Buddha didn't ever see bicycles. Those QRs levers are all about attachment and I can tell you (and the Buddah) that it is when that attachment to the front wheel ends that your suffering starts. On the other hand (and yet another of life's little dichotomies) that QR allows that wonderful detachment after a flat happens. (That mystical moment of "ah ha!" that so moved a certain Ernesto Campagnolo so many years ago.)
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08-12-23, 11:09 AM
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But the Buddha didn't ever see bicycles. Those QRs levers are all about attachment and I can tell you (and the Buddah) that it is when that attachment to the front wheel ends that your suffering starts. On the other hand (and yet another of life's little dichotomies) that QR allows that wonderful detachment after a flat happens. (That mystical moment of "ah ha!" that so moved a certain Ernesto Campagnolo so many years ago.)
08-12-23, 12:35 PM
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08-12-23, 01:32 PM
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08-12-23, 03:39 PM
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I know that but wasn't far enough into my first cup of coffee. I was pretty sure I was wrong but wasn't going to bother to duck duck it. (And besides, I knew I would be corrected and all set right!)
08-12-23, 03:40 PM
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