carleton

The reason I suggested LOOK is because they have a lot of experience and they publish their geometries. When in doubt, do what people who have more experience than you do. You may not understand why immediately, but chances are, they did those things for good reasons.

I don't understand what the builder means by brittle. The only way anyone is going to break a steel frame is in a wreck.

Maybe this is a language translation issue. Maybe he (or you) are trying to say "harsh". Stiff frames can be very harsh on bumpy tracks. You can adjust your comfort with tire pressure, saddles, carbon forks, carbon seatposts, and carbon bars.

Ideally, you don't want any flex.

But, understand that you are smaller than most, so you won't need the same stiffness as a Jason Kenny. So, stiffness is relative to the rider's size, weight, and strength.

You just need a bike that is stiff enough for YOU.

This probably won't be your last bike. You may design it and keep it for years, but you will buy more

The best-designed bikes are the ones that are designed after you ride several and develop a style and preference. You probably won't get the geometry perfect this first time.

I've had 3 frames designed from scratch...and each one of them I would do something different. I would even change the latest one I had made. That's just how it is

gycho77

Thank you for your tips
I will start with L96 geometry and fix the geometry little by little
Maybe the frame builder might build another frame(sponsor) for me haha

So I said the frame will be brittle because....
The frame builder told me their are two types of cooling style(for BB area) fast cooling and slow cooling(not professional vocab..)
fast cooling helps the frame to be stiff, but it will crack when there is too many stress, so he recommend me to add mini stay like Moth Attack track frame.
Slow cooling(using sand to cool the frame) will have more flex than fast cooling, but it takes more stress.

I talked to my friend about the frame design and we came up with using Max fork tubing ln chainstay, seatstay and fork.
So it will be STIFF lol

carleton

The #1 question is: Can you make too many stress?

queerpunk

I knew a guy who kept cracking frames, but he was big, heavy, strong, and very powerful (ie multiple time national champion).

gycho, you will not break a frame unless the frame was damaged when it was being built. "more likely to crack" doesn't mean "likely to crack."

tobukog

Just because it's a well established company, it doesn't mean that they've thought out their geometries. Especially for the small sizes. I once had a Look road frame where the widest tire you could fit in the rear was a 19. The top tube was 54 on a 48 frame. I remember having to pull forward every single corner during Super Week so you could weight the front enough on entry.

I'm pretty suspicious of a 43mm rake on a track bike -- it seems like the wrong solution to reduce toe overlap. I've never ridden a track bike with 43mm rake, but I'd guess that it just wouldn't be stable enough. Parallel 74 also seems out of place on a small frame: I'm thinking 72 or 73 with a 75/76 would seem more common, with shorter rake -- 40 or below.

Toe overlap isn't that important: it's just one of those things you have to learn to live with as a shorter rider. I've never had any problems with low speed maneuvers on the track and I'd much rather have good handling and good fit over getting rid of overlap (which is impossible to do). If you're really concerned about overlap (and I can't remember the last time I was actually in a track standing battle of consequence) another option would be to run 150 or 160 cranks. I remember there was a really good sprinter (Trey Gannon?) who used to run something absurdly short. It might even help you get lower and improve the top part of your pedal stroke.

Small frames are almost always really stiff, but I wouldn't worry about breakage at ADT. If you break it, it's probably because you drop it or crash your bike.

gycho77

I'm sure that I am not going to crack the frame. Maybe I might crack the frame after 10 years or not lol
And I am not going to let Carleton try my bike because he will crank my frame in one standing start hahahaha

Koogar

Hey gycho - One more suggestion. You might consider seeing if you could postpone the frame fabrication a bit, say until maybe the beginning of next season. Getting more track time on your existing bike(s?) will help you figure out where you could benefit from a custom frame. Seems like somewhat of a wasted opportunity to get a custom frame that replicates stock geometry with a few changes based on guesses about what you might want.

gycho77

Thanks for the tip!
That's what I am trying to do right now.
Anyway I am not paying for the frame, so I am not in hurry.

grav.digr

wow,
a high school student w almost no time on the boards goes to get a custom frame built by an experienced builder and the builder defers to the student to design the frame geo. call me crazy but this seems absurd.

gycho77

I know this sounds crazy haha
I was finding a sponsor to help my team(SCI-Arc architecture college 5 year program), but a frame builder was interested helping us.
Also I really don't know why he want me to design the geometry instead of recommending me a frame geometry.

Also funny part of Korea is unless you are not a Keirin racer or olympic racer, you cannot use a velodrome.
Therefore, average people like me doesn't know anything about training programs and they don't have any experience on the track.
So I am actually an experienced rider in Korea hahahaha

BTW The frame builder is not interested in advertising his brand.
He just want to try something new.
When I visited his shop he said "I really don't care about advertisement. I just want to know your goal. And this project sounds fun."
So I told him my goals.

I was really surprised when he was interested in helping me.

Remember this
Nothing is impossible. You just have to try it.

carleton

Sounds like 2 nice people met in the universe and a nice thing happened.

Flatballer

Anyone have experience with road/track swappable wheels? It looks like Pro-Lite makes wheels that can be swapped, rear at least, without too much trouble.

Does anyone else make them? Has anyone used them? I guess the different tire choices might make it a little annoying anyway to have one set (I use GP4ks on the road, but Supersonic on the track), but it could save some money if you race both road and track.

Dalai

Front wheel just use a bolt on skewer. Rear wheels -Zipp 900 disc is also convertible.

Tyres is the biggest issue. I have used Vittoria Evo CX tubs on the road and track which seems a reasonable compromise between speed and durability.

gycho77

You are the best!

700wheel

Apart from frame stiffness flex can occur in the components you use including cranksets, bb (including axle torsion), bars, stem, steerer tube, and of course wheels.

If you search the web you can find stiffness tests performed on components (usually road components).

Here in Colorado (and maybe other venues) USA Cycling sometimes checks track bikes before events using a bike check fixture; so make sure any frame you might obtain complies with UCI dimensions.

gycho77

Thanks for the tips
For most of my components, I did a lot of research about the stiffness and other.
So I think I don't have to worry about the components.

Also with the UCI rule
I made a translated version(Korean) of UCI rule for the frame builder, so the frame complies with UCI dimensions.

Thanks

jt_uk

This seems like the best thread to ask as the weight lifting section is very specific to lifting.

How are you guys dealing with the leg mass in regards to fitting into trousers? Being a shortie my legs and ass are getting too big to fit into trousers for my waist, I curbed my training for a few months but got out of shape and started training again. Lo and behold I've started gaining mass, stylish trousers are skin tight and in warm weather its so uncomfortable.

Does anybody purchase trousers from a specific website etc that caters for this type of physique?

carleton

This is something that weightlifters and bodybuilders deal with a lot, and there are a lot more of them than trackies. Maybe search around on the bodybuilding forums.

I'm a fan of Levis. Some of the variants of their later styles (541) have a "stretch" option that makes them sort of stretchy and forgiving. Also look into skateboarding jeans and khakis. Those also have stretch to them.

1incpa

Definitely go for jeans that have a relaxed fit.
I wear carpenter's jeans and they're the only jeans I've ever worn that I can buy my waist size instead of buying larger so they fit my thighs.
Besides, they have that handy pocket on the leg for your phone.
PI

queerpunk

I'm far from a big dude but my butt and thighs do struggle a bit with pants that fit my waist.

Stretch is key. And, lighter material - thinner denim, etc.

There are a few companies selling athlete-specific gear that has a small waist and big thighs (Keirin Cut Jeans), for example, but those are niche products.

queerpunk

You can have my slim fit trousers when you pry them from my cold dead hands.

1incpa

lol!

jt_uk

Went shopping today for a new pair of slacks, tried Next, H&M etc, no joy, either too baggy or too tight. I need a tapered leg as I'm short and it makes me look better (I'm single ). The problem is when in summer the tight fits allow heat to build up in ones nether regions and it can get a bit sweaty .

1incpa

I've been wearing Wrangler relaxed fit carpenter's jeans and been pretty happy with them. They do have wide cuffs though, so you may not like them. But they do fit nicely over work boots.

carleton

Look into Levis 541 (Athletic) Stretch. They fit the bill for me. I own 5 pair (was time to buy fresh jeans for work basics).

Lots of colors and waist sizes are available in 1-inch increments 31-42". They have 18 different colors. I think they are going all in with this cut this season.

541? Dark Blue Athletic Fit Men's Stretch Jeans | Levi'sŪ



I've found mine at Macy's. The price varies. I won't pay MSRP. If they don't have them on sale one week, I'll try back after a week or two and there will be a sale. Levis at Macy's are weird like that...for decades. Usually like 1/3 off MSRP somehow. Either straight 1/3 off or buy 1 get one 1/2 off (same thing).