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HEY! New bike in the stable. 1973 Raleigh International.

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HEY! New bike in the stable. 1973 Raleigh International.

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Old 11-13-20, 09:32 AM
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Nice bike. I like this shot - bringing home a cool bike is a great feeling. Hard though, to keep your eyes on the road.




Do you plan to keep the tire savers? I just picked up a “new” bike too with the front tire saver mounted the same way and was told that was backwards. I’m not so sure if that’s right but I never used them BITD. From the photos below, it looks they were both originally mounted that way. It does look like they could wad up into the front brake but I really doubt it. Thoughts?


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Old 11-13-20, 09:50 AM
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Back in the day, the instruction sheets showed the flint catchers mounted as shown in the instructions.

That Masi needs a cleaning.
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Old 11-13-20, 09:57 AM
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Originally Posted by majmt
Do you plan to keep the tire savers? I just picked up a “new” bike too with the front tire saver mounted the same way and was told that was backwards. I’m not so sure if that’s right but I never used them BITD. From the photos below, it looks they were both originally mounted that way. It does look like they could wad up into the front brake but I really doubt it. Thoughts?
I bought a bike once with the front one mounted in front of the brake, and although it makes sense it is not as aesthetically pleasing as on the inside... I haven't ridden with them either way, but I imagine if you have something stick to your tire that's large enough to push that whole assembly between your fork and into the brake caliper, you'd be having other problems anyway!

-Gregory
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Old 11-13-20, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by repechage
Back in the day, the instruction sheets showed the flint catchers mounted as shown in the instructions.

That Masi needs a cleaning.
Thanks for the info and it will get a nice clean-up for sure, but that’s the way it came to me - that’s probably 40+ year-old vintage road schmutz. The cleaning and refresh is going to be a labor of love.
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Old 11-13-20, 11:12 AM
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what the heck is a tire saver
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Old 11-13-20, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by the sci guy
what the heck is a tire saver
I had the same question earlier. The wire thingies mounted above the tire in the two photos above. Meant to flick stickers and debris from the tire. I remembered seeing them but never used them. Sorry for the tread drift.
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Old 11-13-20, 02:13 PM
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Wore through plenty of tire savers in my time. Standard equipment when running tubulars.
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Old 11-14-20, 07:24 AM
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^I have a couple of sets of those tire savers in my parts stash. I have never put them on bikes that I regularly ride. I took them off the bikes I bought and never thought it was worth having them on . Maybe I should try them?
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Old 11-14-20, 07:36 AM
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I cannot remember which British cycling book or interview this came from, but at one time U.K. cyclists would fit a strand of leather that would stretch loosely across the tread of the tire and accomplish the same thing. The term I remember was “flint catchers,” which is also an alternate term for tire savers. IIRC, it was suggested that a notch be cut in the middle of the leather flint catcher so that should something seriously snag the leather would snap without creating a hazard.
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Old 11-14-20, 08:17 AM
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Nice find John and thanks for posting and producing the excellent youtube vids.
I have watched many of your vids and envy your bike shop.
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Old 11-14-20, 12:36 PM
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I have a 1974 International I bought as a frame and fork. I got it with nothing but primer on it, so I had to paint it. After I built it up, the words “long and lanky” came to mind to describe the experience. I can’t think of a bike in production that is light as well as long and lanky. The fork is lighter than any steel fork you can buy now. I understand bike makers don’t want the liability that comes with making a light steel fork.

I built mine with practicality in mind, not at all true to the original.

I also have a 1971 Raleigh Super Course. The 3 main tubes are straight gauge 531 and the rest is generic carbon steel. The bike is a little heavier than an International but to my legs, it rides pretty much the same, and the weight difference is barely perceptible.
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Old 11-14-20, 01:02 PM
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I also have both - My International and Super Course Mk II are both from 1974. The Super Course has rapid-taper chainstays so, in addition to the three main tubes, at least part of the rear triangle on that bike is Reynolds too. The weight difference between them (as assembled bikes) is about 1.5 lbs. Under straight-line conditions I'd challenge anyone to try and tell them apart, but on a rapid curvy descent, the International comes into its own and is a real joy. Maybe it is the response of the thinner walled tubes to irregularities in the pavement or that the wheelbase is an inch shorter, but going into and out of turns I can definitely tell the difference. I love riding that bike!
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Old 11-14-20, 01:33 PM
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My main reason for eventually wanting an International rather than a Super Course is because it was available as a 24.5" frame, while I've had to settle for an inch larger or smaller with the Super Courses I've owned... The International in fact comes in my ideal size!

Otherwise, yeah, can't complain much about the quality of the Super Courses I've owned and ridden. Very nice bikes.

jjhabbs I forgot you make the videos and missed this over earlier. Thanks again for sharing the bike so thoroughly! Really looks lovely.

-Gregory
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Old 11-14-20, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by noglider
I have a 1974 International I bought as a frame and fork. I got it with nothing but primer on it, so I had to paint it. After I built it up, the words “long and lanky” came to mind to describe the experience. I can’t think of a bike in production that is light as well as long and lanky. The fork is lighter than any steel fork you can buy now. I understand bike makers don’t want the liability that comes with making a light steel fork.

I built mine with practicality in mind, not at all true to the original.

I also have a 1971 Raleigh Super Course. The 3 main tubes are straight gauge 531 and the rest is generic carbon steel. The bike is a little heavier than an International but to my legs, it rides pretty much the same, and the weight difference is barely perceptible.
Of the time Reynolds made "taper gauge" forks and stays, as the diameter decreased, the wall thickness stayed constant.
The shop I worked for had a nice Reynolds sample set with cutaway tubes, fork blades and stays to show the difference.
More recently, the EU has strength requirements which most of the world (Asia) has adopted.
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Old 11-14-20, 09:41 PM
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Raleigh international

Originally Posted by jjhabbs
Hey guys, It's been a while. 2020 was a lean year for new bicycles for me. The collection didn't grow much. I did finally purchase a 1973 Raleigh International. Its in great shape. I love the Capella lugs on it. Please check it out!




It’s screaming out for a Red Label Fiamme wheelset!
I have a 1971 International, full Campagnolo Nuovo Record Group. Only weighs 21Lbs.







I have 36H Red Label on rear and 32H Yellow Label on front. The new Vittoria Corsa Graphene tubular tires will be like Silk Road.

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Old 11-14-20, 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Pcampeau
jjhabbs I’m going to guess that in your collection there are likely some other bikes with Nervex Pro Lugs. Actually, if I recall from another one of your videos you have a Chrome 72 Paramount, so that’s one. I think it’s good that you got the Capella version, it helps add some variation...plus those lugs are beautiful! I know in my own collection I’ve got four different bikes with Nervex Pro Lugs and I’m starting to look like a one trick pony. Granted, it’s a good trick, but I tend to look for other types of lugs now.
Yes. The 72 is nice. As I said in the video, Ive had others that I were about to purchase to find out that they were damaged or in bad shape. I was surprised at the condition when I actually saw it. The original owner was a nice guy and really took care of it. I enjoy the nervex. The ones with the nervex were somewhat built better. The 73 has all sorts or flaws in the brazing. Bike boom rush! lol

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Old 11-14-20, 10:46 PM
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Originally Posted by majmt
Nice bike. I like this shot - bringing home a cool bike is a great feeling. Hard though, to keep your eyes on the road.




Do you plan to keep the tire savers? I just picked up a “new” bike too with the front tire saver mounted the same way and was told that was backwards. I’m not so sure if that’s right but I never used them BITD. From the photos below, it looks they were both originally mounted that way. It does look like they could wad up into the front brake but I really doubt it. Thoughts?




Hey, I worked in a shop in the 80s and we sold tire savers all the time. Some would want us to mount it on the front "backwards" where the tire saver was actually under the fork crown. They worked either way. It was a nice gimmick that actually worked. However weight weenies and those that dont like the subtle rubbing sounds didnt like them. Dont know how effective they really were. The concept was that they would knock debris off the tire before it had a chance to work itself into the tire to cause a flat. Im probably going to keep these. Not sure if Ill have them on this bicycle.

Thanks JJ
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Old 11-15-20, 06:16 PM
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I'll probably get booed off the forum now, for the story of destruction I"m about to tell, but when my wife and I got married in the summer of 1970 my parents bought us bikes-- a 23.5 International for me, 21.5" Competition for her. No particular reason for those two models except those were the two best bikes the shop had at the time. In the meanwhile, I rode the International a lot, until the paint was pretty messed up. It never rode right, nor in a straight line, which I attributed to the two fork blades being obviously different lengths, then just bent differently so the ends lined up. :-) it was also really too large for me, since I'm long in the legs, short in body. She didn't ride hers much, and about 15 year ago when fixies came in, I stripped the International and gave the frame to a friend for his son to paint and build a bike on, and moved a lot of the fittings over to the Competition, which I continued to ride commuting until the point where I felt I just couldn't risk getting it stolen, and now it's up on blocks, and was followed by a series of uninteresting bikes that I've mostly forgotten, currently a $200 single-speed flip-flop "fixie" in the freewheel mode, which is fine for my 11 mi RT flat Chicago commute, in the process of being replaced by a State Bicycle Co twin of the Competition (couldn't resist). . . . if it ever arrives. . ..

Anyway, what I wanted to say was I don't know if the actual year of either is 1970, but the sickly-green International was laid back, with a lot of fork rake; the Competition is tighter all around-- a different bike, and more fun to ride. Otherwise the frames were similar, with Campy ends and beautiful Nervex lugs.
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Old 11-16-20, 09:17 AM
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@mdarnton, I think what you did is fine, especially since your International was defective. As we say here often, workmanship on Raleighs of that era was very inconsistent. Some were pretty good, very few were excellent, and some were gawdawful.
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Old 11-16-20, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by noglider
@mdarnton, As we say here often, workmanship on Raleighs of that era was very inconsistent. Some were pretty good, very few were excellent, and some were gawdawful.
.

My '73 Competition Mk. II would be a good example of that. The long prong on the lower Capella head lug stands proud with maybe 1/8 with no solder beneath it; the lugs are innocent of file work; finally, the rear brake cable stop is around 3 degrees off from horizontal. Fortunately, in the category that counts the most, it rides superbly, and I can forgive a lot when the ride is that nice. Oddly enough, its sibling the '73 Gran Sport was put together quite neatly and it was only later in its career that it acquired that dragged-behind-a-burning-tank look.
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Old 12-17-21, 08:52 AM
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There is a 73/74 for sale on Craigslist Minneapolis, right now. Has gravel tires. $400.
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Old 12-17-21, 10:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Curehead
There is a 73/74 for sale on Craigslist Minneapolis, right now. Has gravel tires. $400.
Yours?
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