joninkrakow

I've hinted in other posts here, about a bike I used to ride years ago. It's the Raleigh Touring 14 (also known as the Rampar Touring 14). As near as I can date the bike, it is most likely the 1979 model (I bought it used from another student). It was my "car" during college, as well as some camping trips, and later, as my commuter to work, and just riding around. At one point, however, I got hold of a Cannondale road bike, and gave my Raleigh to a good friend of mine. He was a champ and told me that if I ever wanted it back, I could--and has, in fact, on more than one occasion offered it to me. Well, I recently discovered a cheap way to get it shipped from Ohio to Krakow, Poland--about $75 all told. This is where my predicament comes in. My friend was a champ to keep the bike, but as his pics will show---well--time hasn't been too kind to the poor baby.

Hence my searching for advice. The rust looks pretty bad, but it's mostly surface rust. When I bought this bike, there was a lot of rust, as you see here--on the spokes, components, and other bits and pieces, as well as the frame (It's been repainted twice). However, the fork looks horrible, as does the rear freewheel. (Although, I have a more modern pair of wheels I can put on it, so that's no big deal. My question is this.... Is it worth bothering sending this bike over from the US? I should add that I have looked and looked, and asked and asked, and touring bikes, like this, just aren't to be found here, nor are front racks, randonneur bars and bar-end shifters (I would absolutely die if I had to use brifters or downtubes--I am happy with friction--besides, road bikes don't have room for fenders and larger tires, nor braze-ons). I'm about 90% to saying "yes" to the deal, simply because even if I decide that the bulk of the bike is a "no-go" those three items alone, were I to buy in the US and ship over would cost more than to have the entire bike shipped (the shipping agent doesn't do small packages, so shipping just the parts would cost more!) Beyond that, I'm kind of attached to this bike. :-)

However, some of you folks here have dealt with some pretty rusty hulks. Do you have any advice? Is it worth the $75 from what you can see here? Is there anything I can do to the front fork to rescue it, or is it a goner? TIA for any advice. :-)

(Oh, the biggest shame? The once-beautiful genuine leather Avocet touring saddle.)

Pictures:

treebound 

Ouch.

My opinion? Find a different bike in better condition to replace that bike with. You'll probably be ahead in the game when done, unless that specific bike has some very special sentimental or historical value to you.

From my vantage point I can only see sadness and regret if you have it shipped home and begin to work on the bike, might even lead to problems with your feelings towards your friend. I'm thinking it's best to let it go, keep your good memories of it, keep your friendship, and find a replacement bike to ride.

I recently found a used Schwinn LeTour and have found it to be a nice sentimental replacement for a bike I had years ago and swapped off to a friend. Mine was a 10 speed, the replacment is a 12 speed, mine was friction downtube shifting, the replacement is indexed downtube shifting and I think it has a friction option, mine had 27" wheels, the replacement has 700c wheels, mine was red, the replacement is a blue/black fade. In the end I'm happy, the replacement reminds me of the days of old (if you can call the 1970's old), and the late 1980's updates to the replacement bike makes for a very nice and enjoyable ride.

My suggestion: delete the rusty pictures from your computer and save the nice memories of how the bike used to be. Others might have differing opinions and suggestions.

Hope this helps a little.

joninkrakow

Thanks for your thoughts, and actually, they do help. I'm definitely leaning in the direction you have suggested, but there is one line of thought that I have started thinking... This bike is equipped with some things I have been unable to find at any price here in Poland, namely the bar-end shifters, the randonneur bars and that front rack (I am partial to the higher rack that can hang panniers, or carry something, and such racks are just not available here). Also, I've been wondering about totally redoing the wheels with a new cassette in the back and a dynamo hub up front, and having two sets of wheels for my bike--whichever it would be. But is it even worth the $75 it will cost to ship the entire bike here, tossing all the rest? To me, asking him to strip all the parts I want is just asking too much from him. It's a tough call....

rhm

The frame geometry in the first photo bothers me a little; is it possibly bent?

I cannot assess the rust damage from photos. But since you're attached to the bike, I'd try to save it. Can you visit the bike in person, or have a good mechanic inspect it and determine if the frame and fork are straight and sound, before it gets shipped? If so, I'm sure you can have it sand blasted and painted in Poland, upgrade a part or two, and you'll have a great bike. But note, I said "if." That's the important part.

Erzulis Boat 

My view-

Every bike is different, and I would get the real one back. I managed to get my oldest brother's Paramount back (the original one) but probably lost forever my second oldest brother's aero tubed Faggin with full SR panto

You could get a "duplicate" but it is not the same, every bike has a soul (I don't actually believe that......but I do).

Swap the fork and restore her!

Never mind my ramblings, I am in a hurry to fix a CNC tool changer, and I am posting quick like while I drink some coffee.

tolfan

$75 from the U.S. to Poland is way cheap. you want it , you can aford it, bring it back home. The fork looks realy bad get a new one.

KarmicPedals

If you have put this much effort into to deciding whether to let it go or have it shipped to you -- spend the $75 for the peace of mind. You'll always regret letting go of it -- and ending up spending lots more in attempts to replace it.

joninkrakow

Thanks everyone for your input. Here are my (I hope) final thoughts. This bike has some things on it that I really want:

1. The bars--I really miss my randonneur bars
2. the bar-end shifters--These seem to sell for about $50 themselves, and mine are branded for Raleigh, IIRC
3. Front rack (old Blackburn made for this bike, but can be put on my current ride)
4. Those 40 spoke Mavic double-walled rims--this may be a wash. I can't remember if they are 700c or 27". I have a vague memory that they are 700c, but if not--well.... ;-)

This is only for the parts if the frame is bent. I've asked my friend to send me a closeup of the head tube where it meets the down tube, but he hasn't sent me the pic, and it's been a month, so I will just have to go with the expectation that it's been forced from my accident when I broke my collar bone--I rode the bike for a year or three after the accident, so I can't imagine the damage being too bad, but after 10 years of rusting, I seriously doubt I can trust it, so I may just have to let it go.... alternately, I might clean it up, and just keep it for _very_ light neighborhood riding, and look for a "real" frame for my commuter. Problem is, good, touring frames are impossible to find here, and that's what my 6'2" frame really needs. I may have to break down and buy myself a Surly LHT. :-D

So, thanks again for everybody's input. If you have any serious doubts re: my thoughts, please feel free to continue to speak up.

-Jon

rhm

I'm changing my vote. I am now against saving the frame/fork.

I looked at the photo of the rack; you're right, that's a cool item. But the same photo shows the bottom of the downtube right at the top lug, and: the paint is blistered and the frame is rusted. I'm almost 100% sure the frame is bent.

My brother lives in Berlin, and a few years ago he went to a bike store and bought a touring frame; it was basically a generic frame, made in some former-east-block country to his specifications, chrome-moly, and remarkably cheap. That's probably your best bet. Have your buddy ship you the parts you want off the Raleigh, and build up a new tourer.

treebound 

I'll throw a monkey wrench into the discussion here with a suggestion. Many of us folks in this C&V section of the site do a lot of our own work so there might be someone in the area of where the bike currently is who might be able to pick up the bike and remove the parts you want to keep in exchange for keeping what's left. Or they might do it just as a favor.

wrk101

+1 Find someone local to Ohio to pull the desired parts, and ship them. Frame issues probably make the entire bike a non-starter.

joninkrakow

Yeah, that's been a concern of mine myself... it's odd, I seriously can't remember the frame being bent, but maybe that's because I didn't want to. ;-) I'm glad you pointed out that picture. I looked in other pics I have, trying to see if the frame was bent, and somehow, I missed this one. I opened up the original, and it is clearly "forced". :-(

Here's a question. I know that everybody writes off a frame that is bent in this location, but what is the genuine danger? Is it possible to have a catastrophic failure? or is it more likely to go slowly? I ask, because I had a friend years ago who slammed into a parked car (he was looking at his rear derailer at the time), and bent his frame worse than this--he rode the bike for 5 years with that bent downtube, and never had a single problem. Personally, I'm not too keen on learning on my own body with this frame, considering my Clydesdale weight, ;-) but I'm curious what the dangers of this damage is.

If only.... Poland has become surprisingly expensive. We've had visitors from London, Frankfurt and even Scandinavia who have been shocked at how much more expensive things are here--but I may just start asking around about frame builders. Some things are still quite cheap here--including labor. Good idea.

Now, for the _real_ question.....

Anybody in the Wooster, Ohio (he's actually several miles west, off of US 30, I think) area who would be willing to strip this bike of its handlebar, shifters (don't need the stem), front rack and wheels (only if 700c), and keep the rest? I really don't know what genuine condition this bike is in, so I can't guarantee any of it, but you can have whatever is left. :-) Anybody crazy enough? You can PM me.

And once again, thanks everybody for your input/advice.

-Jon

rhm

First hand experience: practically nil.

Second hand experience #1. My brother (same one) had a Miyata that he loved, and he crashed it in the manner you describe. The bike was no longer rideable; the front wheel wouldn't clear the frame! The bike shop applied the appropriate Park tool and straightened that frame perfectly, or nearly so; after which he continued to ride it. But while it was out of service he'd bought a new one, and after the Miyata was fixed he still preferred the new bike. I don't know what ever happened to the Miyata.

Second hand experience #2. My first ten speed was a Raleigh Record, and after I sold it the frame broke under the new buyer. The guy riding it said he hit a pothole, heard a funny sound, and after that the bike just felt strange, like it had gone all "sproingy". But it was dark, so he rode it home, where he noticed the damage: the downtube had popped out right of the head lug! So, to answer your question, the failure was not particularly catastrophic on that particular occasion. But obviously you don't know what's going to happen in your case.

But if, as you say, labor is cheap; and your frame needs painted anyway; and if you find a frame builder in Poland, then you may be able to have the downtube and top tube replaced for a fraction of the cost of a new frame. Heck, you may even be able to upgrade to butted Reynolds 531 or something!

cappuccino911

Stumbled on this old thread, is the OP still around? I wonder what he decided to do with it? sounded like he was leaning towards getting rid of it but getting the parts.

joninkrakow

Yeah. That's what I did with it. I ripped the rack and handlebars from it, but a few months ago, I finally got to see the bike with my own eyes. The headtube and downtube _were_ forced, and worse, the whole frame was so rusted that I couldn't see it justifying cleaning up. Also, most of the parts were also useless. It's been outside in the elements for several years, and since some of the parts on the deraileaurs (sic) were steel and horribly rusted, I didn't see anything left worth salvaging (besides what I already took), so I told my friend to junk the rest. He may still have it, though, but I don't know. But honestly, I don't think there's anything left that's salvageable.

-Jon