I'm currently riding a nicely built Gazzetta, but am getting the itch for something that has a bit more personality to it. I like its geo and stiffness, but find the steel and frame to be a bit bland and uninspiring. Lugs would be huge plus, but not an absolute necessity. A horizontal TT is the only thing I'm probably set on aesthetics-wise. I like the Soma Rush, but my 1 1/8 carbon fork can't be used with it. The Godzilla checks a lot of my wants, but the color, and price to a degree are putting me off from it. Am I limited to a Wabi at this point? Not opposed to the more relaxed geo or slightly more flexy ride, but those aren't the reasons I'm looking to upgrade for either. FWIW I'm 5'7" with a 30" inseam. All my components are black. Are there any used frames that I should check out?


Looking at the AllCity Big Block, I'm kind of digging the bottlestays and lack of toe overlap. It looks like their steel is just a different butted variance of cromor, for the most part, which is the same as my gazzetta. I'm sure it rides different, but at the same time if I'm spending upwards of $700 for a different frame, I want to make sure it's an appreciable difference. I really like how the Tange rides on the Soma mixte I built for my wife, so I see what a difference in having better steel makes. Sorry, just thinking out loud.

I don't know of anything that has lugs and a 1 1/8 HT besides Wabi. I'm not gonna shill for All-City too hard because their steel isn't magic, but the craftsmanship on their frames is a step above what I'm used to seeing at the pricepoint and I like mine a lot. Aside from Soma, I was also considering a Cinelli Vig steel when I was shopping for a frame, though I really don't like the paint job on that one. There really aren't many nice steel FG frames on the market right now, except if you're willing to get spendy.

i feel like the gazetta is just as nice as the framesets you listed. it's light for a steel frame, well made, and has some nice details.

also, the black friar colorway is imo the nicest variant cinelli offered on the gazetta, and hard to find now a days.

if i had to nitpick the unicrown fork is lack luster but you already upgraded that .

i just can't really see any other mass produced frames being much of an improvement. maybe try to score a nice lugged njs frame or go custom?

wanted to add these two sites, they always have some interesting framesets available that i personally enjoy drooling over:

https://kuromoribikeco.com/

https://www.tracksupermarket.com/frames.html

The Mash steel frameset?

https://www.mashsf.com/news/mash/mash-steel-ss-frameset

How's the geometry on the Big Block compared to my Gazzetta? I'm wanting something just a bit more relaxed/comfortable in the cockpit for longer rides. Outside of feeling a bit cramped in the back end of my current frame mainly due to its aggressive geo, I feel it fits me very well. My Gazzetta size is the XS and am looking at the Big Block in 49, which has a +15mm difference. I know All City sizes their bikes a bit wonky however. Should I be looking at a 46cm frame instead?



Gazzetta



Big Block

Head tube and seat tube angles are pretty much the same either way. The 15mm longer top tube on the 49cm Big Block is a pretty significant change, but that seems like it would be tempered slightly by the longer head tube -- raising the front end effectively reduces your reach a bit. The 46cm has the same length top tube as your current frame, but a shorter head tube, so it could wind up feeling more aggressive. Your bike seems to have a pretty low front end as is, so you might want to try bringing it up a bit if you want more comfort on longer rides. Not a bike fit expert by any means, but that's my two cents.

Right on. I just threw a couple more spacers under my stem and moved my seat back a tad as my ride felt a bit excessively cramped and "leggy" yesterday. With the front end raised a little, I should now be able to spend more time in my drops too. Thanks for the help.

Good luck! Bike fit is tricky business, I tinker with it a lot.

My Big Block is a 55 and I generally ride a 57-58, so they do run big. I really enjoy mine and you are correct about toe overlap not being an issue. I'd say the geometry is fairly aggressive but it is in no ways twitchy. I've had risers on mine and drops but I currently have drops and I like it.

I'm glad to hear this. With all the positive feedback I've heard about the big block, I actually am now in contact with a bike builder and will be building one around the BB's geometry During this process, and thanks to [MENTION=9822]sea[/MENTION]u, I discovered that the bike I'm currently riding is way too small, but figured that buying a new big block would still be somewhat of a lateral move. So I figured I'd rather buy once, cry once, and have a bike with the lugwork I want as well as getting a proper fit with it. I called around to several All City dealers in my area and none of them were much help so I said screw it, I'll figure it out myself.

How do you guys like your BB's for 50+ mile-ish distances, at slow speeds, and down descents? I have a 15 mile route that I normally do that I really like sprinting through, but I occasionally extend it to a slightly longer ride which is 45 miles which has two hills at either end.

I ride my Big Block anywhere and everywhere as it is a very comfortable ride. I have 32mm tires on it and it handles even gravel like a champ. I find it very comfortable. I have a nice broken-in Brooks saddle on it and nice padded bars so I feel like I can go a long distance in comfort.

I hear you on the lugs though, I'm a big fan of lugged bicycles and most all of my geared bikes are lugged steel. Good luck with your new frame and make sure to come back with photos when it is finished!

Yeah, I looked into it a bit into the past. It's one of those things I would pay someone to do (next to wheel building and maybe derailluer tuning).
It becomes much more important as you get older and you can really damage things if you're putting pressure in the wrong places.
Less important on things like MTB (Because you're probably not going to be in one positoin for like 8+ hours striaght).f

I used to think "wtf really?", "I had a roadbike fixie conversion that was like way too small for me and it was fine", then I rode a century fixed and weird things started getting sore in weird places, and I had to take it seriously towards the last 20 miles or so and adjust myself every few minutes, and take it slow, etc. Permanent tendon damage can happen at those distances.

I decided to go custom, met with the builder monday. He just sent me this pdf of his mock up per our discussion. Going with a lugged steel frame. The tubeset he's going to try and source is called Pegorichie or Columbus "Spirit for Lugs". Does anyone have any info on it? I found this during a brief google search a second ago

Richard Sachs: "We needed to develop a tubeset for lugs."

Cool! Who's building it?

https://www.cbcycles.com/custom-frame-work/

It's guy that's local to me. I was a bit hesitant at first since I didn't see many complete frames on his website or insta, but when I arrived at his shop and met with him, my worries were put at ease. He seems extremely competent and his shop was filled with an insane amount of old frames and tools.