boycott mars

Ok, i take it back.
Even if the local stuff sucks and costs more, buy it anyway.

you're keep taking things to polar extremes.

let's be a little more moderate, how about it? let's say that you should buy local because it supports the local economy, keeps things down to a more human level (buying from a guy that you're talking to in person vs. an email to the builder that lives halfway across the world), and helps the people who are building good stuff in your own area.

not necessarily saying if your local stuff is poor quality then you should buy it anyway. i'm talking a local builder that can put his heart and soul into a handmade piece of art vs. the guy that can do similar stuff halfway across the world. note that this is the rational argument, the emotional one would go more like "the grass is greener on the other side; the japanese lust after cinelli and the americans love nagasawa...".

An argument I could buy is: shipping stuff from across the globe is taxing on the environment.

stop thinking at a global level. no one of us has any personal relationship with the global economy. yes, as a whole we can affect and be affected by it but what matters is your person to person relationships.

when you buy a custom bike by the guy in town you're creating a personal relationship. the money you worked hard for has been exchanged for a bike your builder has worked hard for. that money might go to his child's education, it might go to their house payment, it might go to paying for beer.

think locally, make connections with your community. think INSIDE the box. spend inside the box. its all karma baby.

Why does someone who lives near you deserve your business more than say, an Italian builder? I like to find what is best for me, and buy it. I do not care if it is made in Melbourne (home) or abroad.........

this "buy local" stuff is straight up American thinking, Mercien deserve your business just the same as jonny cycles. It should be about buying whats best for you, and if you want to get deep, help the little guy.

"buy local" is hardly limited to America.....been to a super market here lately?

+1
Im not trying to save the world one frameset at a time.

If im riding down the road and thinking damn this frame sucks, whats gonna comfort me? The fact that some local builder was able to pay rent or buy a big screen TV?
**** that.

Its all about ME when i spend MY money.

But if you spend in your own country, it benefits you. If you buy from an oriental frame builder, that money is spent in his country. If you buy a local, the money goes back into the country and fuels the economy.

I'm not saying that I don't buy outside of Canada, but I try to make an effort to at least buy stuff at locals stores over orders on the internet. Plus, if I buy something from the local stores, they put it on for free. I also will always have the joy of going into a bike shop and seeing whats new. You won't have that if you keep using the internet as a crutch. I like being able to actually ride a bike before buying. If everyone just ordered off the internet, no local stores would exist, and then everyone would be complaining.

Its 9 in the morning and this is incoherent.

why, you're inscrutable!

I agree with Deathhare, with the exception being food.

I guess we're back to where you and i were before. If this were a respectable country...

But I would probably have the same attitude in America. Your country gets better if you spend money in it. Obviously in America less money will be spent on cool things, but regardless, the country will get better.

What do you mean by, 'get better'?

More money going through the system. Change can be made in a country if the economy thrives. The more money you spend in your country, the better it gets. Look at places like Africa with very little economy, and very little change.

I know it seems a little out of the question in America, but who knows what will happen with more money running through the system. For a common example (I don't know how the american tax system works), but the money you spend goes to that guy, gets taxed. Then his money that he spends gets taxed. That money goes to building, lets say, roads. Better roads means less potholes, less potholes means less money on tubes, tires, and truing your wheels. Smooth roads are funner to skid on. So you win that way.

Maybe i just dont have faith in it all here.

make the world a better place

spend more money

thank gwb

omg, me me me! i'm teh centerz of teh univerz! bow down *****ES

by the way, people capitalizing ME and MY has got to be one of my biggest pet peeves, just for the record. it's like, we know you think you're special, don't need the extra empasis.

The whole American economy is built on everyone consuming consuming consuming.

Let's see how long that lasts...

But seriously, buying local makes sense to me just as long as what you want is available. It's also rational because won't be paying money on extra shipping, customs tax etc. And at least a little bit more ecological as someone said already.

Also, I'd be super happy and proud to ride a great bike made here in my hometown, if those existed. But they don't.

Obviously thats not what i meant and youre taking it way too far. Im just saying that when i spend MY money I'm thinking mostly about ME .
Not the people im buying from.

don't worry, i was just joking hence teh sweet internetz talk.

oh, andre-poo...youre insatiable!

i'd pretty much bet your frame is "oriental"

um, there's way more 'new stuff' on the internet than any lbs. frankly, my browsing of bf not only leaves me completely unimpressed/somewhat frustrated in brick and mortar stores, it also keeps me a bit more up to date than most of the folks running them.

um, if you can ride it before you buy it, it's definitely not what this thread is about, and is most likely, again, "oriental"

lol @ perpetuating this fallacy that canada's some kind of wonderland... dh just misses japan. there's only 3 cities in canada that i'd voluntarily live in (vancouver, montreal & toronto), and i wouldn't choose any of them over at least 5-10 american cities, maybe more as 2/3 are way too cold.

seriously, your government may be more responsible/commendable than ours, but it really doesn't show in daily life... there is definitely as many backward ****s in canada as there are in the US. it's all snobbery and myth and completely supported by self loathing americans.

unless the cool things you're talking spending on are labatts beer, maple syrup, ham that gets called bacon for some reason, or beavertails, i'd guess we're buying the same exact stuff, and producing quite a bit more of it than canada.

and very not japanese

You are missing the point of my post.
1) It doesn't matter where my frame was originally constructed, If I buy from a local guy, the money stays in my own country.

2) Its not whats new, its just that I can go to a store and PHYSICALLY hold something. I can see things that I wouldn't normally lookup on the internet. If you can't understand the importance of a LBS then you should stop posting.

3) Again, Physically holding.

4) I never said anything against America, Dr. Literacy. You're fragmenting what I said. America is so anti socialism its crazy. Canada is commendable for efforts that we have made. Example: All humans have civil liberties, not select ones, like in America.

5) I meant the government would spend money on cool things, Dr. Literacy. You know this, don't you? I.E spending the money on education, healthcare, roads, sustainability, etc?

You give Canada this simpleton rep. We don't call our ham bacon. We call ham that is cooked on the grill and sliced one centimeter thick 'Canadian Bacon'. Bacon is still bacon. Obviously you haven't been to Canada because everyone drink Lakeport, Noob. Maple syrup is delicious, and crushes that aunt jamima **** you eat in the suburbs. LOL.

This isn't anything against the japanese builders or people. They can have fun, but I was simply criticizing people who think it is absurd to buy anything local. But of course, you know this, right?

Get an oxygen tank, dude.