2 choices:
Pretty beat-up, apparently handmade Montagner track frame

OR
Bridgestone track frame with lots of paint chips

the Bridgestone being about $100 more

Any pictures of the bridgestone?

Are the frame even the same size? Buy which ever one fits you the best. You can always put new paint on it if looks are that important to you.

Bridgestone

$100 more? Considering how much a decent new TIGed steel track frame sells for these days, I wouldn't pay $100+ for either or those rust buckets.

Hhahaa, such a cynic.

TIGed steel is so eh next to any lugged frame.

I agree...rusted out metal-fatigued overpriced junk is so cool and because there are lugs it cannot break and it makes you feel more connected to the road or whatever.


But seriously, be wary of any old used frame. Contrary to the myth that steel lasts forever, it does not. You have no idea about the extent of metal fatigue. Either of those frames could last 20 more years or they could crack within 100 miles. Factor that into what you are willing to pay. Otherwise, find a new(er) frame that stands a better chance of going many many more miles.

Nah, none of that, I was just saying lugged steel looks better than tigged.

bridgestone.

I know this is a widespread opinion, but I've never really seen it that way. I have to squint to even see the lugs in those photos. IMO its kind of absurd to spend big bucks on an old beat up frame just because it has these rather inconspicuous lugs that 99.9% of all people would never even notice on your bike.

Maybe, but it doesn't really matter what 99.9% of other people think. I'm saying, in my personal opinion, lugs look better than stacked dimes, and tubes are easily replaced on lugged frames should one be damaged.

how many people with lugged frames do you know who have replaced a tube?

srsly. i would just get a new frame...

Considering the average price of a Bridgestone is running these days. You could buy a brand new frame. Id get a new frame unless the cost on one of those is just to good to pass up but after hearing the Bridgestone is $100 MORE, I would look elsewhere.

You're right I could afford a new frame, but I'm really looking for something that is preferably handmade, traditional looking, and meant for the track, and NJS frames seem like the answer (but yea they are so ****ing expensive).
Suggestions?

No thanks on NJS frames, unless they are fairly new or rebuilt.

What is your budget? I bet we could help you find a nice new frame if we knew what you were willing to spend.

Also, what are you looking to get out of the bike? In my opinion, the point of a handmade bike is to get something that is tailored to you. Buying a used handmade bike is noce but you are not getting the biggest benefit from going handmade. Having the bike personalized is why most people go handmade. That way you get the geometry you want, the look you want, the color you want, the braze on's you want, etc, etc, etc. I would recommend straying away from used NJS frames for teh fact you do not know the history behind the frame. It could have been wrecked, the previous rider could have been a brute and fatigued the metal quite a bit.

I'm looking to spend up to arond $800, but custom isn't exactly what I need, or want, since they go for 1 to 2k. I guess I want handmade because I'm assuming it's higher quality than factory-made and at a higher standard. Really just want a traditional, track geometry, frame with good tubing. Of course handmades always a plus

So my question to you now. Is $200 dollars really to much extra to spend to get a custom bike built for you? You will get what you want and have a one off. Just something to think about. If your willing to spend $800 on a used frame, why not save up a little more and get something new and custom?

Im not knocking your decisions here. Just trying to let you in on a little info and gather information.

Yeah, but are the benefits of a custom frame all that many? I can adjust my seatpost height , use a longer/shorter stem to compensate for the TT and ST length (for the most part). I'm looking for a lugged, track geometry, and there are plenty of frames with 74-5 degree ST and HT angles. And finding decent tubing isn't too hard. So does spending a few hundred dollars more really help that much?

The benifets to a custom frame are much more than tailored ST and TT lengths, you get a custom geometry designed just for you and how you want you're bike to handle. You get to control every aspect of your bike. Just be sure to get a professional fit done before hand.

I have to agree that 800 is a lot for an old used frame. If it we're NOS it would be different.

But I think I'm ok with normal track-geometry handling, that's why I'm not too eager to get a custom frame. I'd rather spend that extra on a really nicely made one.
How do these look: https://www.bikyle.com/Track.asp
specifically the Look, Felt TK2, and Torelli
they're all sub 800
Torelli is first choice for looks