14 Bike Co. Frameset
12-06-09, 09:04 PM
#1
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14 Bike Co. Frameset
this thing looks incredible. aero 853 tubing, very cool looking, hand made. what's the catch?
it is £1000. or, $1650. for the frameset.
it is £1000. or, $1650. for the frameset.
12-06-09, 09:13 PM
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this thing looks incredible. aero 853 tubing, very cool looking, hand made. what's the catch?
it is £1000. or, $1650. for the frameset.
it is £1000. or, $1650. for the frameset.
Also, why not just get an aluminum frame? $10 says that this thing feels the exact same as a FTP or pista concept. That steel is drawn so thin and the tubes are so fat that it's going to have a lot more vibration than skinnier steel tubes.
12-06-09, 10:13 PM
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Why?
Seriously. Why?
This bike solves no problems yet creates a big one...high cost. $1,650 for a Pista Concept / Vigorelli knock-off made of steel.
"Andy at FGLDN based the concept on a couple of frames he had owned in the past." I'll bet a dollar to a dime it's based on a Pista Concept.
"Many times this has been mistaken for Aluminum." Yes, That's because you copied an Aluminum bike.
"14 & FGLDN believe steel has soul because of the skill and time that goes into making a frame like this." Riiiiight. "soul". Because "steel is real" but doesn't exist on the periodic table.
There is a reason why this isn't popular and it's not that anyone hasn't thought of this before. As ATX stated before the tubes will be very thin to be just as light. Thin steel tubes may buckle under shock or load.
Seriously. Why?
This bike solves no problems yet creates a big one...high cost. $1,650 for a Pista Concept / Vigorelli knock-off made of steel.
"Andy at FGLDN based the concept on a couple of frames he had owned in the past." I'll bet a dollar to a dime it's based on a Pista Concept.
"Many times this has been mistaken for Aluminum." Yes, That's because you copied an Aluminum bike.
"14 & FGLDN believe steel has soul because of the skill and time that goes into making a frame like this." Riiiiight. "soul". Because "steel is real" but doesn't exist on the periodic table.
There is a reason why this isn't popular and it's not that anyone hasn't thought of this before. As ATX stated before the tubes will be very thin to be just as light. Thin steel tubes may buckle under shock or load.
12-06-09, 11:35 PM
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I kind of like that thing. Unfeasible concept designs please me greatly.
12-07-09, 12:47 AM
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Aside from their looks and copying, their tubing, Reynolds 853 is supposed to be good stuff, Reynold's high-end tubing that's stiff and light:
https://www.worldclasscycles.com/JACKSON-HOME.htm
https://www.worldclasscycles.com/reynolds_853.htm
https://www.worldclasscycles.com/JACKSON-HOME.htm
Reynolds 853 is a high strength, 210,00 psi, heat treated, air hardened steel alloy. Careful control of the alloying elements combine to give these tubes enhanced mechanical properties surpassing other materials currently available.
The main advantage of Reynolds 853 is its ability to air harden after joining, a characteristic not shown by other chrome molybdenum / manganese molybdenum materials presently on the market. When building frames using either TIG welding or high temperature brazing, above 1600 degrees, the joints increase in strength as the frame cools to room temperature.
LUG CONSTRUCTION IS THE PREFERRED METHOD OF JOINING 853. It allows a much larger area to be heated than tig welding which concentrates the heat to a very small area at the weld. This completely goes against the “AIR HARDENING” building philosophy of the material and adds nothing to the strength of the joint. It is however a much cheaper joining method, requiring less time and skill to perform.
Due to the superior mechanical properties of 853 tubing, there are several benefits which will translate directly to the cyclist. The wall thickness of 853 has been reduced to 0.4 mm, a full 0.1 mm thinner than Reynolds other top of the line 753 tubing. This translates into a frame weight of under 3 pounds 5 ounces for a 56 cm frame (less fork). Because of the added hardness of this alloy the chances of denting the tubing are no greater than that of present materials being employed. The final significant advantage is the increased stiffness of the frame and its ability to transmit all of the cyclist power into forward motion. The oversized 853 tube set, with its oval chainstays represents the ultimate in power transmission. Aside from the 853 OS tubeset, conventional diameter sets are available which will allow for a more comfortable ride, while still retaining most of the benefits associated with 853 oversize.
The main advantage of Reynolds 853 is its ability to air harden after joining, a characteristic not shown by other chrome molybdenum / manganese molybdenum materials presently on the market. When building frames using either TIG welding or high temperature brazing, above 1600 degrees, the joints increase in strength as the frame cools to room temperature.
LUG CONSTRUCTION IS THE PREFERRED METHOD OF JOINING 853. It allows a much larger area to be heated than tig welding which concentrates the heat to a very small area at the weld. This completely goes against the “AIR HARDENING” building philosophy of the material and adds nothing to the strength of the joint. It is however a much cheaper joining method, requiring less time and skill to perform.
Due to the superior mechanical properties of 853 tubing, there are several benefits which will translate directly to the cyclist. The wall thickness of 853 has been reduced to 0.4 mm, a full 0.1 mm thinner than Reynolds other top of the line 753 tubing. This translates into a frame weight of under 3 pounds 5 ounces for a 56 cm frame (less fork). Because of the added hardness of this alloy the chances of denting the tubing are no greater than that of present materials being employed. The final significant advantage is the increased stiffness of the frame and its ability to transmit all of the cyclist power into forward motion. The oversized 853 tube set, with its oval chainstays represents the ultimate in power transmission. Aside from the 853 OS tubeset, conventional diameter sets are available which will allow for a more comfortable ride, while still retaining most of the benefits associated with 853 oversize.
12-07-09, 01:12 AM
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It's silly to spend that much on an off the peg frame, you could get a custom geometry Yamaguchi or similar for the same price or less.
12-07-09, 10:02 AM
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12-07-09, 10:17 AM
#12
Your cog is slipping.
Boo-yeah!
12-07-09, 10:19 AM
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Man, talk about a fishing expedition for clueless consumers. 1650$!?! Holy Crap.
12-07-09, 07:59 PM
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pedallingATX, i think you didn't get the point. i was trying to say that the catch was the ridiculous price.
here was my e-mail i sent to prolly about this:
....i guess i'm just kinda pissed that the "fixed-gear culture" is becoming more of a "fixed-gear market" revolving around endless consumption of expensive stuff, and to me, putting out a $1650 frameset then acting like that's a good thing kinda seemed insulting. i mean, there's almost no medium quality stuff in the fixed-gear market nowadays, and what i see is the market splitting in two directions: independent, creative people making boutique items at sky-high prices, and bikesdirect putting out $300 taiwanese catalog bikes. there's no real middle ground, and i think that's ridiculous.
so, that's why i posted my formulaic hater comment. but seriously.. this street fixed-gear thing is a "culture" based around consumption, which is enough of a Bad Thing, let alone having to pay either $300 or $3000 to gain entry, with no real middle ground.
:-(
of course, boutique companies can't operate on the economies of scale big enough to make things affordable, unless we have a TON of local boutique companies in every local area. the big bike companies have completely dropped the ball on what people want, as well. so...
here was my e-mail i sent to prolly about this:
....i guess i'm just kinda pissed that the "fixed-gear culture" is becoming more of a "fixed-gear market" revolving around endless consumption of expensive stuff, and to me, putting out a $1650 frameset then acting like that's a good thing kinda seemed insulting. i mean, there's almost no medium quality stuff in the fixed-gear market nowadays, and what i see is the market splitting in two directions: independent, creative people making boutique items at sky-high prices, and bikesdirect putting out $300 taiwanese catalog bikes. there's no real middle ground, and i think that's ridiculous.
so, that's why i posted my formulaic hater comment. but seriously.. this street fixed-gear thing is a "culture" based around consumption, which is enough of a Bad Thing, let alone having to pay either $300 or $3000 to gain entry, with no real middle ground.
:-(
of course, boutique companies can't operate on the economies of scale big enough to make things affordable, unless we have a TON of local boutique companies in every local area. the big bike companies have completely dropped the ball on what people want, as well. so...
12-07-09, 09:18 PM
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Dude, the same thing happend with sneakers (among other things). The sneaker game used to be about *finding* the rare shoes and still paying MSRP (or less) for them. That was the real sneaker game. Then some folks (ahem...rich kids) decided that they were too lazy to search around, establish relationships, and actually have taste for cool stuff and they just throw money around to buy game. The thing is, the game that's bought is only recognized by others that buy game. So, it becomes a "I can spend more than you" contest. Lame indeed. But, hey, if you want to pay $200 for some of my *used* sneakers that I paid $80 for...who am I to not separate a fool from his money?
12-07-09, 09:32 PM
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luno, i don't think you reallly know what you're talking about. The price point for FG bikes isn't "split" b/w two ends. There is a bike at nearly every price point. Cheapest ones are from bikesdirect, then you can get IROs then steamrollers/sputniks/fujis/pistas/etc. Then above that you have custom framesets. There are also soma rush, alien, etc. So, wtf are you talking about?
give me a price and i'll name at least one production bike/frame that fits that price. Also, did you seriously write that letter to prolly lol?
give me a price and i'll name at least one production bike/frame that fits that price. Also, did you seriously write that letter to prolly lol?
12-07-09, 09:58 PM
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Alright... I'll bite. I've been looking for a new frame, but I'm looking for geometry, specifically steeper geometry. I'm looking to spend about $500 for a frameset and I'm currently riding a Kilo (but looking for something more track specific, as I'd be taking it to the track).
I should note that I'm looking for steel only.
If you can find me a decently track geo frame for $500, thanks [whoever said we could name a price and you'd give a frame]
I should note that I'm looking for steel only.
If you can find me a decently track geo frame for $500, thanks [whoever said we could name a price and you'd give a frame]
12-07-09, 10:27 PM
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Dude, the same thing happend with sneakers (among other things). The sneaker game used to be about *finding* the rare shoes and still paying MSRP (or less) for them. That was the real sneaker game. Then some folks (ahem...rich kids) decided that they were too lazy to search around, establish relationships, and actually have taste for cool stuff and they just throw money around to buy game. The thing is, the game that's bought is only recognized by others that buy game. So, it becomes a "I can spend more than you" contest. Lame indeed. But, hey, if you want to pay $200 for some of my *used* sneakers that I paid $80 for...who am I to not separate a fool from his money?
damn, now that you mentioned it.. i made bank buying and selling NikeSB's 3-4 years ago.
12-07-09, 11:40 PM
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i didnt write a letter to prolly
i made a funny hating comment on his post like "oh rich kids"
then he replied to my email like "hey thats not nice"
so i was like "here is why i said that" which is what i posted here
and then he said "im feelin that bro rad"
PATX, i suppose you're right. but i think it's stupid that this scene is almost more based around buying and spending as much as you can rather than just riding bikes around. i guess what i meant to say is that the market is split between "uncool" people who don't customize their bikes that much and keep them mainly stock, and then people who change out every single part on their bike and spend $3000 on their NJS barspin bike.
i made a funny hating comment on his post like "oh rich kids"
then he replied to my email like "hey thats not nice"
so i was like "here is why i said that" which is what i posted here
and then he said "im feelin that bro rad"
PATX, i suppose you're right. but i think it's stupid that this scene is almost more based around buying and spending as much as you can rather than just riding bikes around. i guess what i meant to say is that the market is split between "uncool" people who don't customize their bikes that much and keep them mainly stock, and then people who change out every single part on their bike and spend $3000 on their NJS barspin bike.
12-07-09, 11:51 PM
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Alright... I'll bite. I've been looking for a new frame, but I'm looking for geometry, specifically steeper geometry. I'm looking to spend about $500 for a frameset and I'm currently riding a Kilo (but looking for something more track specific, as I'd be taking it to the track).
I should note that I'm looking for steel only.
If you can find me a decently track geo frame for $500, thanks [whoever said we could name a price and you'd give a frame]
I should note that I'm looking for steel only.
If you can find me a decently track geo frame for $500, thanks [whoever said we could name a price and you'd give a frame]
12-08-09, 02:35 AM
#25
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here was my e-mail i sent to prolly about this:
....i guess i'm just kinda pissed that the "fixed-gear culture" is becoming more of a "fixed-gear market" revolving around endless consumption of expensive stuff, and to me, putting out a $1650 frameset then acting like that's a good thing kinda seemed insulting. i mean, there's almost no medium quality stuff in the fixed-gear market nowadays, and what i see is the market splitting in two directions: independent, creative people making boutique items at sky-high prices, and bikesdirect putting out $300 taiwanese catalog bikes. there's no real middle ground, and i think that's ridiculous.
....i guess i'm just kinda pissed that the "fixed-gear culture" is becoming more of a "fixed-gear market" revolving around endless consumption of expensive stuff, and to me, putting out a $1650 frameset then acting like that's a good thing kinda seemed insulting. i mean, there's almost no medium quality stuff in the fixed-gear market nowadays, and what i see is the market splitting in two directions: independent, creative people making boutique items at sky-high prices, and bikesdirect putting out $300 taiwanese catalog bikes. there's no real middle ground, and i think that's ridiculous.
you get points for being more articulate than the typical high schooler though.