Wife and I have been touring with 2 rear panniers each. Just getting two Bike Fridays, and are planning a short 7 day tour in Thailand.

Low cost airlines, so 20kg check in [which will be bikes, suitcases and some spares etc] and 7kg carry on. Just got the brilliant idea of two ultralight backpacks as carry on, and using the same bungeed onto the rear racks for the tour. So, no weight of panniers at all in the flights.

Any reason that this would be a bad idea?

I can't see any reason why it wouldn't work.

I'd use straps rather than bungee cords because of the weight. Bungees are ok for relatively lightweight items.

Try the idea on one bike before you go and if you're happy then ok.

Didn't get what you meant by straps? The ones used around suitcases? Any links?

I think it should work. Just have to make sure that the backpacks are reasonably protected from rain.

Excellent idea. Double duty for as much as possible.

Are the backpacks going on top or on the side of the rack? I would never use bunge to hold anything on the side of a rack. But a nylon strap like those sold for holding sleeping bags onto frame backpacks could work. The reason for my dislike for bunge is that there are bumps on the road and I do not want that much flexibility in the attachments.

But, it depends on the backpack and rack, some backpacks do not have enough places to run a strap through which may allow a strap to slide on the pack. And some racks might not work well if the rack would allow the pack to slide around.

This is the type of strap I am talking about. You pull that tight and hit a bump in the road and the pack should stay with the rack instead of bouncing around.
https://www.rei.com/product/380197/pa...buckle-40-inch

A duffle strapped on top of a rack can be quite useful and that is quite light and can hold a lot. I would also bring one of those. Or put the backpack there.

I have some very cheap panniers that cost very little and weigh very little. I really think you would be better off with panniers. I brought one of those panniers with me to Europe (from USA) last summer where I used it on a bike that a tour group provided. Only one shown in the photo, but the pair weighs only 1,240 grams.



If you decide to strap or bunge backpacks onto the rack, you might want to take along some small diameter nylon line (rope) as an emergency backup if your bunge or straps prove to be insufficient.

https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/luggage-s...5-cm-prod6967/

BF Trailer-suitcases should come in handy , rather than a storage burden
like a regular suitcase, left luggage, some-where.

panniers for convenience. short trip may not even need any,
stuff your carry on in the suitcase when you take the bikes out.
maybe a convenience..
So, you wont have to open and dig in the suitcase for daily, mid ride, needs..

I have the BF front rack on mine, for daily use, no rear rack.
The Low trail nature of small wheel bikes like these, functions well with front loads.

My Brompton too, better, it seems, with packed touring bag, than without.
stability is gained.

I Hook on a trailer for larger loads, either/or both bikes.

Something from here to hold it on the rack. Otherwise, good idea.

Good bungees will secure a light backpack to a rack just fine. Two, criss crossed. The hooks make them very convient to use.

Ross from PathLessPedaled has a video on this: https://vimeo.com/26700747 Might be helpful!

Go to RayJardine.com He got a lot of what passes for ultralite backpacking going. He has done a bunch of tours with just his regular backpack as luggage. Most recently he did the TransAm about 2010, as well as walking the adirondack trail about twice that year. I think he is either slowing down or taking a break, because the last few year he has done motorcycle trips.

https://rayjardine.com/adventures/2010-TransAm/index.htm

You do have to keep in mind that he was in places where he could either buy bikes or get them fixed easily, and regularly buy food. There are a variety of ways to get your load way up, then panniers are a good idea. There are also not very strenuous trips for which panniers are no particular bother, and the extra stuff may be useful.

Wow, thanks guys. Lots of suggestions there.

I guess I'll order some straps and try strapping the backpacks on top o the rack. Just bought the backpacks. 950 grams, 37 liter capacity. My Ortliebs are 1700 grams and 40 liters, but with the backpacks, I save on the weight of 2 sets of panniers on the flight. Thats 3.5kg weight for other stuff.

Never knew that straps could be so varied :-)

An alternate perspective: make sure your bags stay out of your spokes. Make sure they stay attached to the rack. Make sure you don't have any flapping straps. Make sure they don't move around.

Personally, I would pay for extra luggage/overweight charges rather than spend a tour with gear that didn't quite work. Sagging, leaky, bouncy bags that mess up my bike's handling or make me crash are not worth it, IMO.

That's me, though.

Adding... either that, or just try to use fewer panniers, for a 1 week trip in Thailand you probably don't need to carry much at all. toothbrush & bathing suit?

I second the point of being careful of a setup that you are not familiar with, Ive had old panniers jump off or partly jump off my rack after hitting bumps on downhills, so would be a bit leery of the packpack on rack idea (mind you, the Pathlesstravelled video seems that it is well attached).
I guess in the end, you will have to try things out to see how securely you can hold it on. The obvious advantage is having your backpack as a nice daypack for all the times other than biking, good luck with finding a good solid solution (also second being super careful of straps and such that could get into the spokes, which would be a real hassle to deal with, even from the damage/repair point of view, and of course as mentioned, any sort of fall)

cheers

ps, a while ago I spent some time going through your trip journal of the south of France, a few years ago I camped for a few weeks in that specific area, so it was fun seeing your biking photos.

^^Thanks.

Just set up the BF rack, backpack and straps etc, and can confirm that it was a stupid idea of mine. The back pack is just too unstable to make for a safe ride. So, packing panniers too.

This method of luggage carrying has been used on small-wheeled bikes before with success. You may need a luggage rack with a larger surface and longer top.
I would use 3 straps in case one is lots or comes loose. You need to keep all those hanging straps under control.
When using the pack as carry-on luggage, you need a way of carrying all your forbidden carry items (eg toolkit) with the bike as hold luggage

Deepakvrao, this is what I did on a short tour with a BikeFriday. Instead of the BF rear rack that puts the load high and back I installed a cheap Sunlite rack with the legs cut down so the rack was low to the fender like a regular rack, no panniers possible. Then on the rack went this Jandd expandable bag. With the bag opened up it was about as high as the underside of my saddle. My heels cleared the bag because it was narrow. On your bike imagine the air space below your rack filled because a rack is sitting 2" above the tire . The Jandd bag is expanded so it follows the back of the seat post up to the bottom of the saddle.

https://www.jandd.com/detail.asp?PRODUCT_ID=FRRPII

On the front I hung a medium/small sized duffle bag vertically from the stem and strapped to the steerer that hung just to below the head set.
The rear bag could sway so I strapped a bungie over it to the rack and another two from the under side of the saddle criss crossing from the saddle rails to the rack. The whole package made for a solid handling bike with the weight well distributed and not cantilevered far off the back end. I'm guessing the total volume was close to what you have in that backpack and I could have carried more.

When gear was off the bike the rack pack was strapped onto the duffle using the duffle handles and a bungie. The duffle I used is the kind made out of recycled sail cloth, fairly stiff.

What I had set up was a NWT with a LLama front fork, had a 2.0" Big Apple on the front tire and a 1.6" Schwalbe Marathon Supreme. After the tour I used the bike frequently carrying tools using the BF front rack and panniers with the expandable Jandd on the rear rack. It looks like you have a NWT, pretty sure it can take up to 1.75" tires.

Take advantage of that front steerer, lots of area to put something. Just make sure it's solidly attached. 30 yrs ago I met a German fellow touring down the coast on a folding three speed bike, he had a frame back pack strapped against flat bars along the steerer and sitting on a tiny front rack. Looked ungainly but he wasn't in a hurry.

I googled around to find the cheap Sunlite rack but can't find it, it's got three vertical struts with the center having an adjustable solid rod inside the hollow strut. What I did was cut the slider off , drilled out the center threaded portion and used that to mount to the frame as the solid slider kept the tube from crushing. The bike could still fold down with the rack on.

Probably nothing to worry about, just another warning: https://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingn...gkok-yutthasak. I was in Thailand when the Bali bombing occurred. Watch out for the smog in Bankok.

Cool! I have a Friday on order now and was kicking around similar ideas, inspired by the Moulton luggage system. Deepak, you certainly could do it with panniers- probably 99% of the loaded Fridays I see on the internet use regular off the shelf panniers. But it sure would be nice to take full advantage of those little wheels. It would also be nice to have the backpack for off bike stuff, and why carry both backpack AND panniers?

I was going to point out that your experiment was with a rack a mile above the rear tire, and didn`t take that advantage until LeeG gave an even better explanation than what I had in mind, and even included a great idea to solve the issue. Another comment about the way you tried it in the pic above is that, with the backpack "face up", all the straps are free to get into mischief with your spokes (the flagging straps that Valygirl warned about). Simply flipping it over would help some, but it`s still mounted much higher than it needs to be. I like how the guy in the Path Less Pedaled video sat the backpack upright and made use of teh saddle to keep it from tipping. Glad I bumped into this thread- I was going to post a similar one in the folder section.

Here`s a picture I found on the internet featuring a (heavilly) loaded TSR in case you hadn`t seen how AM does it. Have fun!

I am seriously thinking of getting rid of my full size touring bike and getting a small wheeled folder instead and using a similar luggage system. Getting a full size bike to and from a tour is just too difficult. A small folder and easily carried luggage would make using buses and trains so much easier.

In what way was the rucksack too unstable? Was it moving on the rack, was the rack swaying or was it the effect on the bike handling? As said getting it lower may help and I think that due to small wheels luggage weight is probably further behind the rear axle than on a full size bike and hence getting some weight on the front may help.

I agree with Valygrl, having equipment that's not quite working can be dangerous and a total pain. However, I did carry a backpack (smaller than yours) strapped the way you show in the photo. I did get a thin waterproof stuff sack to keep all the straps and zippers under control. Then I used two straps (same as you) to thread through the loops on stuff sack and under the rack, then tied the lose straps together and tucked them in. It worked fine for a day ride, but wouldn't want to do it for touring. Having panniers will make your life so much easier when you want to take something out during the ride. I mean, will they really add so much weight?

And for the future tours, maybe with less weight restrictions, I found that New World Tourist rides the best with front and back panniers. Makes it for a very comfortable, stable ride. Just an idea.