@ green horn
I do believe you missed my edit (or are ignoring the information it holds):
First, please don't lie, how old are you actually? and how long have you been cycling and what has been your cycling experience/ the distance you ride normally?



If it is provisions are what you are worried about: where there is a road, there is inevitably something at one end or another of that road, and where there are places for people to be there will likely be people/ provisions/ shelter/ water/ ect... and if they/ you are nice, they will likely at least give you some water/ provisions or even a place to stay, or if its a clean water source a decent water purifier gives you unlimited water. That is sort of the core of cycle touring really. I would also say that if you are insisting on a bunch of food/ water with you, get a fork that has low rider braze-ons, a front rack, and get some decent bags and fill the bottom of them with several bottles with water [either nalgeene, or re-cycled soda/ juice bottles, whatever will fit in the bags] then put some food stuffs on top of that; not only will the weight in the front help distribute the weight much better but it will also leave better options for rear panniers/ stuff.

As for Spoke breakage, if you are on a 'normal' bike, and you load it up you should not have a single issue with spoke breakage even with a 100+ load of stuff. The problem with spokes breaking is that the wheels are often 'trued' well enough, but they are not stress relieved [some spokes will be taking more of the force] and either $20-50 for a good truing and tension, or $25 of good spokes and either your labor or a LBS/ wheel builder [for $70-100 probably] for a hand built properly tensioned wheel that should last tens of thousands of miles with little maintenance. If you are talking about your monstrosity, not much changes except you will want to get hubs, rims and spokes that would work for a hefty Clydesdale doing cycle cross or a similar impact type cycling, I REALLY doubt you would have to go past 36 spoke hubs. Also, replacing spokes is pretty easy, going out of your way with an abomination wheel to try and avoid spoke breakage is really silly [can you even field replace spokes on the rear wheel you are envisioning? I would hope so]...
You have seen some of the homeless/ rubber tramps around you, haven't you? they usually ride discarded Walmart bikes that have parts from tons of other bikes, they travel quite a number of miles sometimes, and thy can be over 200lbs themselves with at least 100lbs of stuff -one of the ones I've seen several times has a 5gallon bucket secured to the handle bars with conduit, it is loaded in the back as well! I don't think they have much trouble other than garbage parts and handling because of poorly distributed weight. And if they do have a mechanical problem they are using 'standard' stuff and can fix/ swap it out easily.



Also, if you are planning on a massive away-from-civilization cycle tour, instead of a beast of burden cycle, you should get a decent touring bike, then find a girl/ guy and have them get a decent touring bike and split the loads between you both: one tent, a ton of water/ food [MRE's and other decent food types as well], very limited clothing, some simple cooking stuff, matches [for campfires and campfire cooking], ultra light hammocks and a tent, and some other odds and ends [and that is pretty luxurious] not only will it be a lot easier on you, but also be much more enjoyable because of the company and the bicycle/ gear



In conclusion:
Either re-read this thread a few times to hear what the people are saying, and try to understand why and then take their advise and travel on either a lightly modified road bike, or a dedicated touring bike with a load that makes sense; or get your lazy self off the internet and start building the thing ASAP [and when you aren't building it you need to be riding a loaded bike around to get used to it, heck, ride the bike to a farther bike shop to pick-up parts for the bike you are building] then we can sit back and watch you learn for yourself what has already been told to you... you are wanting to go bike touring here, not tailgating off your bike at a football game [which is about the only thing a bike like you propose would be good for as its all about show and not function]

I'm dumb, just what are the common problems of which you speak? Poor handling, or carrying gallons or water and small stringed instruments.

well

you can pick only so many fights at once

I concentrate more on the positive and supportive group here

so if you want to be helpfull
tell me what is the max weight for the bike frame / whole bike / load
in your opinion

in reality
my proposition is a longer longbike
with slightly different geometry

air travel
panniers
wheel base
mounting water bottles
front wheel load

i'm not attacking you. No reason to be so defensive. Also, you didnt answer this from my previous post:

Also, what real life experience brought you to this idea?

I'm just curious what type of touring you'd done that would bring you to the conclusion you need such a large contraption as you called it? Again, I'm not against you at all, just asking.

those arent problems. Can you be more specific? Such as, what is your issue with air travel? Whats wrong with your panniers? Why dont you like your wheel base? Have you had problems with your front wheel?

ohh come on

this is not colossal humongous bike
it will have only extra 14 inches in length

never ending story

full bike in card boxes / oversize charges / what to do with soft or hard cases
etc. etc.

there is NOTHING wrong with panniers
I would simply COMBINE them into one container for air and land travel

OK it's not too large. Can you answer my question now?

which one ??

a need ANSWERS not questions

WHAT is wrong with building longer long bike ??

Most tourists don't have problems with any of the items you list......in fact you "one person tandem" solution would surely make air travel more difficult. I count you having 2 x AL cases for the bike etc, a duffel bag and a carry on. That's a whole lot of problems.

If you want to carry more water just use the clamp on bottle cages or carry it in panniers.

Front wheel load**********?? what's wrong with that**********?

OK I give up. This is like having a conversation with my 3 year old. It could just be that English isn't your first language so if that is the case my apologies. Otherwise, just make sure you have an extra compartment on your single tandem tourer to carry your lithium.

thanx anyway

next time try to be more supportive
or at least have a good argument against new idea

not everybody want to walk through the same path

i still have no idea what your new ideas are or where you are coming from. But in the future you might have better luck communicating them if you learned some social skills. I think I know why you have a tandem with one rider...

It's a PITA that's what.

I think people have given you a lot of great explanations as to why it's a ridiculous idea, but you seem to be dismissing each with accusations or generalizations that an inexperienced biker would make.

If you think a bike as you describe would be better, then build it. Ride it. Enjoy it. If you're just here to complain about how touring bikes aren't designed specifically for your needs, you're in the wrong place.

Isn't there a frame builder section of these forums? Maybe they could give you some more insight with specific details that we may or may not have already touched on.

Air travel is a pain and can be a large expense, I agree. I like the idea of a compact package that avoid oversize luggage fees and is a complete, portable solution. But then there's the cost vs. value. A big cost in your plan is in weight: a heavier frame with a heavier storage solution. They may save you some money in airport fees, but will you think it's still a good deal when you have that weight penalty for the rest of your trip? And how will the cost of building this set-up compare to the cost of shipping a full-sized bike?

You dismiss a lot of ideas as "old solutions" when apparently you want something new. I'm all for something new, but it also has to be something better than what exists.

Some solutions I've seen:

Bike Friday does this by making a smaller, folding bike that fits into a standard-sized luggage that doubles as a trailer.

S&S couplers and a soft-sided bag that can be packed and carried or shipped ahead.

A bike that is shipped separately for less than air travel rates in a disposable container.

Use airlines that are bike-friendly.

Take the train.

I'm always interested in other, creative solutions, and I look forward to seeing what you do, but I am in no way convinced it improves upon "old solutions."

I don't know what the pannier problem is. My problem is that I pack too much in them. Two hard cases that hold more than my existing pannier set up would weigh more and encourage me to pack more.

I also don't know that this a problem everyone experiences. I like the long wheelbase of my touring bike. I just don't spend a lot of time wishing it were longer.

I can mount 3 water bottles on my frame. I've seen solutions for adding mounts to the front fork and the handlebars, plus I've carried extra water in my panniers. If you're touring exclusively in barren areas where you won't have access to fresh water, it makes sense to make water carrying a priority, but even then it doesn't make sense to focus on bottle mounts. That's not the most efficient way to carry lots of water.

But the more likely scenario seems to be occasional riding through arid, sparsely populated areas. In that case, a frame designed to carry more water seems like overkill. Better you should have a versatile set up where you can stash extra water temporarily. Not a frame purpose built for those two days you ride through the desert.

Another problem I'm not familiar with. I carry more gear weight up front than behind, and I like it that way. Other people do not, but they also don't have to. Many people can get all their gear on the rear rack.

So I just don't know. A long wheel base bike that carries a lot of weight easily and packs small actually sounds interesting. But this particular solution seems to actually require that you carry more weight to make it work in the form of hard-sided luggage, and all in the name of solving problems I didn't know I had.

I look forward to the final product, but it's hard for me to picture it as something I'd want to try myself.

I have to concur that this idea is one of the more ridiculous concepts I've heard in a long time. So, here's WHY NOT.

• Weight. The cases could easily hit 10 pounds each; a tandem with S&S couplers adds at least 10 pounds. You could be adding 20 pounds just in luggage. And with so much space in the cases, you will undoubtedly be tempted to load them up with unnecessary crap.
• Bulk. What are you going to do if you have to lug this contraption up or down a flight of steps? Oh, and have fun getting to the airport with two 62" cases, loaded with 35 pounds of bike and who knows how much gear.
• Airport Cost: With two huge heavy cases, you'll get nailed with luggage fees coming and going.
• Build Cost/Complexity. Building a coupled tandem is, to put it mildly, not easy -- if you want it to hold up, you're going to need experience as a framebuilder. You'll also have to come up with your own coupled design, because you can't buy S&S couplers direct -- only licensed framebuilders can retrofit S&S couplers. And if you buy a new coupled tandem, that can easily set you back $4000+.
• Drag. 62" linear cases will be bigger than the biggest panniers, and will slow you to a crawl in any headwind.
• Design. Tandems are designed for a second rider; putting a pair of massive cases on the side is, undoubted, out of spec.

Oh, and I'd hope it would be obvious that if you don't build this bike properly, you could wind up in a crumpled heap buried under half a tandem and a pair of huge suitcases, and chewing on tasty asphalt.

Better solutions abound, as already evidenced over and over again in this thread.

Thank You for voicing helpful opinion

nice

really nice and very very helpful

done

but few people are supporting the whole idea
people who have experience riding solo on tandems

good point
but COMPARING with large trailer
the drag probably wont be that much different

Most bicycle tours don't employ a lot of air travel. I think it's very rare for a tour to have more than three air travel legs. Plus the majority are at the beginning and/or end of the tour. It sounds like you're going to be dragging around extra stuff everyday to "accommodate" what constitutes a very small portion of a tour.

Shouldn't be a problem for a strong 180 lb rider, like yourself.

+100 (This is an awesome thread!)

The fundamental problem here is that OP is trying to solve the problem of needing a bunch of extra luggage to transport his bike by making his bike bigger, which is never going to work. The amount of luggage required scales faster than the size of the bike. I would love to have a full-sized bike which can pack into its own panniers, really I would. I would also like to have a threesome with Scarlett Johansson and Keira Knightley. Both are about as likely.

I speak also as somebody who has experience traveling with an S&S coupled bike and panniers. In practice, you can't fit much more than the bike, a rack, and a repair kit in the 26x26x10 before you hit the 50-pound limit (and you'd better stay under 45 to account for variation in scale calibrations). It is perfectly simple to pack for an extended tour with that and two large panniers, one of which you check and the other you take as carryon. Leave the box at a hotel near the airport. Problem solved.