My typical ride is 25-35 miles 3-4 times a week. I do them all out cause 2 hours is about all the free time I have. So, I don't use anything other than HEED & whatever gel I can get my hands on. I find myself feeling strong at the end of rides. I'm rarely feeling depleted unless I was to begin with..I always follow up with Recoverite. Seems to work fine for me,

I know I need some protein among other things for longer rides. When I ride over 35 miles or 2 hours, I typically bring a bar of some kind with me.

So..is it marketing hype as far as Perpetum goes? Or is it worth it for anything over 2hrs as they say?

When you do use Perpetum, is it best to start with HEED for the first 2 hours and then switch to Perpetum or is the point of Perpetum that you need to replenish the protein and other lost junk from the get go so when you cross the 2 hour threshold you're not trying to replenish what's been lost and making up lost ground?

Thanks

Don't take this the wrong way, but...

Have you considered that riding 2 hours all out 3-4 times a week may not be the best way to improve?

I've been trying out Perpeteum and I'm pleased with it. Usually ride 1st hour with Heed, then Perpeteum afterwards.

Just watch out don't eat full lunches and snacks and Clif Bars too on top of the Perpeteum, or you're eating double. Which is hard to do, because Perpeteum only on a long ride is kind of boring.

I've used Perpetuem for awhile now and I feel that it lives up to the assertions made by Hammer. I recommend it. As far as usage goes I just use Perpetuem from the get-go. If that's a bit boring for your tastes you can of course supplement it with nutrition from other sources. Check the Hammer literature for more information - in my experience its been on target.

for a 2 hour ride I think you are doing fine. The Heed will give you the calories you need and the recovery drink will give you your proteins and carbs you need to rebuild. I don't think you need the perpetum unless you start upping your time and miles considerably.

If you want to supplement your Hammer energy drinks with protein, why not go with Sustained Energy instead? In the Hammer product line, SE falls in between Heed and Perpetuem. Per their literature, Perpetuem is targeted for extreme endurance events - 6+ hours to several days. Can you use it for shorter rides? Sure, but that's why they came out with SE. I'll add it to my Heed bottles for any ride over 2-2½ hours. This combo worked great on my 1st century last fall, too.

I use HEED when I am only doing <2hr rides and it does me good. I found Perpetuem in the early spring and all I can say is WOW! I shoot for 300 cal/hr (I'm a big boy) and I do use an occasional GU or Hammer Gel along with Endurolytes for the long rides.
I decided to go with this combo for a hard century ride in may, 8.5 hours nothing but Perpetuem and some GU with Endurolytes. I felt great after the ride. I did a 63 mile ride Saturday using the same combo in 3hr 14mins! This was my best effort ever! Then a 61 mile ride with friends this morning using Perpetuem. I find it realy cuts my stop time as I try and balance my caloric needs with my hydration and drink my energy by the clock.
I was getting stomach upset with the junk I was eating at stops along with the gatoraid. Hammer nutrition has solved my gastric issues compleatly. At first I thought it was sorta pricy, but after considering how much I was spending at convenence stores during long rides, it's a bargan!
Now for a down side. I don't think it taste nearly as good in the 90+ weather, but I suspose nothing does.

I give it a big thumbs up!

Perpetuem has protein in it which never makes it mix well, or handle heat well on long hot rides.
I stick with Heed regardless of length of ride, and add food/bars/gells/bloks to make up whats missing.

+1. Possibility of overtraining is likely. I found most improvement in myself to be with only one very hard day a week and the others days to supplement that. Improvement comes from recovery.

I don't really think so. -1 lol.

I find myself feeling strong at the end of rides. I'm rarely feeling depleted unless I was to begin with.

If it's the other way around, he would have asked differently.

I ride hard 3-4 times a week. That means I am getting 3-4 days of recovery as well. Sometimes it's not spaced out as well as I would like. I find no sign of my training (for life? I don't race) giving poor results since my stats are steadily improving. I'm riding faster, at a high cadence and I feel better each successive week.

What is overtraining? Doesn't that mean you're not recovering enough? I hardly think I'm not recovering enough. If anything.....too much.

At any rate.....Thanks for the help on Perpetuem. Sounds like the way to go.

I guess everyone's body reacts their own way. I just know that I recover and improve better with one very, very had day a week (with spinning and long slow days in between). Then again, my job is very physical too and I am always on my feet.

Heck, I do quite frequently 60km (37.5 miles) ride in two hours, and I've been a senior citizen for a couple of years. The circuit includes two sharp U turns and four tall and long bridges every 10km. An above 40yr rider in my group does it on his TT bike in 1hr 32m, but he is a racer at national level. So 35 miles ride is a good work out, but will not break a fairly well trained recreational rider. Keep enjoying your rides varian. You're doing well.

For long rides I have one water bottle filled w/a mix of both HEED and Sustained Energy. I'd do all SE,but the taste (or lack of it) bugs me. The HEED adds a bit of flavor and seems to work well for century rides and the like.

Orbea J, I'm curious about Sustained Energy, as I have a canister which I haven't been using, I've been using Perpeteum instead. Have you tried Perpeteum, how would you compare them?

Maybe I'll try your idea of mixing the S.E. with Heed.

+1. HEED and real food & Hammer Gel is perfect for any length. The taste isn't over powering. For me, all the drinks that have protein in them do weird things to my guts. I'd rather relax with a beer and a movie after a day of riding rather than camp out on the toilet.

Hey 'saddle--
I;ve never used Perpetuem--if I was doing double centuries or rides that are REALLY
long, I'd probably consider it. The SE and Hammer Gel (I mix two flavors together) seem
to do the trick. And I trust that it will continue to do so.

From Hammer's site: "All Hammer Nutrition fuels are completely compatible with one another, so you can use them interchangeably as desired. This is especially beneficial in ultra-endurance events as it provides a greater variety of quality fuels to choose from. For example, you can use Perpetuem and/or Sustained Energy from start to finish, or you can occasionally switch to HEED and/or Hammer Gel to add variety. However, you should meet at least two-thirds of your fueling requirements from Perpetuem or Sustained Energy."


This link also explains the difference between Sustained Energy and Perpetuem

https://www.hammernutrition.com/za/HN...RTICLE.ID=1252

If you're at approx 2 hours ride times, I wouldn't worry about protein during the ride. If you decide to try Sustained Energy or Perpetuem, buy some of the single trial packages. I bought a huge tub of SE but can't use it without it giving me stomach cramps/gas. Perpetuem did the same as well. Accel gels are about the only on bike protein I've found that don't mess up my stomach and haven't given me any problems in rides over 5 hours.

I'm trying to think of creative ways to get rid of the Sustained Energy -- maybe some Accelerade/Sustained Energy dog biscuits.....