tips for removing fixed cup bottom bracket?
#1
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tips for removing fixed cup bottom bracket?
I have an older bike with an adjustable type bottom bracket. I've managed to take off the adjustable side (the lockring and adjustable cup), but I'm having trouble removing the fixed cup.
this is the tool I've been trying to remove it with (the 36mm wrench side): https://www.parktool.com/product/cran...t-wrench-hcw-4
The adjustable side required some force to remove but I got it loose the first try. The fixed side is another story. And yes, I'm turning the right way - since I know the BB is English threaded. I'm just afraid I'm going to pull something.
actually after going through Sheldon Brown's page on bottom bracket tool tips, I've realized that the tool i posted might not be effective enough to remove the fixed cup.
tl;dr should I just bring it to the shop where they probably have the right tool to remove the fixed cup?
this is the tool I've been trying to remove it with (the 36mm wrench side): https://www.parktool.com/product/cran...t-wrench-hcw-4
The adjustable side required some force to remove but I got it loose the first try. The fixed side is another story. And yes, I'm turning the right way - since I know the BB is English threaded. I'm just afraid I'm going to pull something.
actually after going through Sheldon Brown's page on bottom bracket tool tips, I've realized that the tool i posted might not be effective enough to remove the fixed cup.
tl;dr should I just bring it to the shop where they probably have the right tool to remove the fixed cup?
#3
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Leverage is what you need. A couple home brew options that work if you don't have a vice.
1. Use bolts and (very wide) washers through the cup to attach the tool to the cup. This will eliminate any side ways loss of torque and greatly help.
2. If #1 is still not sufficient, pry bar time. I've used a 2 inch steel pipe with that tool before. Yes it's awkward because 2" is way too much but good luck finding a pipe between 1" and 2".
I'm not a fan of Sheldon's bolt method. I'm not sure what supplies and cups he was working with when he discovered that but, yeah good luck with that (hint: bolts will spin since there's nothing for them to grip on).
1. Use bolts and (very wide) washers through the cup to attach the tool to the cup. This will eliminate any side ways loss of torque and greatly help.
2. If #1 is still not sufficient, pry bar time. I've used a 2 inch steel pipe with that tool before. Yes it's awkward because 2" is way too much but good luck finding a pipe between 1" and 2".
I'm not a fan of Sheldon's bolt method. I'm not sure what supplies and cups he was working with when he discovered that but, yeah good luck with that (hint: bolts will spin since there's nothing for them to grip on).
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VAR makes a tool that makes it very simple, but the tool probably costs $100. Our shop has one and I use it all the time and love it. Ask if your bike shop has one, I would only charge you $5 if you brought it to me with the cranks out.
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The first question you should ask yourself is "is it really necessary for me to remove the fixed cup?"
Unless you have a compelling reason to do so, just leave it in place. Clean it out in place, replace worn bearings and/or spindle, repack and enjoy.
Unless you have a compelling reason to do so, just leave it in place. Clean it out in place, replace worn bearings and/or spindle, repack and enjoy.
#6
Constant tinkerer
+1
Why do you want to remove the fixed cup? Unless you are replacing the whole BB with a cartridge unit it is not necessary.
Why do you want to remove the fixed cup? Unless you are replacing the whole BB with a cartridge unit it is not necessary.
#7
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It works very well. The bolts spin until it is tight enough, but it will seize and cup and turn it at some point.
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to proceed, look here:
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...2#post11769729
I've done a bunch of these in my life and on a frame where the
sucker has been in place for twenty or thirty years (or was
installed somewhere along the line with loctite),
you need some way to whack the thing subdue it.
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I removed a particularly stubborn one the other day with a set of Mole Grips/Locking Pliers. It's pretty much all I had to hand and worked a treat! They locked onto the flats very well (after a clean) and gave good leverage if I was careful
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I'll assume you really do need to remove the fixed cup so here is how I do it. This is basically the way that trevor_ash mentioned but i'll fill in the details.
Get a 4" long 5/8" bolt, a nut and two large diamerer washers.
1. Remove the adjustable cup, spindle and bearings and then thread the adjustable cup back in a several turns.
2. Put one washer on the bolt and feed the bolt through the adjustable cup and out the fixed cup.
3. Place your bottom bracket wrench over the flats on the fixed cup and then add the second washer to the bolt outside of the wrench.
4. Thread on the nut snugly to trap the bb wrench between the frame and the washer.
5. You can then apply a lot of torque to the wrench without fear of it slipping. I found the use of a heavy mallet on the wrench as an impact tool was very effective.
6. As soon as the fixed cup turns even a little bit, back off the nut as your loosen it further.
Get a 4" long 5/8" bolt, a nut and two large diamerer washers.
1. Remove the adjustable cup, spindle and bearings and then thread the adjustable cup back in a several turns.
2. Put one washer on the bolt and feed the bolt through the adjustable cup and out the fixed cup.
3. Place your bottom bracket wrench over the flats on the fixed cup and then add the second washer to the bolt outside of the wrench.
4. Thread on the nut snugly to trap the bb wrench between the frame and the washer.
5. You can then apply a lot of torque to the wrench without fear of it slipping. I found the use of a heavy mallet on the wrench as an impact tool was very effective.
6. As soon as the fixed cup turns even a little bit, back off the nut as your loosen it further.
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I'll assume you really do need to remove the fixed cup so here is how I do it. This is basically the way that trevor_ash mentioned but i'll fill in the details.
Get a 4" long 5/8" bolt, a nut and two large diamerer washers.
1. Remove the adjustable cup, spindle and bearings and then thread the adjustable cup back in a several turns.
2. Put one washer on the bolt and feed the bolt through the adjustable cup and out the fixed cup.
3. Place your bottom bracket wrench over the flats on the fixed cup and then add the second washer to the bolt outside of the wrench.
4. Thread on the nut snugly to trap the bb wrench between the frame and the washer.
5. You can then apply a lot of torque to the wrench without fear of it slipping. I found the use of a heavy mallet on the wrench as an impact tool was very effective.
6. As soon as the fixed cup turns even a little bit, back off the nut as your loosen it further.
Get a 4" long 5/8" bolt, a nut and two large diamerer washers.
1. Remove the adjustable cup, spindle and bearings and then thread the adjustable cup back in a several turns.
2. Put one washer on the bolt and feed the bolt through the adjustable cup and out the fixed cup.
3. Place your bottom bracket wrench over the flats on the fixed cup and then add the second washer to the bolt outside of the wrench.
4. Thread on the nut snugly to trap the bb wrench between the frame and the washer.
5. You can then apply a lot of torque to the wrench without fear of it slipping. I found the use of a heavy mallet on the wrench as an impact tool was very effective.
6. As soon as the fixed cup turns even a little bit, back off the nut as your loosen it further.
BTW, I forgot to mention that ever since I purchased Park's Bearing Cup Press tool I've been using that instead. It just so happens that the main axle fits through the cups I typically work with. https://www.parktool.com/product/bearing-cup-press-hhp-2.
#12
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I don't see any mention of threading? is this English or Italian? are you turning in the correct direction?
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#15
Senior Member
Regrettably, this is not always the case. Trust me because
I've done a bunch of these in my life and on a frame where the
sucker has been in place for twenty or thirty years (or was
installed somewhere along the line with loctite),
you need some way to whack the thing subdue it.
I've done a bunch of these in my life and on a frame where the
sucker has been in place for twenty or thirty years (or was
installed somewhere along the line with loctite),
you need some way to whack the thing subdue it.
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#17
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#18
Senior Member
I say it has worked for me everytime I've gone to it which included bikes up to 30 y.o. with rusty threads. And I do use a long armed ratchet and end wrenches. On one I did brace the frame on the carpeted floor of my basement while still clamped in my stand and had to tap on the drive side wrench to get it loose. But regardless, getting the nut tight enough to seize on the cup is not an issue if you're doing it right. I do agree that there are cases in which just strength may not be enough to break whatever has sealed the threads. I have contemplated using an pneumatic impact wrench to get things moving but have not had to resort to it yet.
For what it's worth, the worst case I have come across I took to a shop and they tried and failed to get it loose. They had tried the vice method but were worried about bending the frame with too much pressure and stopped. The mechanic suggested that if it were his he would attempt to put grooves in the cup with a cut wheel in a dremel and then literally crush it loose with the vice. I ended up getting it loose with the nut/bolt/washer rig so I can't comment on if the mechanics method would actually work. But for some reason I want to try it.
For what it's worth, the worst case I have come across I took to a shop and they tried and failed to get it loose. They had tried the vice method but were worried about bending the frame with too much pressure and stopped. The mechanic suggested that if it were his he would attempt to put grooves in the cup with a cut wheel in a dremel and then literally crush it loose with the vice. I ended up getting it loose with the nut/bolt/washer rig so I can't comment on if the mechanics method would actually work. But for some reason I want to try it.
Last edited by canam73; 10-11-11 at 02:21 PM.
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The mechanic suggested that if it were his he would attempt to put grooves in the cup with a cut wheel in a dremel and then literally crush it loose with the vice. I ended up getting it loose with the nut/bolt/washer rig so I can't comment on if the mechanics method would actually work. But for some reason I want to try it.
#20
Banned
there are tool holders, that use the end of the bb spindle to hold the BB wrench on the fixed cup.
then the wrench won't slip off the flats, on the fixed cup , and you can put an extension
on the end of the wrench ..
then the wrench won't slip off the flats, on the fixed cup , and you can put an extension
on the end of the wrench ..