nz6666

I started commuting a year ago, daily about 10 - 15 miles total. I use a folder for commuting because I need to take a train in between or one leg of the journey. Never ridden a road bike before so never done any proper fitting. In the one year commuting I never felt really comfortable. I have done some research and adjusted saddle height, saddle fore/aft etc but gradually I realised the problem is with my legs. I have a slightly longer left leg and my left knee tends to move outward in the up stroke. There maybe other problems or maybe the consequences of something not correct. I am at the point to either cure this or quit commuting by cycling. I see bike fitters are mostly for rodies. So wondering can they help me? Has anyone done that on a folder here?

invisiblehand

Most folding bike have limited adjustability. But there are fitters used to working with roadies, mtb'ers, tourers, and so on.

jur

I would strongly recommend visiting a fitter; leaving commuting by bike altogether is of course a great pity, but there are leg issues that can be dealt with.

tds101 

On the leg with a slightly shorter reach I would measure the exact amount of distance difference. Then I'd mod a pedal to compensate. That's just me,...

nz6666

Hi everyone, just want to report back. I did a bike fit yesterday. The fitter checked me thoroughly and made some adjustment on my bike. To my surprise, he told me my legs are equal length and the imbalance is probably due to the my hip. But later he concluded my hip on my bike is ok (not rocking to either side). I can still feel the imbalance of my legs on the bike. In the last resort, he drilled on my shoes so that I can move cleats further backward, I can definitely feel the difference, my left leg is feeling better, but the imbalance still remains. I cycled 30 mins home and I could tell the overall adjustment of the bike and the cleats does make a difference. The next step will be I will get a drill to further drill those slots on my shoes to make cleat move further back because I still feel my left foot want to go forward on the pedal (which is what I have been been feeling all the time).

So is it worth it? If I knew a drill could do the trick I probably wouldn't go for a fitter. Another reason is their equipment is not for 20 inch folder so that the roller machine can't apply resistance to the rear wheel, so the testing of adjustment is me getting out of the shop and riding on real roads . But after all this, if you are really struggling with the fit, seeking a fitter will definitely help (may not solve your problem in one go but at lest shed some light).

Dave Cutter

Just curious... are you female?

There are lots of old jokes about repair prices not being for parts.... but for knowing which part to replace. What you bought was expertise.

nz6666

No, male, why?
yes, I agree.

energyandair

I'm not sure what you mean by this?

Our Birdy's have more adjustment than any bike I've ever had. They can be set up for people from under 5 ft tall to far over 6 ft and for different body proportions and riding positions. I've never seen a standard bike that can be adjusted like that.

fietsbob

I think about it . and then I adjust things , Myself.



Other than Bike Friday , no folding bikes are made in more than just 1 size

then you tweak the adjustments

(though older Mk2 Bromptons were shorter than the Mk4 are Now )

Saddle height, Telescopic seat-posts You adjust it every time you Unfold it .

BiFri hinged seat masts are different in that regard.



some just have bigger wheels

Having [non trivial] Bio-Mechanical issues? a Sports Physiologist with a Cycling Specialty Study, may be better

than a Fit Kit done by a Kid in a Bike Shop.

Dave Cutter

I was trying to figure the reasoning behind the cleat movement backwards.... in effect moving feet forward.

invisiblehand

With regular bikes, most people start with a frame that's roughly the right size. From there, one can typically adjust the fit with different stems, handlebars, seat posts, saddles, and cranks. I think bike fit is usually about going from an OK or decent fit to something really good or exceptional.

Off the top of my head, most folding bikes have decent flexibility in the rear -- although things like setback might be limited -- but the front is pretty limited by limiting folks to moving the handlebar clamp in a line along the stem post. Sometimes you can adjust it somewhat from that line with different handlebars or aber hallo stems or an ahead stem depending on the brand/model; but there is often some tradeoff with the fold or limit to how much it can be adjusted.

So I think most folding bikes can be adjusted for a decent fit. But if you're looking for something special or exceptional -- say for riding centuries -- I think that the limitations are significant.

nz6666

Yes that's what exactly I want, to move my left foot forward on the pedal. Can't see why this is gender related?

jur

Maybe part of a reaction of giving a male chauvinist the boot... jk

Dave Cutter

It isn't! I was just curious. Wondering what the fitter was compensating for. My first thought was plantar fasciitis... which is often associated with high heels.

bhkyte

Hi.
How have you had your leg length measured. Physiotherapist will measure the greater trocanter of the thigh bone to the malleolous prominence of the outer ankle when you are lying.
Is this what bike fitters do to assess leg length discrepancies. About 1/2 Ann inch is considered normal range afaicr.

There is also apparent leg length differences, these are when there is an obvious difference but not shown in the measurement. Usually this comes from the hip and truck alignment instead.

burnfatburn

Hi,

how about just using a flat pedal but with thicker shoes on the left? or maybe put some plate or mounting cushion on the pedal so it will slightly thicker, I am just curious

and have you try to use another bike? at totally different one, like roadbike maybe? just to check how does it feel.

bargainguy

I'm going out on a limb here (sorry, no pun intended) and suggest that your imbalance may be due to restriction(s) in the affected hip which then lead to alignment issues from the hip down, including valgus knee, where the knee points outward laterally from the body. If the body is misaligned in any area, it will not function properly as it tries to cope with exercise demands while maintaining something resembling proper alignment, and that's where problems arise. More demands and the situation gets worse rather than better.

How do I know all this? My wife is a registered myofascial release therapist, and I was her test subject while she was being trained in MFR by the physical therapist who designed it, John Barnes. Got to know a lot more about my body than I thought I ever would. If you have a licensed MFR therapist in your area, I'd give them a call.

bhkyte

The above summery is quite correct about hip alignment.
It's not correct to say more demands and the situation get worse not better. It depends on whether exercise postures, movement patterns,and muscle balance are increasing incorrect movements or postures or reducing them.

Ie exercising in a way that tends to promote internal rotation at the hip may alter the situation in a positive way.

I would get your leg length properly checked for a start.

Additional exercise is not the most critical aspect in altering posture. We sleep for 8 hours. We sit most of our waking life.............

bargainguy

Uh....not according to either John Barnes or my wife. With any myofascial restriction, pain/disability/reduced function will likely result in that area, and sometimes distal to the area as well, as in this case. There's a good chance that genu valgus would not have developed without a hip restriction, as it's the body's way of compensating the restriction due to increasing demands being placed upon it. In general, increase the stress on the fascia without releasing the restriction, and you will likely experience more pain/disability/reduced function than before. There's no other way to say it.

bhkyte

I am not being contradictory to most of your points. However, it's not been established as a soft tissue issue.
I could quote authors also.
Manual therapy is a small aspect of physiotherapy. Physiotherapy tends to attempt to alter patterns by encouraging adaptations. Often this does not involve hands on manual therapy.
Ie if it's weak strengthen it.
If it's painfull repeat it in a graded manner.
If it's stiff give it a shove!!
If it's a bad movement pattern re educate it.
If it posture driven change posture.
If it's a stiff joint give it a shove(in a graded manner!)
If it's not appropriate, refer on.

However no assessment has occurred yet indicating the issue is most appropriate for manual therapy.

The cause could be genetic, joint, muscle ,usage, nerological,posture habits, or systemic medical. It is limiting to say just one approach is likely to work. Knee pain can be caused by sexually transmitted disease!
If the issue is leg length then altering shoe inserts would be wise. If it's a nerological issue then nero stretches, if it's a gait issue the gait reeducation, is its a joint issue then joint mobility, if it's adhesive capulseitis or muscle fibre orientation issues then manual therapy.
A rounded approach after triage.

bhkyte

I think a few full sized folders do. Dahon expresso? Certainly my BMW was made in 2 sizes. It's not a true folder however.

nz6666

I have my wife measured it for me. She measured from the center point between my legs (not sure what word for that) to the ankle bones of both feet. The bike fitter just do that by his eyes, he did ask me to different positions so he could observe, but I am not very convinced.

nz6666

The fitter did say my hips have different tightness (something like that). This is might be the reason. Any treatment or exercise you have done to remedy yours? My fitter gave me some stretch exercise.

bargainguy

Please re-read bhkyte's last post. He is correct in stating that since you haven't had any evaluation outside a fitter, we're just guessing at what the issue really is, and you know what happens when you substitute the internet for professional help. Best course of action is professional help, but at least you have a start. Find a local and licensed MFR therapist, explain your situation and allow the professional to do his or her work.

bhkyte

Your method of measuring lacks accuracy. If you want to have a go at doing it more clinically try this. It's a little skilled.

In lying place your palms on the top near outside ridges of your pelvis. People often reffer to this as the hips. Place your fingers on your outer leg and twist your whole leg in and out without bending at the knee. You should feel a bone going underneath your fingers. This is the greater trocanter of the thigh bone.if you can't find it move your leg outward slightly. Move your fingers upwards slowly untill you feel soft tissue and can't feel the greater trocanter of the thigh bone sliding under your fingers. Mark on the lateral leg the end of the greater trochaner with a pen.
Measure down to the lateral malleouls, the ankle bone on the outside. This should give an accurate measurement.

it's not something you can guess visually. There will be youtube videos on this.