Too much exercise?
08-06-15, 02:40 PM
#77
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08-06-15, 02:49 PM
#78
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Someone quite rightly pointed out in another thread there is some evidence that continuing high level training into middle and old age may be detrimental to health and longevity. As an endurance athlete since 1973 I do not dismiss these observations out of hand because they make sense in the respect that our bodies have a mechanical aspect to them and our organs are wear items that are not designed to last forever.
But the observations are not supported by evidence of an epidemic of older endurance athletes dropping dead in races or in training. There is however an epidemic of early deaths among sedentary populations in developed countries particularly highly developed countries like the United States.
We must consider an array of variables that need to be taken into account when comparisons are made between active, vigorous individuals and the static lifestyles of general populations. Endurance athletes are far less likely to use tobacco or abuse alcohol and drugs. They are also less likely to be obese or diabetic. So they exist in a bubble of protection just by virtue of these differences.
This is not to say that there is no credence in warnings that excessive taxation on the heart and respiratory tract could produce symptoms that herald the onset of sudden death. This can occur in athletes of all ages but it is a concern among older adults simply because they have a lot more mileage on their bodies. Atrial Fibrillation is more common in older people and it is likely undiagnosed in staggering proportions. But AF is rarely a cause of death in endurance competitions.
Until I see compelling evidence that high level training will shorten or deteriorate quality of life I will continue to use it because I feel good doing it. And if this is really such a problem then we all might as well just hang up our bikes and go bowling.
But the observations are not supported by evidence of an epidemic of older endurance athletes dropping dead in races or in training. There is however an epidemic of early deaths among sedentary populations in developed countries particularly highly developed countries like the United States.
We must consider an array of variables that need to be taken into account when comparisons are made between active, vigorous individuals and the static lifestyles of general populations. Endurance athletes are far less likely to use tobacco or abuse alcohol and drugs. They are also less likely to be obese or diabetic. So they exist in a bubble of protection just by virtue of these differences.
This is not to say that there is no credence in warnings that excessive taxation on the heart and respiratory tract could produce symptoms that herald the onset of sudden death. This can occur in athletes of all ages but it is a concern among older adults simply because they have a lot more mileage on their bodies. Atrial Fibrillation is more common in older people and it is likely undiagnosed in staggering proportions. But AF is rarely a cause of death in endurance competitions.
Until I see compelling evidence that high level training will shorten or deteriorate quality of life I will continue to use it because I feel good doing it. And if this is really such a problem then we all might as well just hang up our bikes and go bowling.
08-06-15, 02:53 PM
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Turn 43 soon. My recent Strava data shows 197, just as I reached the top of a certain climb. My heart rate tends to be high during a ride, although it doesn't really bother me. I do have Mitral Valve Prolapse, but the cardiologist doesn't think biking will be an issue. He told me don't go crazy, and avoid caffeine, including energy drinks. Whenever I drink that stuff, the heart fluttering increases. I don't notice any of that when riding.
As for longevity and exercise ... I think longevity is proportional to nap time
As for longevity and exercise ... I think longevity is proportional to nap time
08-06-15, 02:55 PM
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My dad lived to be 90. He smoked like a chimney until he was about 70 and his doctor told him to either quit or get another doctor. He had emphysema so bad that he couldn't do much for long. My mom lived to be 83. She was a chronic alcoholic and a heavy smoker right to the end. They had to amputate one of her legs because of smoking related circulatory issues. The first amputation did not work because gangrene set in so they cut again and that's what killed her. We thought about suing but did not.
I've been thinking about this exercise issue and ask myself some questions. Do I want to live past 100 and maybe outlive my kids and grandkids some of whom are overweight and smoke? I do not like to go there. This is far more complicated than just the physiology of exercise. I need to think about what makes me happy and that's riding my bike on a high level and getting lots of clean air into my clear lungs. If I die on the bike then so be it. I will go out on my shield.
I've been thinking about this exercise issue and ask myself some questions. Do I want to live past 100 and maybe outlive my kids and grandkids some of whom are overweight and smoke? I do not like to go there. This is far more complicated than just the physiology of exercise. I need to think about what makes me happy and that's riding my bike on a high level and getting lots of clean air into my clear lungs. If I die on the bike then so be it. I will go out on my shield.
08-06-15, 04:07 PM
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What is 'old age'?
My answer: 10 years older than what I am today.
At age 82, I still average 100+ miles a week.
Oh, I was the 'oldest' person putting in some miles to fight cancer at the recent Tour of Utah
fund raiser.
My answer: 10 years older than what I am today.
At age 82, I still average 100+ miles a week.
Oh, I was the 'oldest' person putting in some miles to fight cancer at the recent Tour of Utah
fund raiser.
08-06-15, 04:37 PM
#84
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You are a thoughtful man. There is a paradigm shift on the notion of consciousness within he medical community which in many ways is still in the stone age. The changing view is consciousness is not the personal domain of a given person..nor is the voice in a person's head any sort of definition of consciousness. A better explanation is...consciousness is a collective of infinite intelligence and each of our brain's are a reducing valve. This also better fits the concept of genius, idiot savant syndrome and of course precocity like Mozart composing complex music by the age of 3 when a human being can't possibly have the experience to formulate such creativity. This is why when we pass and the brain's restriction dies, we realign with this infinite intelligence...as often written about in NDE's.
Glad you came back to us to ride some more.
Glad you came back to us to ride some more.
08-06-15, 04:54 PM
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I've been thinking about this exercise issue and ask myself some questions. Do I want to live past 100 and maybe outlive my kids and grandkids some of whom are overweight and smoke? I do not like to go there. This is far more complicated than just the physiology of exercise.
08-06-15, 05:12 PM
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I split my time with mountain biking (much less miles in a given amount of time) and weight lifting but during summer that's a hair more miles than I ride every week and I'm 29! Props to you, I hope I'm the same way at your age.
08-06-15, 05:16 PM
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"If I knew I'd live this long, I would have taken better care of myself." -- Mickey Mantle
08-06-15, 07:57 PM
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Until you hit the point of diminishing returns, and you begin to get no benefit from more exercise, and then actually have negative return.
The J Curve of Exercising. Exercise, over-indulgence and atrial fibrillation ? seeing the obvious
The study referred to your in link was based on 150 minutes of moderate exercise a week (defined as brisk walking). It doesn't address the potential negative effects of years of intense race training.
The J Curve of Exercising. Exercise, over-indulgence and atrial fibrillation ? seeing the obvious
The study referred to your in link was based on 150 minutes of moderate exercise a week (defined as brisk walking). It doesn't address the potential negative effects of years of intense race training.
Given that I started riding a lot again 20 years ago, that's something on the order of 10,000 hours right there. Then there's 20 years of alpine and XC skiing, being on a Nordic ski team, climbing, biking from 8 years old through college, running a few miles a week from 12 to 25, and hiking. Man, that's a lot of hours. I think many of us on this forum have similar histories, or will if they keep at it until they're as old as I am. And I'm not quitting. Like Rudy, I think being old is still 10 years away. Heck, I'm still skiing alpine and this year Stevens Pass will finally sell me a full season pass for $99.
So while I've been careful all my life to limit my hours of high end, I think something is fishy somewhere.
08-06-15, 08:10 PM
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08-06-15, 08:32 PM
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08-06-15, 08:44 PM
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My grandpa was a chain smoker since he was a teen and he died at 88 of smoking related issues. His last year's were severe COPD etc but before that he was healthy as a horse. I believe he would have lived until 110 if he never smoked. He was young at heart.
I think anything in the extreme is bad for you. Albeit I'd wish my grandpa was a chronic exerciser than a chronic smoker, either could have killed him at 88.
So I guess it just depends how much you value old age. If you're ready to go and don't value extending your years as far as possible, then do 400 miles a week and ignore the experts and do what makes you happy. If you crave life and dream of blowing out candles on your 100th birthday cake then I wouldn't be biking 400 miles a week.
I think anything in the extreme is bad for you. Albeit I'd wish my grandpa was a chronic exerciser than a chronic smoker, either could have killed him at 88.
So I guess it just depends how much you value old age. If you're ready to go and don't value extending your years as far as possible, then do 400 miles a week and ignore the experts and do what makes you happy. If you crave life and dream of blowing out candles on your 100th birthday cake then I wouldn't be biking 400 miles a week.
08-06-15, 09:08 PM
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You can probably largely determine if you will croak at 52 or 72.....but whether you live to be 82 or 92 or 102 is probably more about genetics....but the choices you make can definitely largely determine if your last 30 years(especially) will be enjoyable or miserable.
Yep. I think if people abided by moderation in everything, even the "bad things" wouldn't be so bad; and we'd all be a lot better off practicing that moderation, than reading these studies and basing our actions and lives on them. In Italy, smoking is still very common- "everyone smokes"- but you don't see the same high levels of lung cancer, CPOD, etc. as one does here in America, because the Italians tend not to smoke several packs of cigarettes A DAY, as many Americans do. They have an occasional cig, like after a meal.
08-07-15, 09:28 AM
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Went for a run last night. My Garmin said my recovery heart rate was 61 bpm, down to 96. Took a while to get an answer, I think that's for 2 minutes.
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