Hi--

I just recently found out that my brand new bike's bottom bracket shell was welded in backwards, and, therefore, my isis bottom bracket is installed backwards as well.

I was taking my new bike on one of its first rides, and about a third of the way into the ride(about 4 miles) my front derailleur started dropping the chain on the outside when I tried shifting to my large chainring--repeatedly. So I thought it best to cut the ride short, head home, and stay in the middle ring to avoid dropping the chain again. I got home, took a good look at the bike, and noticed that the bb was backing itself out, which explained why the chain kept dropping(the crankset had shifted about half an inch to the non-drive side). I took it to my LBS mechanic, and he made the above determination.

I contacted the bike maker, and was informed that they discovered that a number of my bike model had the bb shell welded on backwards. They said that the simple fix would be to remove the bb, apply green loctite, and re-install it. They said that this should keep the bb loosening in check, and that the bike should be totally serviceable this way. They also reminded me that the frame had a lifetime warranty on it(for me, the original purchaser), so, if I decided in the future that this "easy fix" was no longer satisfactory, that they would provide a return tag and I could send my bike back directly to them, and they would either have the bb shell corrected on my bike's frame, or they would simply replace the frame altogether, rebuild the bike, and send it back to me.

This all sounds cool to me, and, as summer arrives, I really don't want to be without my bike to enjoy during these great weather months. But I'm a little concerned about this whole backwards bottom bracket issue. Will the green loctite "fix" permanently take care of any mechanical/performance issues the bike could suffer from because of this goof-up, or would I be the wiser to just have them correct the problem? If it's the latter, then I suppose I could wait til after fall, when the rainy season returns, and then send back the bike to have it fixed. Or will this be necessary at all? My wife says to stop being a worry-wart, and go with the green loctite...but then again, she firmly believes that duct tape is the permanent cure-all for everything!

'Sorry this is so long-winded...are there any bottom bracket experts out there who could advise me???

Thanks so much for your time and help!

!. The problem you aree experiencing, the BB can back out (Italian thread BB do not have a left hand thread and they (usually) do not back out
2. The spindle may not protrude an even length on both sides. So if it points the wrong way your chainrings might be to far in or out for good chainline

* I may have my colors confused but I believe green loctite is for setting bearings, You may have a very hard time getting the BB out if it needed service.

I would get it replaced ASAP myself... theres a reason that a BB is threaded a certain way (as you've discovered) and I myself am a big fan of doing things the RIGHT way rather than throwing a bandaid on it and calling it good. If you do use loctite I think the stuff you want is the blue which is not as permanent as the read but is a thread locker vs. green which I agree with Rev. Chuck is for bearings as I recall.

if they will replace the frame, I'd do that no matter what time of year it is. This is a funky mistake that should not have made it past the manufacturer's q/c inspection.

Green loctite is a stud and bearing mount solution that will only allow removal with the application of heat. Red loctite is a super strong thread locker for use with damaged threads, and Blue loctite is the normal thread locker. If you clean all threaded surfaces thoroughly with acetone before assembly, blue loctite should work fine.

But if it were me, I'd return the frame for a NEW ONE.

1) I use blue Loctite on the fixed cups of my Italian- and French-threaded bikes, because I did have problems with self-loosening fixed cups on my first Peugeot and my first Bianchi.
2) Make sure you can indeed obtain a satisfactory chainline.
3) Personally, I would demand a new frame. This is clearly a manufacturing defect.
4) Two years ago, on the Hetchins Heaven ride in Fallbrook, I was privileged to view a stunning collection two dozen Hetchins bicycles, one of which, from the mid-1970s, actually had the same defect as your frame.

I am guessing someone noticed this as they would have had to known to switch around the BB.

Personally, I would demand a new frame as well. I would probably wait until fall or whenever you will be riding less though. If you do apply Loctite try to get it done by a shop that sells their brands so they dont blame you for messing things up if the BB won't come out or something.

Loctite? I don't think so. It's a new bike, you're entitled to a product that isn't borken and then "fixed" with a nasty kluge. Not only did somebody fubar the construction, but somebody else noticed the problem and =didn't care= enough to fix it right and instead tried to pass it off with a reversed BB. That doesn't say good things for the manufacturer.

I'd be tempted to try and get a refund and go with something else.

I would send the bike back now for repair/replacement and take advantage of the warrantee offer now while it is still good. If you wait, the manufacturer may go out of business (if they are a small company) or they may 'forget' about the offer to fix it.

NO, don't send the bike back, demand a replacement frame be shipped to your LBS, and when it gets there they can stip the old frame and build up the new frame. Then they can ship the old frame back to the maker. The maker should pay for all shipping and labor.

Untill then use blue lock-tight.

I agree with Len. Get the replacement frame FIRST, then send back the bad one. This is a very bad customer relations problem, not to mention the manufacturing issues.

What kind of bike?

Frankly, it sounds to me like you didn't get the facts straight from the manufacturer. I'm having a difficult time imagining how a bottom bracket shell could have been installed backwards in the first place and then how somebody could have installed the bottom bracket backwards in it's place. I'm thinking that you have a different problem.

Italian threaded bottom brackets have a history of loosening during use. Some mechanics install them with blue locktite, some swear that torqueing them to 35 ft/lbs will do the job. All of the bikes that I normally work on are English threaded so I don't have the basis for a reasoned opinion.

Somebody mentioned green locktite. Green is for use after the threaded part has already been tightened. I recently used some on my son's downhill bike because the spokes were loosening up, but I haven't had the opportunity to check it since to see if the wheel will be true-able. He rides some big drop offs and does some things on that bike that I'm not sure that I approve of so it's a real good test bike.

It's jaw-dropping that any mfr would actually ship bikes made this way. Those frames should never have been built upon. At best, they should have slapped on some surplus components, loctited (or, shoot, spot-welded) the BB's in place, and comped the bikes to some charity. That they made a dime from any one of these bikes by ultimately destining them to retail constitutes an invitation to be sued, not to mention investigated by the CPSC.

I'm amzed no-one's asked this yet, but who made that frame? Normally I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't tell anyone, but this is such a major problem that the world deserves to know.

Anyway, whatever you do don't ride it! Even if you can get the cups to stay in (with blue Loctite BTW), and even if you can get the chainline right (not bloody likely), you still run a major risk of knackering your BB, which I doubt the frame builder will warranty. BBs are designed to spin in one direction, and often have two bearings on the drive side. Running it backwards will put undue stress on the single non-drive-side bearing (if that's how your BB is made anyway), and you could end up without a BB AND a frame. Len is right, get them to send the new frame to your LBS, then send them the broken one. Make sure you get proof in writing that they will send it and pay all the shipping and labour costs.

it's pretty easy. the bottom bracket shell on any tig-ed bike bike (not lugged) is just a cylinder with threads on either end. i can see how some guy in a factory who's already welded, say, a couple hundred of those joints already during his shift, could get a few flipped around and put em in backwards. having said all that, i'd just like to add that i agree with all the folks who say you should replace the frame, especially since it's a manufacturing defect and covered by your warranty.

Hi Retro Grouch,

I'm not sure if it's appropriate to mention the manufacturer's name on this forum, so let me just say that it's an American company that manufactures recumbent bikes. While they outsource the framebuilding of virtually all of their other models to Taiwan(and have for some time), they've brought the framebuilding processes back in-house here in America for this particular model(my bike). I've been told that they made this decision based on some quality control issues that they were having with this frame in Taiwan.

When I brought the bike to my LBS to have them take a look at the bb(and hopefully fix a minor problem), the mechanic initially thought that the bb shell had Italian threading. But, as he finished removing it, he determined that the bb(a Truvativ Isis bb) seemed to be installed backwards, as was the bb shell. He advised me to contact the manufacturer to ask them if the bb shell was welded into the frame in this orientation on purpose, or if it was, in fact, a goof-up on their part. And, if so, if I needed to have them take care of it. So I emailed the manufacturer and cc'd the dealer that I purchased the bike from. The manufacturer emailed me back, saying that they had just recently discovered that a number of my bike's particular model had been shipped out from their warehouse with the bb's reversed. That's when they suggested that the simple solution, "since friction loads are low, and the shifting's not affected by this", would be to remove the bb, and then re-install it with an application of green
loctite. They then assured me that the frame carried a lifetime warranty with the original purchaser(me), and that, if I decided at a later time that the "simple solution" was no longer satisfactory, they would provide me with a return tag to send the bike back to them, and they would either correct the bb shell problem(remove the old shell and have a new one welded back in) or simply replace the frame with a new one.

Now, I'm no mechanic by any stretch of the imagination, so I simply couldn't tell you if I wasn't given straight facts by the manufacturer. I'm only going by what my LBS mechanic told me(and I've trusted him for years with all of my family's bikes) and what the manufacturer "confirmed".

At this point, I just want to have my bike fixed, and fixed the right way, so that I can count on enjoying it for many years to come. All bb goof-ups aside, this bike is a real joy and blast to ride and own! If the manufacturer offered me a full refund for the bike, to go out and buy something else, I would reject the refund in favor of just getting it fixed or replaced...I love the bike that much.

Hi again, and thanks to all of you for your wonderful advice! You've all confirmed what my gut was telling me all along--get it fixed and get it fixed right!

I've been told that the bb goof-up was an isolated incident, and was limited to a small number of bicycles.

I checked with Joe Gardner on the propriety of mentioning the bike manufacturer's name on the forum.

So, in case this isolated incident may affect any of you, the manufacturer is Rans, and the model involved is the Fusion. If any of you have purchased a Rans Fusion semi-recumbent bike, you may want to have your LBS mechanic check your bottom bracket and the bottom bracket shell. If they have been installed backwards, then you should contact Rans.

Thanks again, everyone! I am grateful for all of your help!

P.S.--Thanks for the clarification on the correct loctite to use! I was told to use green loctite, but it's actually the blue loctite that's the right one to use!

Getting it fixed "right" means getting a replacement frame NOT globbing on some loctite and praying

Golly gee willikers!

I'm sure the manufacturer will make more money if they can get you to locktite your bottom bracket in so they don't have any warranty cost unless you have some kind of problem down the road, but that's not the point is is?

That's not a cheap bike. You deserve for it to be right and it isn't. They've admitted that it's their fault. They should replace it. What other justifiable ending can this story possibly have?

Hi Raiyn,

I will be calling Rans to replace the frame; I won't be going the loctite route. I just wanted to thank the folks who told me that the blue loctite was the correct loctite to use in this case, not the
green loctite that Rans suggested using.

Thanks for reiterating that getting the frame replaced was the only way to get it fixed "right"!

Take care....

You couldn't be more right, my friend...thanks!

Hi again!

I just wanted to be really clear on why I decided to mention that the manufacturer in question is Rans.

The only reason why I've mentioned their name is because, just in case other folks here in the forums purchased(or know someone who has purchased) a Fusion recently, they should be made aware that this isolated problem exists, and that they should check or have checked their Fusion, to make sure that their bottom bracket and shell are installed correctly. If they have any concerns or issues, then they should contact Rans and the dealer they purchased the bike from.

Rans has earned a years long reputation for excellent customer service and support. They stand behind their products. While they may have commited a faux pas in suggesting the loctite solution, they never failed to remind me that the bike frame has a lifetime warranty, and that they will honor it to my satisfaction. I am a repeat customer of Rans(my first bent was a Wave), and I will gladly buy from them again in the future. The Fusion is a great bike, IMHO, and it's a true joy to ride. It's unfortunate that this defect exists, and that my bike is involved. But I consider it one of those unusual, once-in-a-lifetime incidents that can and does occur...and once my bike is fixed the right way, I'll be able to go back to focusing my attention on simply enjoying the heck out of it!

Thanks, once again, everyone, for all of your kind help, advice, and support! I hope that I may have the priviledge of returning the favor some day! Take care, and enjoy your ride!