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Is there a difference between front and rear discs/

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Is there a difference between front and rear discs/

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Old 11-02-04 | 07:27 PM
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Is there a difference between front and rear discs/

Okay well i know its kind of a dumb question but when you go to a site that has disc brakes for order, they often have the option Front or rear. Is there an actual difference in these? I have a front disc brake that came with the bike, could i put it on the rear? I have the frame and wheels to support discs.
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Old 11-03-04 | 07:30 AM
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why would you like to put on the rear?

Remember that the front is your primary brake... not your rear.

It depends on what brakes you have. Some sets have the same diameter, others have a sluightly wider dia front disc.
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Old 11-03-04 | 05:34 PM
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The calipers are pretty much universal, the adaptor bracket is what makes it front or rear or changes the size rotor it accapts.
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Old 11-03-04 | 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by phantomcow2
Okay well i know its kind of a dumb question but when you go to a site that has disc brakes for order, they often have the option Front or rear. Is there an actual difference in these? I have a front disc brake that came with the bike, could i put it on the rear? I have the frame and wheels to support discs.
The differences in a rear and front disk brake setups are probably:

1. mounting bracket (fork versus frame)
2. length of hydraulic hose
3. left and right levers
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Old 11-03-04 | 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by dexmax
why would you like to put on the rear?

Remember that the front is your primary brake... not your rear.

It depends on what brakes you have. Some sets have the same diameter, others have a sluightly wider dia front disc.
I was always taught that the rear brake is your primary brake. Otherwise, if you hit the front brake in an emergency, you can toss yourself over the handlebars.
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Old 11-03-04 | 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Becca
I was always taught that the rear brake is your primary brake. Otherwise, if you hit the front brake in an emergency, you can toss yourself over the handlebars.
WRONG!
Braking--Front, Rear or Both?

Since your bike has two brakes, one for each hand, if you want to stop as safely as possible, you need to pay attention to how you use each of them.

Conventional Wisdom

Conventional wisdom says to use both brakes at the same time. This is probably good advice for beginners, who have not yet learned to use their brakes skillfully, but if you don't graduate past this stage, you will never be able to stop as short safely as a cyclist who has learned to use the front brake by itself.

Maximum Deceleration--Panic Stops

The fastest that you can stop any bike of normal wheelbase is to apply the front brake so hard that the rear wheel is just about to lift off the ground. In this situation, the rear brake cannot contribute to stopping power, since it has no traction.

Won't I Go Over The Bars?

The rear brake is O.K. for situations where traction is poor, or for when your front tire blows, but for stopping on dry pavement, the front brake all by itself provides the maximum stopping power, both in theory and in practice.

If you take the time to learn to use the front brake correctly, you will be a safer cyclist.

Many cyclists shy away from using the front brake, due to fear of flying over the handlebars. This does happen, but mainly to people who have not learned to modulate the front brake.

The cyclist who relies on the rear brake for general stopping can get by until an emergency arises, and, in a panic, he or she grabs the unfamiliar front brake as well as the rear, for extra stopping power. This can cause the classic "over the bars" crash.

Jobst Brandt has a quite plausible theory that the typical "over-the-bars" crash is caused, not so much by braking too hard, but by braking hard without using the rider's arms to brace against the deceleration: The bike stops, the rider keeps going until the rider's thighs bump into the handlebars, and the bike, which is no longer supporting the weight of the rider, flips.

This cannot happen when you are using only the rear brake, because as soon as the rear wheel starts to lift, there is not more braking force generated by it. Unfortunately, though, it takes twice as long to stop with the rear brake alone as with the front brake alone, so reliance on the rear brake is unsafe for cyclists who ever go fast. It is important to use your arms to brace yourself securely during hard braking, to prevent this. Indeed, good technique involves moving back on your saddle as far as you can comfortably go, to keep the center of gravity as far back as possible. This applies whether you are using the front, rear or both brakes. Using both brakes together can cause "fishtailing." If the rear wheel skids while braking force is also being applied to the front, the rear of the bike will tend to swing past the front, since the front is applying a greater decelerating force than the rear. Once the rear tire starts to skid, it can move sideways as easily as forward.

If you don't believe me, perhaps John Forester can convince you...see his Entry in the rec.bicycles FAQ on Front Brake Usage. (Unfortunately, the maintainer of that site has a habit of breaking links, so you may need to go to the rec.bicycles FAQ index to find the article.)

Learning to Use The Front Brake

Maximum braking occurs when the front brake is applied so hard that the rear wheel is just about to lift off. When this happens, the slightest amount of rear brake will cause the rear wheel to skid.

If you ride a conventional bike, the best way to master the use of your front brake is to practice in a parking lot or other safe space, applying both brakes at once, but putting most of the effort into the front brake. Keep pedaling as you brake, so that your legs will tell you immediately when the rear wheel starts to skid. Practice harder and harder stops until this happens, so that you will learn the feel of stopping fast, on the edge of rear-wheel liftoff.

Some cyclists like to ride a fixed-gear bicycle, that is, a bicycle that does not permit coasting. When you brake hard with the front brake on a fixed gear, the drivetrain gives you excellent feedback about the traction situation at the rear wheel. (This is one of the reasons that fixed gears are favored for winter riding.)

If you ride a fixed gear with only a front brake, your legs will tell you exactly when you are at the maximum brake capacity of the front brake. Once your fixed gear has taught you this, you will be able to stop any bicycle better, using the front brake alone.

If you find the fixed-gear concept intriguing, I have a major article on Fixed Gears for Road Use on this site, and also a page of Fixed-Gear Testimonials from happy converts.

When to Use The Rear Brake

Skilled cyclists use the front brake alone probably 95% of the time, but there are instances when the rear brake is preferred:

* Slippery surfaces. On good, dry pavement, it is generally impossible to skid the front wheel by braking. On slippery surfaces, however it is possible to do so. It is nearly impossible to recover from a front wheel skid, so if there is a high risk of skidding, you're better off controlling your speed with the rear brake.

* Bumpy surfaces. On rough surfaces, your wheels may actually bounce up into the air. If there is a chance of this, don't use the front brake. If you apply the front brake while the wheel is airborne, it will stop, and coming down on a stopped front wheel is a Very Bad Thing.

* Front flat. If you have tire blowout or a sudden flat on the front wheel, you should use the rear brake alone to bring yourself to a safe stop. Braking a wheel that has a deflated tire can cause the tire to come off the rim, and is likely to cause a crash.

* Broken cable...or other failure of the front brake.
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Old 11-03-04 | 10:51 PM
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Yeah, yeah, yeah - I read Sheldon's page about it just a bit ago. Thanks, I'll continue to use my rear brake.
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Old 11-04-04 | 10:19 AM
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Make sure your life insurance policy is payed before using the rear brake.
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Old 11-04-04 | 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Becca
Yeah, yeah, yeah - I read Sheldon's page about it just a bit ago. Thanks, I'll continue to use my rear brake.
Well considering the fact that 60% of your total braking force comes from the front..... Best method to use to help you learn rear first to slow then add in the front to stop.
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Old 11-04-04 | 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Raiyn
WRONG!
Actually in a way you're wrong as well. When you mtb and do dirt jumps and urban riding exclusively. The front brake isn't needed. Same with BMX, one brake is all you need and that brake is located on the rear.

To answer the question, yes all that is different is the adapters.
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Old 11-04-04 | 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by KonaRider24
Actually in a way you're wrong as well. When you mtb and do dirt jumps and urban riding exclusively. The front brake isn't needed. Same with BMX, one brake is all you need and that brake is located on the rear.

To answer the question, yes all that is different is the adapters.
Sorry you're wrong. This isn't the BMX forum. Urban riding requires an even greater mastery of braking. More cars, less time to react especially in the downtown core. To tell someone to use their rear exclusively is extremely bad advice. Sheldon is right.
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Old 11-04-04 | 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by operator
Sorry you're wrong. This isn't the BMX forum. Urban riding requires an even greater mastery of braking. More cars, less time to react especially in the downtown core. To tell someone to use their rear exclusively is extremely bad advice. Sheldon is right.
I'm not talking commuter bike or trials stupid. I'm talking bikes that can be launched off of steps, grind rails. Less cable equals an easier ability to do X-ups and Barspins. If you ever get a look at John Cowan's bike(Dirt Jump), Aaron Chase's bike, Chris Donahue's bike, and other non trials style of riders you will notice one thing, no front brake. Get some stuff to back up your claim before you go calling a person out.
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Old 11-04-04 | 05:43 PM
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lol for most use i dont even use hte rear brake, Ive never flipped over hte handlebar, its just a matter of not squeezing the brakes like you might slam the brakes on a car. So if i put hte brakes that i have (IS mount) in front, on the back, should i be okay? I know that i will have to get new housing but that isnt a huge expensive
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Old 11-04-04 | 07:00 PM
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You will need a longer cable/brake line for that.
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Old 11-04-04 | 07:11 PM
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to do bar spins with brakes all you need is a detangler, like a Oryg. And yes, mech discs will work fine with one. it may not be as smooth...but if your in the road, then you need to be equipped for the road....it's like fixies who go out there without a front brake...it's their risk.

plus a front brake is not all that hard to deal with in any weather...even on my tmn bike going fullo-bore, I can put the brakes on hard enough to lift my rear wheel, and still be able to keep it in check. Emergency stops are easy when you have your modulation down...now unclipping could be the problem

I've had some fun ones where I had to swerve since I couldnt unclip in time. It comes with the territory.
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Old 11-04-04 | 09:01 PM
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A detangler works at it's best with a min of 2 cables.
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Old 11-04-04 | 11:30 PM
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Originally Posted by KonaRider24
Actually in a way you're wrong as well. When you mtb and do dirt jumps and urban riding exclusively. The front brake isn't needed. Same with BMX, one brake is all you need and that brake is located on the rear.

To answer the question, yes all that is different is the adapters.
Kona if you've been following Becca's posts - she ain't a dirt jumper.
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Old 11-05-04 | 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Raiyn
Kona if you've been following Becca's posts - she ain't a dirt jumper.
I was reacting to operator.
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Old 11-05-04 | 11:48 PM
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But it was me that you quoted,
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Old 11-05-04 | 11:59 PM
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The reactions to what I had been taught have been funny. Yes, I use my rear brake as my primary brake. I do use my front brake, but only after I've applied my rear one and only if I really, really need to stop Right Now. I've never taken a header because of it, nor have I ever been in a wreck for stopping this way. I have been in wrecks where footballs were directed at my front wheel, or I hit some pothole or a curb funny. But never anything from how I stop.

Do you guys take Sheldon's stuff as bible? He's very good, granted - but I view him as simply one source of information.
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Old 11-06-04 | 03:37 AM
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his site is quoted a bit since its one of the less biased and complete sites out there...given he does have his biases (who doesnt?), but many of his tips did help me (and seemingly others on this board) from time to time.
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Old 11-06-04 | 03:41 AM
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I have to admit that I've learned from him too. It's just that his opinion of braking is opposite to what I learned and use. My point is that it's just opinion on all sides. I'm really not trying to start a flamefest.
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Old 11-06-04 | 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Becca
I have to admit that I've learned from him too. It's just that his opinion of braking is opposite to what I learned and use. My point is that it's just opinion on all sides. I'm really not trying to start a flamefest.
No. Becca it is NOT opinion it is a FACT. Motorcyclists are taught the exact same thing that I've been preaching. https://www.webbikeworld.com/Motorcyc...aking-tips.htm
https://www.motorcyclecruiser.com/str...rvbraking0104/
if you're into the math
https://www.mecc.unipd.it/~cos/DINAMO...raking_new.htm
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Old 11-06-04 | 11:59 PM
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there is reason it's the opposite...folks dont want to see their kids flip their bikes, since kids overreact, so they teach them to use the rear brake.

The front brake if used right, is the best brake to use. Actually I dont even use my rear brake, unless it's wet outside, in that case I use both at once.

There are all sorts of things you will learn that are the opposite of what you were taught earlier in life, and it's all based on the application. Child riders are a different app...many don't have the confidence or skill to properly modulate a brake until years later, therefore they learn to use the rear primarily....once you get more skilled, then the front should be tuaght...sadly that lesson never seems to happen.

Either way, consider messing with the front in a open parking lot sometime. going stright, turning, even under acceleration, just to get the feel of it.
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Old 11-07-04 | 04:49 PM
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I have to agree with Catatonic. Even if you look at a lot of kids bikes, little kids bikes (like the barbie ones and whatnot), many only have one break lever and thats the rear, remember hte kind where you pedal backwards to stop? I guess some of those childhood habits carry on.
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