I'm struggling with electronic shifting a bit. I get it. I've used it briefly, it is pretty amazing. Everything Hillrider said above is true, it will trickle down, the cost will decrease, all of these things we've seen with so many other "high tech" products in the past. Our bike shop is expecting our first shipment of Di2 equipped bikes soon, we didn't bring in any Dura Ace level Di2 but now that it's available at Ultegra level and the price has dropped so much we have several of these bikes coming. So I will learn to work on it, although this isn't really critical at this point because we have a couple or three other mechanics who will do that, too. I will definitely have to sell it, and I think from a performance standpoint that will be easy.

The reason I'm struggling with it is that I love bicycles for their pure mechanical simplicity. I really do, I believe they are one of man's "noblest inventions." Introducing something that is battery powered into the drivetrain bothers me as a matter of principal. It's no longer purely mechanical, and it's not powered exclusively by the rider, and it bothers me.

As you might guess, I have no plans to have a bike of my own equipped with it. The guys in the shop give me a hard time about this, having seen me relent on several other "new school" items for my own use and in the end enjoy these items immensely. We'll see.

That's for sure. I think I paid about 800 bucks for my first microwave oven back in the 70s, and I only got it so cheap because my in-laws worked in the plant where it was manufactured, and I was able to get in on the employee family discount.
That's when that type of thing was still manufactured on this continent.

Cyclists who have never been on a Dura-Ace Di2 equipped bicycle should go and test-ride it, then they can opine in a very knowledgeable manner about electronic-assisted shifting.

As I see it, while it's okay to philosophically lament the move away from "the simple nature of bicycles", there is absolutely no doubt that electronic-assisted shifting is an unbelievable improvement over what we have now.

Also, just imagine the possibilities moving forward......

If an innovation lets you get more, and I mean much more, from your cycling experience, then what is all the fuss about. I mean, even luddites came to learn that you get on with the program.

I think electronic-assisted shifting is unbelievable for what it has brought (and will still bring) to cycling.

Attach the shifters to the bars. Attach the DRs to the frame. Mount the battery under a cage. Run the wires and connect them. Shift to the designated gear, do the magic button stroke to trim, use the shifter to trim, exit trim mode, test ride the bike. Next project?

So now they have several meter long electrical cables? (Or are they wireless?)

And since some people don't like STI, they shouldn't develop that either! BAN EVERYTHING I DON'T LIKE!

Bikes have always advanced with new technology, and always will. The fact that some people get attached to what was once cutting edge technology doesn't mean bicycle development should stop forever.

Pretty much. You still adjust limit screws and may need to do a couple other prerequisite steps. The internal wiring option takes a little longer. But overall, Shimano did a nice job making theirs straightforward to set up.

For those who'll be doing a Shimano system, I know Shimano says to put the FD parallel to the outer ring, but you may want to have it just a tiny bit tail-out with the compact crank. Seems to help prevent chain drop.

Wired for now, with internal-routing options for bikes that were built for that. The latest one I did, the owner sent his seatpost to Calfee Design, who sent it back with the Di2 battery inside so he doesn't even have a visible battery pack.

Thanks for the tutorial.

Interesting.. I think from the sounds of it I could put off going electronic for something like 5 years before I even really consider it.

Find more hills.

Seriously; I just got a 10 speed road bike last week and I've already been through every single reasonable gear (1x1-8, 2x1-10, 3x3-10). I love the number of gears on it. Allows them to be tighter spaced than otherwise.

Maybe your post was aimed at me based on my above post, I don't know. If so, as I said in my first line: I get it.

I know it works better, I know it's awesome. My problem is that it introduces an outside power source into the drivetrain of a bicycle. And I realize that I'm overthinking things and that most folks who actually use it will love it. In fact, I used it on a test ride, and was very impressed. It will be awesome to get the Di2 bikes in that we're expecting, should be an exciting product to sell.

And yes, of course, technological changes have always come about, and always will, and in the end they work better or they fade away. It's all good. The difference with electronic shifting is that it's battery powered, not human powered, and yet it's part of the drivetrain of the bicycle.

I hope it catches on bigtime and sells like crazy. But I still have a problem with it. For now. But I've been known to change my mind.

Well, those who don't like or don't want electronic shifting should have at least 30 years to get used to the idea before being forced to use it, and quite possibly not even then. Technology from the 1980's (6-speed freewheels, downtube friction shifting, lugged steel frames, etc.) is still readily available to anyone who wants to use it.

Agree it's progress or lament the change? Either way you can have what you want.

^like^

I got a ways to go before that.. I think every single one of my "road bikes" other then the fakey are all 70's hardware...

I agree with everything you have posted but there is also this:

In the early days of index shifting I resisted for a long time because I didn't need it. When I finally bought my first (down tube) index shifting bike I remember thinking during my first ride "What have I been missing." I also resisted STI shifting on the handlebar for years. When I eventually succumbed I had the same kind of feeling on my first ride.

At my age there's a good chance that I'll never own a bike with electronic shifting. I'm certainly not motivated to buy one today. If I ever do acquire one, I wonder if I will have the same reaction.

The SunTour Cyclone Symettric shifters of the '80's would trim the front derailleur to match the rear derailleur's position via a cam in the shifter body:
https://www.velobase.com/ViewComponen...0-06DAA7456995
This system actually worked, but it was superseded by index shifting and then "integrated" shifting by the '90's.

A while back I test-rode a Di2 bike at the Shimano booth at a show (Handmade Bike Show? I can't remember.) The rear worked fine, the front jammed repeatedly even though I had a Shimano tech standing next to me. Don't know what was wrong, but as soon as I got off, they took the bike off the stand and hid it behind a curtain.

ive only ever seen these shifters in picture and on video (they predate me by a number of years) but i have heard mixed reviews. was it just that they were really hard to set up? i could see front derailleur cable tension being somewhat touchy (and critical)


interesting experiences with the di2. i wonder if the FD was bend or damaged.

The main problem was that the shifters had to mount to a stud on the top of the downtube, not conventional shifter bosses on the sides of the tube, because the two levers were connected. So not many bikes were equipped for them from the get-go.

I had a bike with the frame mount, and wanted to install indexed Shimano downtube levers, so I had to have a special mount ordered for that. Talk about rare. A clamp-on shifter mount would've been another option, I guess.

i am aware of the "aero" mounting position. i was just wondering if there were setup issues with the correct frame. despite being friction, the front and rear would almost need indexed together.

Oh, my post was not aimed at you. If you go on the roadie forum, you'll see there are still a lot of cyclists who are still sure they don't and won't like electronic-assisted shifting. All I wish is that people keep an open mind about it, and more importantly, go test-ride a bike with Dura-Ace Di2.

And people who say things like " bored engineers solving problems that were not there" should note that SRAM was eating Shimano's lunch big-time, and the only way for Shimano to respond was to shift the paradigm.

Now, I'm waiting for SRAM's response. It can only be good for cyclists. And if it's not good, it will go the way of Zap/Mektronic.

The market rules. And we vote with our dollars.

I agree with the fact that SRAM got Shimano's attention in a big way. FWIW, I've heard through the grapevine that SRAM will introduce something big in the near future. Rumor has it that it's not electronic.....

another hydraulic rumor?

I ain't sayin' what it is exactly......mainly because I don't know.

Totally violates the "Keep It Simple" rule. But then, the whole world seems to have forgotten this rule, and is taking great pleasure in making things more complicated. Just because we can. bk

Horse and buggy were simple, but I am sure you don't prefer them to cars.

Right?