Derailleur travel issue
#1
Thread Starter
Aspiring curmudgeon


Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,486
Likes: 26
From: Saint Louis
Bikes: Guerciotti, Serotta, Gaulzetti
Derailleur travel issue
This is my first experience with cassette hubs, and I'm having some derailleur travel issues. The derailleur doesn't seem to want to move far enough in to engage the largest cogs on cassette. The limit screw is set all the way out. I'm certain that its the derailleur, not the shifter, because I moved it by hand before installing the cable and it still wouldn't reach.
The cassette is 8 speed and sits very close to the spokes, leaving a sizable gap between the smallest cog and the stays. Do I just need to move the cassette farther right? Are there spacers for this, or does the wheel need to be redished?
Shifting is friction with a Suntour barcon and derailleur is a Suntour Arx long cage. Thanks in advance.
The cassette is 8 speed and sits very close to the spokes, leaving a sizable gap between the smallest cog and the stays. Do I just need to move the cassette farther right? Are there spacers for this, or does the wheel need to be redished?
Shifting is friction with a Suntour barcon and derailleur is a Suntour Arx long cage. Thanks in advance.
__________________
"Party on comrades" -- Lenin, probably
"Party on comrades" -- Lenin, probably
#2
It looks to me like you need a 4.5 mm spacer behind the cassette. They are necessary when using a 7 speed cassette on a 9 speed wheel, so they're easy to find. Is the tire centered in the stays?
#3
Thread Starter
Aspiring curmudgeon


Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,486
Likes: 26
From: Saint Louis
Bikes: Guerciotti, Serotta, Gaulzetti
I didn't know this was a thing, but that seems like it will solve my problem. Thanks. The wheel looks dead center in the stays and cantilevers.
__________________
"Party on comrades" -- Lenin, probably
"Party on comrades" -- Lenin, probably
#4
Nigel
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,991
Likes: 7
From: San Jose, CA
Bikes: 1980s and 1990s steel: CyclePro, Nishiki, Schwinn, SR, Trek........
Sorry; I do not believe that the spacer will work - the cassette lock ring will not engage the hub.
You need to reposition the axle in the hub, so that the cogs are closer to the frame (chain should clear by about 1mm (.040")), which will require shifting or changing the spacers on the axle. This will allow the RD to reach more cogs, it still might not be able to reach all of them. And the wheel should be re-dished.
You need to reposition the axle in the hub, so that the cogs are closer to the frame (chain should clear by about 1mm (.040")), which will require shifting or changing the spacers on the axle. This will allow the RD to reach more cogs, it still might not be able to reach all of them. And the wheel should be re-dished.
#5
Disco Infiltrator




Joined: May 2013
Posts: 15,350
Likes: 3,550
From: Folsom CA
Bikes: Stormchaser, Paramount, Tilt, Samba tandem
8+ cassettes are wider than 7- freewheels and do require more RD travel. Some older systems just don't have the cable pull to make it. Or it's possible your RD doesn't have the throw to get all the way to the bottom cog. I don't know about your Suntour stuff specifically, but for instance an NR shifter has a pretty small barrel and a NR RD has a pretty high ratio to match, so if you hook up a NR shifter to a modern Shimano RD you might have trouble getting it to move far enough. I have this problem on my Super Sport which has a Shimano RD and a shifter that was made to go with a Huret. I have juuuuust enough cable to shift it over 6 speeds. With an 8-speed cassette I'd have to give up on the outer gear.
__________________
Genesis 49:16-17
"Well, well!" said Holmes, impatiently. "A good cyclist does not need a high road. The moor is intersected with paths and the moon is at the full."
Genesis 49:16-17
"Well, well!" said Holmes, impatiently. "A good cyclist does not need a high road. The moor is intersected with paths and the moon is at the full."
#6
Ride, Wrench, Swap, Race

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 9,835
Likes: 1,816
From: Northern California
Bikes: Cheltenham-Pedersen racer, Boulder F/S Paris-Roubaix, Varsity racer, '52 Christophe, '62 Continental, '92 Merckx, '75 Limongi, '76 Presto, '72 Gitane SC, '71 Schwinn SS, etc.
I agree with nfmisso on this issue.
The hub was assembled wrong at some point.
Visibly, with the 8s cassette shown, there should be only 3.5mm or so between the outer (i.e. driveside) face of the smallest cog and the inner (i.e. non-driveside) face of the dropout. It looks like a few millimeters of spacer washers has perhaps been added to the driveside locknut/spacer stack, or perhaps that a substitute cone with a much greater "length" was substituted at some point.
If the driveside axle locknut has an integral spacer, as it somewhat appears to have, then substituting a regular flat locknut may fix the driveside spacing.
The overall axle spacing will also then possibly need to be restored to 130mm by tinkering with the non-driveside locknut/spacer stack, and the axle then centered so as to protrude 4.5mm or so, equally, on both ends.
The hub was assembled wrong at some point.
Visibly, with the 8s cassette shown, there should be only 3.5mm or so between the outer (i.e. driveside) face of the smallest cog and the inner (i.e. non-driveside) face of the dropout. It looks like a few millimeters of spacer washers has perhaps been added to the driveside locknut/spacer stack, or perhaps that a substitute cone with a much greater "length" was substituted at some point.
If the driveside axle locknut has an integral spacer, as it somewhat appears to have, then substituting a regular flat locknut may fix the driveside spacing.
The overall axle spacing will also then possibly need to be restored to 130mm by tinkering with the non-driveside locknut/spacer stack, and the axle then centered so as to protrude 4.5mm or so, equally, on both ends.
#7
Senior Member


Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 7,955
Likes: 705
From: Port Angeles, WA
Bikes: A green one, "Ragleigh," or something.
I bet good ol' ARx can swing it, though. Redo your spacers so the hub shifts to the right a bit; see if the RD can cover the spread, then decide if you need to re-dish.
__________________
● 1971 Grandis SL ● 1972 Lambert Grand Prix frankenbike ● 1972 Raleigh Super Course fixie ● 1973 Nishiki Semi-Pro ● 1979 Motobecane Grand Jubile ●1980 Apollo "Legnano" ● 1984 Peugeot Vagabond ● 1985 Shogun Prairie Breaker ● 1986 Merckx Super Corsa ● 1987 Schwinn Tempo ● 1988 Schwinn Voyageur ● 1989 Bottechia Team ADR replica ● 1990 Cannondale ST600 ● 1993 Technium RT600 ● 1996 Kona Lava Dome ●
● 1971 Grandis SL ● 1972 Lambert Grand Prix frankenbike ● 1972 Raleigh Super Course fixie ● 1973 Nishiki Semi-Pro ● 1979 Motobecane Grand Jubile ●1980 Apollo "Legnano" ● 1984 Peugeot Vagabond ● 1985 Shogun Prairie Breaker ● 1986 Merckx Super Corsa ● 1987 Schwinn Tempo ● 1988 Schwinn Voyageur ● 1989 Bottechia Team ADR replica ● 1990 Cannondale ST600 ● 1993 Technium RT600 ● 1996 Kona Lava Dome ●
#8
Ride, Wrench, Swap, Race

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 9,835
Likes: 1,816
From: Northern California
Bikes: Cheltenham-Pedersen racer, Boulder F/S Paris-Roubaix, Varsity racer, '52 Christophe, '62 Continental, '92 Merckx, '75 Limongi, '76 Presto, '72 Gitane SC, '71 Schwinn SS, etc.
This works out well, given that the Scwhinn-Approved "Allvit" has a fine barrel adjuster to keep cable tension at optimum, and conveniently serves to protect the cabling from any ham-fisted slam into the largest cog.
But in case anyone is now wondering, an Allvit won't substitute for a Shimano indexing derailer, since the actuation ratio is non-linear (i.e. highly regressive).
#9
Senior Member


Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 39,897
Likes: 3,865
From: New Rochelle, NY
Bikes: too many bikes from 1967 10s (5x2)Frejus to a Sumitomo Ti/Chorus aluminum 10s (10x2), plus one non-susp mtn bike I use as my commuter
The cassette is way too far inboard. The lockring should be as close as possible to the right dropout,with typical clearance being in the 1-2mm range, so the chain on the first sprocket just clears with similar 1-2mm clearance.
There must be some unnecessary spacers on the right end of the axle which will need to come off. When finished spacing the rear axle, you'll also need to recheck the wheel dish.
There must be some unnecessary spacers on the right end of the axle which will need to come off. When finished spacing the rear axle, you'll also need to recheck the wheel dish.
__________________
FB
Chain-L site
An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.
Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.
“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN
WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
FB
Chain-L site
An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.
Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.
“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN
WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
#10
Disco Infiltrator




Joined: May 2013
Posts: 15,350
Likes: 3,550
From: Folsom CA
Bikes: Stormchaser, Paramount, Tilt, Samba tandem
Well there goes my Shimergeaux plans :-D
__________________
Genesis 49:16-17
"Well, well!" said Holmes, impatiently. "A good cyclist does not need a high road. The moor is intersected with paths and the moon is at the full."
Genesis 49:16-17
"Well, well!" said Holmes, impatiently. "A good cyclist does not need a high road. The moor is intersected with paths and the moon is at the full."
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
dork_flap
Bicycle Mechanics
9
02-14-16 12:08 PM






