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Toeing in Vintage Long Reach Sidepulls

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Toeing in Vintage Long Reach Sidepulls

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Old 04-16-19 | 06:44 AM
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Toeing in Vintage Long Reach Sidepulls

My '52 Raleigh has quite a bit of brake squeal in the front brakes. I've been trying to toe in the pads the usual way, by using an adjustable wrench to bend the brake arm slightly, but given the age of the brake arms, I am wondering if, first of all, my usual way is the correct way, and second, if it is correct, is it OK to bend the arms on brakes that old. I have lived long enough to have a large enough catalogue of memories of accidentally snapping things to be overly cautious.

I was thinking the ideal solution would be to find a beveled washer that would toe in the brake pads without bending the arms at all. Is there such a thing?

I also wonder, just generally, how safe, in terms of dependably durable, old long reach brakes are. They flex quite a bit when I brake, and I assume they have been flexing like that for decades. Can I depend on them for decades longer, or would it be prudent to look for more modern long reach brakes to use on the bike? I do quite a bit of fast downhills toward intersections on my commute home. I've never had a brake arm snap, (though I did have my front brake cable snap once), but I wouldn't want it to happen.
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Old 04-16-19 | 07:02 AM
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Toeing in was how bike mechanics dealt with squeal for a long time. I did in the shop I worked in. That said brakes can snap.

Have you tried the kool stop continentals? https://www.amazon.com/Kool-Stop-Bic.../dp/B001HBRHJS

I've had good luck with them; they work well and I have had little issues with squealing.

A beveled washer would be ideal and you can find some brake shoes that have those (certainly common enough on cantilevers since those do squeal and you can't bend them).
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Old 04-16-19 | 07:10 AM
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Toeing In Calipers

NEVER EVER try to bend Universal Brake Calipers. Learned that lesson about 1974. I tried to toe in a Universal 61 on a customer's bike and the arm snapped clean off. Fortunately we had a box full of those calipers and I replaced the broken one.

I use an 8" adjustable wrench (Crescent wrench) with tape wrapped around both jaws to reduce damage to the calipers.

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Old 04-16-19 | 07:22 AM
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I just take a file to the brake pad. I haven't broken a caliper arm since.
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Old 04-16-19 | 07:39 AM
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^^ this. Just sand / file the pad at an angle, which gives the same result as bending the caliper arm, but with zero risk.
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Old 04-16-19 | 08:13 AM
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Thanks, I'll give filing a try.
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Old 04-16-19 | 10:28 AM
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What kind of calipers? Many are quite amenable to that type of bending, including Raleigh steel and Weinmann aluminum.
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Old 04-16-19 | 11:47 AM
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I use sand paper. IMO, it is easier than a file. Either way, adjusting the pad completely eliminates the risk of damage to the caliper arm.
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Old 04-16-19 | 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Bad Lag
I use sand paper. IMO, it is easier than a file. Either way, adjusting the pad completely eliminates the risk of damage to the caliper arm.
Sandpaper runs the risk of embedding sand particles into the brake pads, though.

If this Raleigh has its original steel brake calipers, bending them to improve the toeing should be a non-issue.
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Old 04-16-19 | 01:13 PM
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Ditto the Kool Stop pads with the plow tips, which are self-toeing. Not all Kool Stops have that feature though.

And ditto using a clean file rather than sandpaper. Brush out the file first, if it's been used before on metal.

Or beveled washers. I keep the metal bits and pieces from worn out V-brake pads for that purpose. Handy for adjusting fender mounts too.
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Old 04-16-19 | 03:09 PM
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Could you bend the post on the shoe instead?
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Old 04-16-19 | 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted by ThermionicScott
Sandpaper runs the risk of embedding sand particles into the brake pads, though.
I suppose that's true but it has never happened to me (that I know of). A quick inspection will reveal if you have a problem.

I have picked up grit from dirty roads but you can hear that and pick it out of the pad. It's a maintenance item.

The abrasive on garnet paper is not well bonded to the paper but is designed for the abrasive to break down (crumble) with use.

Last time I used sand paper it was a high quality 50 grit with abrasive that is bonded to the fabric substrate. It made quick, easy work of toeing in the new Campagnolo pads.
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Old 04-16-19 | 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Bad Lag
I suppose that's true but it has never happened to me (that I know of). A quick inspection will reveal if you have a problem.

I have picked up grit from dirty roads but you can hear that and pick it out of the pad. It's a maintenance item.

The abrasive on garnet paper is not well bonded to the paper but is designed for the abrasive to break down (crumble) with use.

Last time I used sand paper it was a high quality 50 grit with abrasive that is bonded to the fabric substrate. It made quick, easy work of toeing in the new Campagnolo pads.
I'll second the use of a very coarse and super heavy duty sort of sander belt material, I've sanded literally hundreds of pads to match the rim profile and this years-old strip is still going strong and with never any issue of scratchy stuff left in the pad's surface.

I sand with the wheel in place and brakes applied, the better to correct any toe-out condition caused by a poorly-aligned caliper or fork.
As an added bonus, this method tends to create clearance with the tire sidewall if it is lacking, so I first rotate the wheel to where the proximity between pad and tire is closest, insert the cloth and force the wheel to rotate forward while the brake is held applied.

This method doesn't create much toe-in, beyond what is created by the normal braking force tending to twist the brake arms, but instead is the "stable" amount of toe-in (that won't go away as the miles accumulate).
And, if the pads still squeal, then less-grippy pads really is the long-term solution.

Word of caution though, that the grit surface of the cloth will scratch paint easily, so use cautiously around painted stays and fork legs!


Last edited by dddd; 04-16-19 at 07:27 PM.
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