Bike Forums - Nishiki Serial Number Database

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Ubik (Post 15204716)

That looks almost exactly like my Road Master, but yours does not seem to have DT shifter braze-ons?
The head badge sticker and color is identical.

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=295659

thanks a lot. it does look a lot like it. Probaly same model, close in year.

Quote:

Originally Posted by timinseattle (Post 15200043)

I have a nishiki century found under ivy in the alley behind a garage of a house I bought. The bike is in surprisingly good shape considering where it was found. I am confused though about the serial number. The bottom bracket is stamped K68. Not at all like any of the numbers listed above. Can anyone help with this?

Most Nishiki Century that have surfaced are from the early 1980s and were manufactured by Giant. Check the drive side rear dropout for a date code, format Gmmyy per post #1.

Quote:

Originally Posted by icariis (Post 15204756)

thanks a lot. it does look a lot like it. Probaly same model, close in year.

It not a Road master, as that was a European market model and your bicycle has a USA market serial number. It's very much a frankenbike, so it's hard to tell what is OEM, with the possible exception of the shifters. The top mount shifter boss, in conjunction with a relatively long wheelbase and 27" wheelset suggests an International.

Quote:

Originally Posted by T-Mar (Post 15204840)

thanks a lot T-Mar. Been driving me crazy to know.

just picked up a Nishiki International on craigslist, converted to single speed.

Serial: KB 111461

Sugino crank.
Dia-Compe brakes
Sakae bars i believe.
I'm the 3rd owner so i'm not sure whats original and what isn't

Sounds original to me, or original equipmentlike anyway. It probably would have had Suntour Cyclone. A shame it's no longer on the bike.,,,,BD

icariis,

From the engraved seat stays and the lugs it looks to be a 1980 International. I think it has been repainted and different decals were added. The head tube has the rivet holes for a Nishiki Eagle headbadge.

I think most of the components are not original: crankset, shifters, brakes, forks, headset, wheels.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ubik (Post 15204716)

How the heck did you get in my back yard??,,,,BD:lol:

http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n...r/DSCN4025.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by NISHIKI GOLD (Post 12230090)

http://img594.imageshack.us/i/nishiki003.jpg/

Follow that link theres a picture of the bike when I first bought it. I appreciate the info you gave me.

Reply to old post #636.

The lugs, seatstays, crankset, style of chrome on the forks are consistent with the Olympic model between 1975 and 1978.

On the top end of the seat tube it looks like there is an oval decal, "SPECIAL 150 TUBING". I don't know which year of Olympic used this tubing. Some of these years the Olympic models had TANGE decals.

Your day must have been much more boring than mine! Post 636 is 2 years old and Nishiki Gold hasn't posted since then.

http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/3755/nishiki003.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bianchigirll (Post 15221531)

Your day must have been much more boring than mine! Post 636 is 2 years old and Nishiki Gold hasn't posted since then.

You might be right on the boring day thing.

The post was not necessarily for Nishiki Gold. A lot of people read through this thread, to learn about Nishiki brand and/or Kuwamara Built bicycles, no matter who the post was for. This includes many of the old posts. This thread has become a repository for WCCSC, Nishiki, Kuwamara, Giant, etc. information.

Not all of the posts requesting information have been responded to, or responded to with definitive answers. So, when I see something, no matter how old, that I am pretty certain of, I put in my two cents (or less).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gallo (Post 15034436)

T-Mar

I have a 1985-86? Tri A Shimano 600 non index equipped

it has the Kawamura sticker so I assume that it is onehttp://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=287771

I have seen the serial number info and this bike does not seem to fit as it has no letters before the serial number.

its is stamped 944 8693 the 944 is on the left side of bottom bracket with a large space between and the 8693 right side with the bike upside down. Any thoughts of why no letters as seems the norm from what I have read on this thre

Gallo,

along with the odd serial number, your Tri-A is Tange 2 tubing. All the other Tri-A bikes that have been posted are Tange 1. The other Tri-A bikes all have "standard" Kuwamara serial numbers.

The brochure that you referenced also shows Tange 1.

I have seen one other BB with a similar format serial number, a Canadian Nishiki, probably a Continental model.

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...1#post11060546

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...me-Help-Please

Unfortunately the Canadian frame has been stripped, so there is no tube material information.

Need to look for some other Tange 2 frames and compare.

Nishiki Competition
KS3-28073

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hummer (Post 15222173)

A lot of people read through this thread, but apparently ignore everything in it, then post their serial number and ask:"I can't figure out what year this bike is?", which TMar covered expertly in posting #1.

Quote:

Originally Posted by that_guy_zach (Post 9959793)

Hmm. The crank set is a triple shimano, And the rear is a 600 but I am not sure of the model. I found pictures of a Continental in Canada and it had Cantis on it.

I can make out 2 letters on the top tube.

It is a R or a P, Then 2 letters then a A it seems.

that_guy_zach in old posts #363 and #365,

the letters on the top tube should be for the model name. From your description of the letters the model name that fits is "ROYAL".

The headbadge is the same as that for 1983 model year Kuwamara built Nishikis.

There is another Nishiki "ROYAL" (not Royale) from member matimeo. His serial number very close to yours, ARYC466854. See the following threads:

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...he-Mysterybike
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/318322-Nishiki-Royal-finally-done-%28pics%29

Quote:

Originally Posted by wrk101 (Post 15228006)

and then there are those that do

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hummer (Post 15081941)

Reply to an old post #694

Hi Mark,

Your frame is from 1976. The Shields name on the down tube. Shields was the Canadian distributor in the late 1970s.

I have seen pictures of US market Internationals from the late 1970s and their frames say "Chrome Molybdenum". I don't know if people were using the term "4130" in the late 1970s.

Given the era and Canadian market, this International is probably hi-tensile steel, The database shows a similarly spec'd, 1977 Shields Nishiki International with a hi-tensile decal. Baring a decal, the best way to identify the frame material is via the seat post diameter.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hummer (Post 15228198)

Actually, this is a 1984 model. The model could be Royale as opposed to Royal. This model started out as a upgraded versionof the Olympic in 1978 and at that time the model name ended with an "e". There are other Royales in the database too, though I can't confirm the model name with the "e" as late as 1984. It's possible that this one could go either way.

Just picked up a very tall frame Nishiki Sport that obviously has seen some upgrades. No serial number on bottom bracket, but driveside dropout is stamped G0783, and the offside dropout is stamped 3187136. It has many Shimano 105 components (brake levers, downtube shifters, hubs, derailleurs, crankset with Biopoace rings, 7-spd rear cluster.) and Shimano 600 brakes. Rims are Matrix Titan.

http://images.craigslist.org/3G33Kf3...09a363168d.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Millerad1651 (Post 15257552)

Picked this Blazer up yesterday. I've looked everywhere, and can only find any type of identification on the derailleurs. From what I've read and seen, its all stock. Rear derailleur has EF so it's June of '88. Not 100% sure what the GX means on the front derailleur. Any tips on finding what year the frame is from?

As stated in my reply to your previous thread, the bicycle is a 1989 or 1990 model. This is based on the decal style. It fits well with the rear derailleur date code, which is in the grey area and could represent either model year. However, the Alpha 2000 derailleurs were only in production for 1988 and 1989, being replaced in 1990 by the AC 2000. This should make the bicycle a 1989 model, unless the manufacturer had a large stock of left over Alpha 2000 derailleurs.

Any further attempt to corroborate the model year would require the frame's serial number and even this may not be conclusive, as by this time the brand had been acquired by Derby Int'l, who was contracting new manufacturers. Still, the data would be appreciated, as it may prove valuable in decyphering Derby era serial number formats.

As for the "EX" on the front derailleur, I suspect it may be part of the model number. For instance, the Alpha 2000 rear derailleur had the the model number RD-2000-GX. I wasn't able to find a model suffix EX but it does fit the format and is too large for the traditional date code. There does appear to a double character stamp below the "VIA" designation that may be the actual date code.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hummer (Post 15101152)

TMar,

I have a theory about Giant manufactured frames with the Nishiki name.

Giant was contracted by West Coast Cycle Supply Company (WCCSC) to make bicycles and put the Nishiki brand name on them. Giant made Nishikis were only sold in the United States of America (USA) market.

On what do I base this theory? Several things.

The wikipedia article, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nishiki_%28bicycle%29, suggests that it was WCCSC who contracted Giant because of currency fluctuations. If this is correct, then it was not Kuwamara that sub-contracted Giant, but WCCSC who directly contracted Giant.

Trademark ownership. WCCSC owned the Nishiki trademark inside the USA. In theory they could sell anything as a Nishiki. Outside the USA, I believe that Kuwamara owned the Nishiki trademark name.

Giant made the entry level bikes for WCCSC. Consumers are sensitive to price on entry level bicycles. With Giant making the frames in Tiawan, the price was not sensitive to the increasing value of the Japanese yen. WCCSC entry level bikes could continue to compete on price in the USA.

Kuwamara tri-colour rectangle/emblem. Giant built bikes do not have the Kuwamara emblem, which indicates that Kuwamara was not involved with the manufacturing.

Giant frames in other markets. If Kuwamara contracted Giant, then one would think that you could find Giant made Nishikis in other geographic markets. Nishikis are also found in Northern Europe, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand. Are any of the Nishikis found here made by Giant?

For the Canadian market, the Rally and Carrera were the entry level models. I have seen a few of these and pictures. None of them have the Giant stamped dropouts. Many have a Toshiba label, which indicates Japanese tubing. I have not seen any that say Taiwan. But this is a small survey size, so by no means conclusive.

Some of the Giant models from the late 1970s and early 1980s were: Sport, Marina, Century, Sebring. Did Kuwamara ever make any of these models? Were these exclusively Giant models in this time period?

I believe the understanding among the majority of the long term Nishiki followers has been that the contracting was under the control of the licensee of the Nishiki brand, as opposed to Kawamura.

I say licensee because by the time that Giant got involved, it is unclear whether WCCSC was still directly involved. While they still may have owned the brand, it appears to have been licensed to the Nishiki Bicycle Company (USA) and Shields (Canada).

In 1976, Howie Cohen retired from WCCSC and handed things over to his brother, Leo Jr. and a group of investors. Currently, the earliest evidence we have of Giant manufactured Nishiki is 1978. It’s also the earliest known date for the Nishiki Bicycle Company, though there is evidence to support 1977 as Shields ‘ earliest involvement. Given that this is around or just a little over a year after Howie Cohen’s retirement seems just a little too coincidental.

I suspect that Howie’s retirement set off a chain of events driven by the profit oriented investors. The easiest way to ensure profit is to divest yourself of the risk associated with manufacturing is to simply license out the brand name. The differences between the Nishiki Bicycle Company models and the Shields Nishiki models clearly illustrate that each company had separate control over the specifications for their own models, indicating that some, if not all, of the manufacturing control was in the hands of the licensee. What we do know is that the Nishiki Bicycle was still solvent in 1981 but out of the picture in 1983. That puts their life span at four years, minimum. Five year terms seem to be a common lisence agreement period in the bicycle industry, so I suspect this was the case with Nishiki Bicycle Company. Whether Leo Jr, and the investors were also involved with the Nishiki Bicycle Company is unclear.

Undoubtedly, the reason behind the addition of Giant was purely economics. The bicycle boom basically collapsed in 1975, leaving lots of excess inventory. Going forward, everybody would be competing in a much smaller market. To stay competitive, costs would have to be closely maintained. Taiwanese companies like Giant had an advantage in that the rate of exchange between the New Taiwan and USA dollars was fixed. On the other hand, the Yen wasn’t fixed and the post 1975 trend was increasing the cost of Japanese manufacturing. So, I think it was a very easy decision to offload the high volume, entry level models to Giant, where there would be less volatility in the cost.

The move to Giant does not appear to have happened until after Howie Cohen stepped down. It is well known that Howie was extremely quality conscientious, placing it over cost and he would probably have been reluctant to source to somebody other than Kawamura, whom he had carefully cultivated. While the financial impetus would have been there as early as 1975, there is no evidence to support this happening, at that time. It is much easier to envision Giant being brought on board under the insistence of a group of profit driven investors or a licensee, and the timing would seem to substantiate this.

While Kawamura was probably not directly evolved in the decision to utilize Giant as a second source, there probably were some cases where Kawamura did subcontract manufacture, both to Giant and other manufacturers. The database clearly shows a handful of other sources, some known and some indeterminate. Some predate Giant’s involvement and others post date it. What does seem clear , is that these were not sustained long term offloads, but temporary ones. It would not be unusual for either company to occasionally get into a backlog and require some help, due to situations like strikes, natural disasters, machine breakage, materials shortages, etc.

Certainly, the circumstantial evidence supports this scenario. For instance, we’ve seen cases of the same model coming out of two different companies in the same year and have seen frames bearing Made by Kawamura decals but having a non-Kawamura serial number format.

The vast majority of Nishiki that crop up on this forum come from the USA. Relatively few are from other markets. In the case of Kawamura, the serial number format makes it easy to determine the intended market. Offhand, I can’t think of any other manufacturer that did this, so even if we did see a Giant frame intended for another market, it would not necessarily be readily apparent.

I wouldn’t put any faith in the tubing origin as an indicator of the country of manufacture. The tubing could simply have been imported, the same as the components.

This thread brings back memories of my wife's old Nishiki from about 1983 - she won it in some contest when I was in Podiatry school. One of the features that I remember about it was a little heart on the down tube above the BB. Being married on Valentine's Day, we have always been partial to hearts! Andy

My Landeau has little, almost heart-shaped, pads brazed on the down tube to keep the gear cable clamps from slipping.

Quote:

Originally Posted by T-Mar (Post 15269653)

TMar

Very cool. Your knowledge and insight is very helpful. This explanation goes a long way toward my understanding of my bicycle post 930 931 ish

The brochure I referred to is the pink brochure which is already posted of the TriA

and also thank you to Hummer for your comments did not realize my TriA had two anomalies. Since I am in the high 180s the Tange 2 is probably a good thing

got it out for a spin yesterday.

Thanks