For the love of English 3 speeds...
#4226
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Looks like another three speed is on it's way here... they breed like rabbits.
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Would like input from some of you "tinkerers extraordinaire" out there who've been at this longer than I have...
I picked up a nice Grant Petersen-era 12-speed Bridgestone Kabuki last year and had planned to put a 3-speed hub on it and pretty much do it up almost exactly like rhm's Lambert [Post 1863] but with upright handlebars more like criscoshoes's Raleigh Gran Sport conversion [Post 1134].
While I still plan to use that basic design, I am really, REALLY considering one of the SA 5-speed hubs as can be viewed here: https://www.sturmey-archer.com/produc...4/id/33/tech/1
Here's what I'd like to find out:
1. Is the overall axle length on these hubs long enough to span the distance between the opening on the chainstays? [And if not, is such a product made these days?]
2. Are the "spoke calculator" websites out there accurate and anyone have recommendation[s] on the best one?
3. Best place to buy quality spokes/nipples/etc. at best prices?
4. There are at least 5 kinds of shifters available from SA for this hub. I'm leaning toward the twist grip. Anyone see a downside to that? [I'm not going to be racing or anything]
Thanks to all for your thoughts...
I picked up a nice Grant Petersen-era 12-speed Bridgestone Kabuki last year and had planned to put a 3-speed hub on it and pretty much do it up almost exactly like rhm's Lambert [Post 1863] but with upright handlebars more like criscoshoes's Raleigh Gran Sport conversion [Post 1134].
While I still plan to use that basic design, I am really, REALLY considering one of the SA 5-speed hubs as can be viewed here: https://www.sturmey-archer.com/produc...4/id/33/tech/1
Here's what I'd like to find out:
1. Is the overall axle length on these hubs long enough to span the distance between the opening on the chainstays? [And if not, is such a product made these days?]
2. Are the "spoke calculator" websites out there accurate and anyone have recommendation[s] on the best one?
3. Best place to buy quality spokes/nipples/etc. at best prices?
4. There are at least 5 kinds of shifters available from SA for this hub. I'm leaning toward the twist grip. Anyone see a downside to that? [I'm not going to be racing or anything]
Thanks to all for your thoughts...
#4228
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Twistgrips work the best with IGHs in general although I have a soft spot for the traditional SA shifter for three speeds.
Last edited by Salubrious; 03-28-13 at 11:07 AM.
#4229
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https://wheelbuilder.jmoore.me/
No, if that's what you want, go for it. I like the bar end shifter for drop bars, though. Another option is the one on which you shift up with your thumb and down with your fingers. I kinda liked it but found it fragile.
#4230
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I used that 5 speed hub. I think it comes with a 175mm axle so you can space it to your frame before you build the wheel up... they're pretty flexible in that regard. I used the grip shifter the hub came with and it was fine but I also wanted drop bars so I bought that shifter and it's nice enough. I wouldn't stand up on the pedals of the 5 speed hubs they do have a soft key or something inside that does break apparently... I never had problems but someone on the IGH yahoo group mentioned it. If you buy the thumb shifter or bar-end either one will also work as a downtube shifter, so there is that too... they're also all metal unlike the trigger and grip shifters.
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I used that 5 speed hub. I think it comes with a 175mm axle so you can space it to your frame before you build the wheel up... they're pretty flexible in that regard. I used the grip shifter the hub came with and it was fine but I also wanted drop bars so I bought that shifter and it's nice enough. I wouldn't stand up on the pedals of the 5 speed hubs they do have a soft key or something inside that does break apparently... I never had problems but someone on the IGH yahoo group mentioned it. If you buy the thumb shifter or bar-end either one will also work as a downtube shifter, so there is that too... they're also all metal unlike the trigger and grip shifters.
Thoughts?
#4232
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The overall lockwasher dimension of the hub, and they vary according to which hub you select, is going to be a factor. You can make up some of the difference with spacers if need be. On the builds that I've done, I cold set the frame to minimize the use of spacers to the best of my ability.
My preference is for bar end shifters too, they are fast, accurate and out of the way. On older builds, I like to use the traditional trigger for 3 & 4 speeds. I think on an upright I would favor a thumb shifter over the twist.
My preference is for bar end shifters too, they are fast, accurate and out of the way. On older builds, I like to use the traditional trigger for 3 & 4 speeds. I think on an upright I would favor a thumb shifter over the twist.
#4233
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GOT THAT $27,000 READY?
Has anybody seen this on ebay- only 13 hours left now!
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Rare-1939-Ra...ht_3846wt_1255
If you miss it, it may not sell and be relisted again......
Should have that Huffy Sportsman together in a day or two now- should look pretty good - for a heavy frame and one piece crank-
I was gonna put some light stuff on it- but now a couple of other projects have taken a few parts away already-
I'll put up some pics - "before" and "after" when I'm done-
I KNOW YOU CAN'T WAIT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I like that Lambert above and remember when they became Viscount- or was it the other way around? "73 or '74 I think it was.
I wouldn't mind doing something similar- but I think time may be passing me by here- too much stuff already-
Do you there would be any market for 700C 3 speed wheels?
Has anybody seen this on ebay- only 13 hours left now!
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Rare-1939-Ra...ht_3846wt_1255
If you miss it, it may not sell and be relisted again......
Should have that Huffy Sportsman together in a day or two now- should look pretty good - for a heavy frame and one piece crank-
I was gonna put some light stuff on it- but now a couple of other projects have taken a few parts away already-
I'll put up some pics - "before" and "after" when I'm done-
I KNOW YOU CAN'T WAIT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I like that Lambert above and remember when they became Viscount- or was it the other way around? "73 or '74 I think it was.
I wouldn't mind doing something similar- but I think time may be passing me by here- too much stuff already-
Do you there would be any market for 700C 3 speed wheels?
Last edited by harpon; 03-28-13 at 10:53 PM.
#4235
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Oh Dear- Someone said "MATRESS" to Mr. Lambert!
Now I've got to get into the FISHTANK and SING!
"And did those feet, in ancient times,
walk up on England's mountains green....."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGEeLtqtNvU
Now I've got to get into the FISHTANK and SING!
"And did those feet, in ancient times,
walk up on England's mountains green....."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGEeLtqtNvU
#4236
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The overall lockwasher dimension of the hub, and they vary according to which hub you select, is going to be a factor. You can make up some of the difference with spacers if need be. On the builds that I've done, I cold set the frame to minimize the use of spacers to the best of my ability.
My preference is for bar end shifters too, they are fast, accurate and out of the way. On older builds, I like to use the traditional trigger for 3 & 4 speeds. I think on an upright I would favor a thumb shifter over the twist.
My preference is for bar end shifters too, they are fast, accurate and out of the way. On older builds, I like to use the traditional trigger for 3 & 4 speeds. I think on an upright I would favor a thumb shifter over the twist.
I cursorily read thru Sheldon's page on this procedure: https://sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html and he refers to cold setting as "widening" the frame but I assume it could also mean the opposite and that you mean narrowing it slightly for this purpose; correct?
As best I can tell, w/o removing the rear wheel, the space I have on the Bridgestone is 125-130 mm. At the page linked above, Sheldon says a standard width on a 6 or 7 speed [cassette] roadbike is 126 mm so I'm assuming that is what I've got, with the 6 speed cassette on the bike. So my follow-up question would be: Are there functional reasons for minimizing spacers and do the "trim kits" included with some of these hubs include wide but precise spacers; IOW something larger in width than standard washers?
Would you mind - text, pics, or another thread - showing me how you proceed in "cold setting" the frames on your builds?
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I've been trying to link to a pretty cool Craigslist ad but this computer refuses to comply. If anyone wants to facilitate, there's a guy in Brooklyn, NY who periodically puts a few NOS Raleigh 3-speeds on Craigs. I don't know where he finds them, but this time it's a pair of his/hers 1959 Sports and they certainly are sweet. Plus he's got a link to a photo page with lots of good pics. A few years ago I seriously considered one of his finds at $600 (for a NOS Sports I think- maybe a Ltd), but the prices are now gasp-inducing. Anyway, the pictures are really beautiful of these two showroom-condition bikes. Sorry I'm having such a hard time trying to link to them.
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https://s47.photobucket.com/user/supe...45286051349529
OK. Maybe that worked. It's a photobucket page.
https://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/bik/3663631484.html
And there's the ad.
(I'm still such a dunce with computers)
OK. Maybe that worked. It's a photobucket page.
https://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/bik/3663631484.html
And there's the ad.
(I'm still such a dunce with computers)
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Yes, I believe it is.
I like this one:
https://wheelbuilder.jmoore.me/
Ebay seller "childhood_dreams". Or send me a private message and I'll give you the guy's email address.
No, if that's what you want, go for it. I like the bar end shifter for drop bars, though. Another option is the one on which you shift up with your thumb and down with your fingers. I kinda liked it but found it fragile.
I like this one:
https://wheelbuilder.jmoore.me/
Ebay seller "childhood_dreams". Or send me a private message and I'll give you the guy's email address.
No, if that's what you want, go for it. I like the bar end shifter for drop bars, though. Another option is the one on which you shift up with your thumb and down with your fingers. I kinda liked it but found it fragile.
I'm still on the fence about shifters. One thing that sorta rankles me is that I have 6-8 S-A thumb shifters around that have had the facing plate [with the text on it] defaced or removed and I'd really like to just buy the correct S-A cable and use them. I've even considered taking them all to a Trophy and Awards shop and having them engrave the 1-2-3 on them and then "colorizing" the numerals. I hafta admit that I like a thumb shifter - once you are used to them and have them in proper adjustment it literally is just a flick or quick pull of the index finger and voila!
#4242
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Re: Frame spacing or "Cold Setting"...
I cursorily read thru Sheldon's page on this procedure: https://sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html and he refers to cold setting as "widening" the frame but I assume it could also mean the opposite and that you mean narrowing it slightly for this purpose; correct?
As best I can tell, w/o removing the rear wheel, the space I have on the Bridgestone is 125-130 mm. At the page linked above, Sheldon says a standard width on a 6 or 7 speed [cassette] roadbike is 126 mm so I'm assuming that is what I've got, with the 6 speed cassette on the bike. So my follow-up question would be: Are there functional reasons for minimizing spacers and do the "trim kits" included with some of these hubs include wide but precise spacers; IOW something larger in width than standard washers?
Would you mind - text, pics, or another thread - showing me how you proceed in "cold setting" the frames on your builds?
I cursorily read thru Sheldon's page on this procedure: https://sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html and he refers to cold setting as "widening" the frame but I assume it could also mean the opposite and that you mean narrowing it slightly for this purpose; correct?
As best I can tell, w/o removing the rear wheel, the space I have on the Bridgestone is 125-130 mm. At the page linked above, Sheldon says a standard width on a 6 or 7 speed [cassette] roadbike is 126 mm so I'm assuming that is what I've got, with the 6 speed cassette on the bike. So my follow-up question would be: Are there functional reasons for minimizing spacers and do the "trim kits" included with some of these hubs include wide but precise spacers; IOW something larger in width than standard washers?
Would you mind - text, pics, or another thread - showing me how you proceed in "cold setting" the frames on your builds?
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Sorry for the confusion.. I have never found a Sturmey Archer Twistgrip (circa mid 1960's) that has worked for more than a month. On the other hand, trigger shifters seem to never fail. So I lightly challenged Salubrious's post with fify, or "fixed it for you".
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For parts, I've been buying up as many basket case 3-speeds as I can reasonably obtain in my area, and have accumulated a couple of the SA twist grip shifters and maybe three or four Shimanos. From what you're telling me here, the SA's don't hold up to regular usage; IYO are the Shimanos any better in that respect?
Last edited by PalmettoUpstate; 03-30-13 at 08:37 PM. Reason: spelling
#4245
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Using spacers is fine, just saying that before you get into things, know what your D.O.'s are currently spaced at and then look at the Hubs over all locknut demension...it's sounding like your assuming problems that may not exist. An yes, cold setting can go both ways, but generally it's for widening a frame.
Just kidding, I really do appreciate the clarification from you guys that have "been there; done that" LOL...
Taking the specs here: https://www.sturmey-archer.com/produc.../id/33/specs/1 and assuming "over locknut dimension" [130mm] means "OLD"... [I assume I'm correct so far...?] and the space between my dropouts on this bike in question is 126mm... then I guess I will need to spread the frame 4mm in order to fit this particular hub to the bike. To get that 4mm can I just do it mechanically or will I need heat or something? [And, if so, there's the problem of being sure that its "square"...]
But then, it seems to me that 4mm isn't so much that it couldn't just be pulled manually.
#4246
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Yeah I'd picked up on that; mine was meant tongue-in-cheek...
For parts, I've been buying up as many basket case 3-speeds as I can reasonably obtain in my area, and have accumulated a couple of the SA twist grip shifters and maybe three or four Shimanos. From what you're telling me here, the SA's don't hold up to regular usage; IYO are the Shimanos any better in that respect?
For parts, I've been buying up as many basket case 3-speeds as I can reasonably obtain in my area, and have accumulated a couple of the SA twist grip shifters and maybe three or four Shimanos. From what you're telling me here, the SA's don't hold up to regular usage; IYO are the Shimanos any better in that respect?
#4247
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I used that 5 speed hub. I think it comes with a 175mm axle so you can space it to your frame before you build the wheel up... they're pretty flexible in that regard. I used the grip shifter the hub came with and it was fine but I also wanted drop bars so I bought that shifter and it's nice enough. I wouldn't stand up on the pedals of the 5 speed hubs they do have a soft key or something inside that does break apparently... I never had problems but someone on the IGH yahoo group mentioned it. If you buy the thumb shifter or bar-end either one will also work as a downtube shifter, so there is that too... they're also all metal unlike the trigger and grip shifters.
#4250
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little known info, FWIW - Camagnolo also produced a 3spd IGH for 1/2 a year in '72. Nice polished alloy shell 36H and close range gears too. I luv, luv, it!
Edit : 32H to 36H my bad..too early to count holes before coffee
Edit : 32H to 36H my bad..too early to count holes before coffee
Last edited by Velognome; 04-01-13 at 07:49 AM.