Thanks Tom, I have bikes everywhere around here some are for parts some are riders, some are mine some are for sale and some are just there LOL. Tom you are not a hoarder you are a collector, yeah that's it a Collector.

Glenn

I have one of those Dana BB mounted three speed units that I want to try out one of these days.

Glenn

Glenn, your bench is hilarious! There's a banana seat and a bunch of old Shimano parts in original packaging.

You're definitely a better hoarder, uh, collector than I am. But you have an excuse. Didn't you once have a bike shop?

No but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night. One of my long time lawn mower repair customers owned one for 20+ years before closing it down in the 80's and once he found out that I was into bicycles gave me what was left of his inventory which had been sitting in metal storage sheds ever since.

Glenn

Seen three of these in my time...

Wow. I had no idea that there was such a long history with crank transmissions - the more things change, the more they stay the same. That BB gearing plus rear IGH hub bit mentioned on the Schlumpf site is wild.

Right, but why haven't the crank transmissions caught on? There must be a reason. Cost? Weight? Incompatibility with the regular frames?

I think the answer is "d", all of the above.

Bikes like the one the OP put together, and others that have been shown in this thread, are awesome. But I don't think we'll see IGH fully accepted outside of the urban-utility-commuter-vintage context (and that covers an awful lot cyclists, maybe most, now that I think about it), or crank transmissions viewed a anything other than novelties, until and unless they're proven to be competitive as racing equipment. That means roadies and mtbrs. I understand that the Alfine 8 and 11 have established a steady niche in mountain biking. Someone would have to build a competitive "technology demonstrator" road bike - and win some races with it.

Ya know, something with carbon fiber everything - including the housing and internals of the IGH and/or crank transmission...

Carbon fiber power transmission gears? Not on your life!

Carbon fiber hub shell - yes

Toothed gears - no

rudypyatt has it correct.

The Adler system from the 1930s-1940s was completely overengineered - I think it would handle a 500cc engine without problems and probably needs it to haul all that weight around.

Still is a nice ride though - something satisfying about that truck-like <thunk> when you move the long lever forward and the axle shifts into place.

For all an IGH's substantive advantages, and there are many, it will always weigh more than a derailleur system, and I expect it will cost more. The differences are small, but they are a barrier to both sellers and buyers.

Don't forget about internal resistance and efficiency loss!

Right, that's another reason we won't see it on race bikes. But maybe someone should write a story about how these hubs are good for hauling or long distance touring. Someone here mentioned taking his Shimano 8-speed hub across continents over very tough terrain. No troubles whatsoever. Makes a whole lot of sense. Try that with a traditional derailleur setup.

I don't race, but I'm curious; how many gears are typically used in a criterium? Doesn't a 27-speed cassette derailleur set-up approach overkill over such short distances? Seems to me if there's any road race that one could build a competitive igh bike for, it would be a crit.

True, you could get away with fewer gears, but the weight and friction would be a deal killer. Weight is critical.

[QUOTE][
Velobrox/QUOTE]

total resistance as compared to a derailleur set up? I'm thinking an IHG is less; efficentcy loss with a straight chianline I thinking....no. If you want something more efficient with less resistance you'd have to go single speed. Weight is the primary problem I believe?

For a Crit? Weren't the AM, ASC, FC and FM Alloy hubs built primarily for Time Trials and Club racing?

Still it's obvious STI's and derailleurs must have an advantage, mabe its the ability to shift quickly?

The efficiency loss is not in the chainline, but in the internals of the hub. Read this for reference: https://hubstripping.wordpress.com/ge...vs-derailleur/

For the record, I much prefer IGHs for just about everything, but that's because I mostly commute in the city and value reliability over everything else!

For a Crit? Weren't the AM, ASC, FC and FM Alloy hubs built primarily for Time Trials and Club racing?

Didn't know that. Thanks for the info.

VeloBrox, I've been reading the hubstripping site for months now; that's definitely increased my interest in IGH stuff. Combination IGH + cassette drive trains are also interesting.