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stem advice for a Shogun

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stem advice for a Shogun

Old 09-09-10, 05:06 PM
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snarkypup
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stem advice for a Shogun

So none of the lbs near me carry the stem I'm interested in trying out for my '82 Shogun, and frankly, since the bike is essentially non-operational right now (the tires are dead, the gears need adjusting, etc.), I can't really "try a new stem out" the way it would deserve. My coworker who is helping me rehab the bike suggested, since we are tearing it down and cleaning it and doing everything to it in one-two sessions, that I should probably decide on a stem before we did that. In the end, I love the look of the stem that should have been on this bike to begin with. I think I'll start there. Since the frame fits me so nicely, it makes sense that to some degree, the original stem probably would have been fine.

The problem is that I don't know what size the original stem would have been, and I have zero experience with these things to begin with. This is the first road bike I've owned since I was 17! So if any of you lovely Shogun owners out there can tell me roughly what size the stem was on your 80's bike, I'd be so grateful.

I'm thinking of a Nitto Technomic Delux. It looks right, and isn't so expensive I can't stand it, but it comes in everything from 70mm up to 120mm. I think 70 or 80? I don't know. Help!

Here's the current horrid giant stem from hell:

shogun8 by snarkypup, on Flickr


Here's the whole bike:

shogun4 by snarkypup, on Flickr

Thanks for any advice you can give me. I do have a shorter reach, being a girl. The bike is a 54cm frame (I'm not sure on the top tube length), so it's about as big as a frame can be for me and still be comfy. The current stem is enormous and was added to lengthen the frame. However, it's not so long that I can't ride the bike, so I don't think I'm talking about a 50mm stem or anything. Also, I want to retain control of the bike. I'm NOT an aggressive rider. 70mm? 80mm? 90mm?
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Old 09-09-10, 05:12 PM
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Google stem length. You will find a lot of advice on the topic, how to measure to fit you. Really doesn't matter what length came with the bike, it may well have not been a good fit for you. Work with a good bike shop, they may well have a trade program where you can try out a couple of sizes without spending extra money on the swap.

Its not really about the Shogun, its about what fits you.

Here's just one opinion.

https://www.peterwhitecycles.com/fitting.htm

Last edited by wrk101; 09-09-10 at 05:21 PM.
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Old 09-09-10, 05:17 PM
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+ what he said. I have a couple of appropriate stems in the 100-110mm range....
Just about any quill will do, even that abomination on there now.

Last edited by RobbieTunes; 09-09-10 at 05:24 PM.
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Old 09-09-10, 05:57 PM
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Awesome bike you have there

I have a 81 Shogun and it has an 80mm stem.
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Old 09-09-10, 05:59 PM
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great looking bike, is that a triple? aren't the technomic stems the real tall ones?

something like this would have been OEM on that bike about 100ext like Robbie said
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Old 09-09-10, 06:06 PM
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I might have an 80mm "in stock", I know I have a 60mm if you need that short. Unless you need to get the bars as high as they are with that MTB stem the Technomic is a waste. It's specifically a very tall stem. Also, if you have a very small frame and don't need the height of the Technomic you can get the expander bolt too low and mess up the welds at the fork crown when you tighten the stem up. Just FYI.
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Old 09-09-10, 09:10 PM
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Thanks for the advice everyone. I was looking at the Technomic Deluxe, which is NOT the extra tall one. It's the normal one. I just liked the traditional angle and the shiney-ness of it. And the price is right at around $50. Capecodder, your Shogun is gorgeous. I really like the colors on it, and the info is exactly what I wanted. I knew the stems were on the shorter side, looking at the photos of bikes still with stock stems, and I think that will suit me best for now anyway.

Khatfull, if you have an 80mm stem in stock that is similar to what I'm looking for, I'd be very interested. You can PM me, if that's the case. I just want shiney chrome-look (I know they aren't chrome), reverse angle (that's the right term for the stem that goes slightly down after the bend, right?) and shorter than what's on there now, which is a 120 and NOT a reverse angle. Also, it truly is an abomination .

Bianchiigirl, I think it is indeed a triple. I think I got quite a deal on this bike, actually, without knowing what I was doing. I love it when that happens!

Wrk101, I really don't know what is comfortable yet, so reading about size doesn't mean much at this point. I need more experience. I'll have to ride for a while, probably many months, adjusting the things that are easily adjusted, and then see where I am. I haven't ridden a road bike since high school. My previous bike was a modern, "comfort" bike (and surprisingly uncomfortable). I bought the Sports to get a better fit, which I got, as well as a delightful ride, which it has, and because I love old machines. Once I got it home, I realized that I wanted to ride much more, and to try to commute, which is nearly 13 miles each way. I know I'll have to build up to that slowly, and I really can't do that on a '69 Raleigh Sports! So I'm going to try this road bike, and see how it goes. I may not end up riding a road bike at all, if I can't get comfortable. I have a genetic disorder that causes my spine and other joints to dislocate constantly, which in turn pinches the nerves that run between the bones, which then causes (in addition to back pain, obviously) severe numbness issues in my hands and feet. So the bike is really a crap-shoot for me. It might work, or I'll have to give up, or try something else. But mostly, I'm going to have to ride, ride, ride, and see how I feel as I go. I'm very, very stubborn, and I'm determined to have fun and do these rides. Maybe the Shogun won't be my final bike, but for now, I'll just have to guess at what will work. So I'll start with the "stock" stem, which looks about right compared to my current stem, and then change it later if I feel like that will make a difference. For now I'm going to adjust saddle height and pitch, put on really cushy tape, and adjust the brake levers if I need to.

Long explaination. Hope it makes sense!
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Old 09-09-10, 09:17 PM
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Out of my last dozen keeper bikes, only one has the original stem. Stems are like saddles, it is really common to customize those parts on a bike. I have long arms/torso and short legs. So I tend to use a long stem.
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Old 09-09-10, 09:26 PM
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Originally Posted by wrk101
Out of my last dozen keeper bikes, only one has the original stem. Stems are like saddles, it is really common to customize those parts on a bike. I have long arms/torso and short legs. So I tend to use a long stem.
I will soon have a totally hideous black one, if you're interested...
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Old 09-09-10, 09:28 PM
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Snarkypup, I just want to say that you are now officially a member of the club. Some people actually mount those hideous welded stems on their classic bikes -- on purpose!

Like Khatfull, I have a cache of decent forged aluminum stems that I save just to reward people who swap out a welded stem. If you can't find something that works, just post the size you think you need, and I'll see what I have.

Actually, many people here can probably do that, though I'm sure it's easier to buy locally.
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Old 09-09-10, 09:34 PM
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Originally Posted by khatfull
I might have an 80mm "in stock", I know I have a 60mm if you need that short. Unless you need to get the bars as high as they are with that MTB stem the Technomic is a waste. It's specifically a very tall stem. Also, if you have a very small frame and don't need the height of the Technomic you can get the expander bolt too low and mess up the welds at the fork crown when you tighten the stem up. Just FYI.
unless you had two, i think the 80 is gone

(no those are not chromed steel handlebars )
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Old 09-09-10, 10:05 PM
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Congrats on the new bike! I saw a prior thread where you were weighing your options. I think you made a shrewd choice. and I hope it serves you well. As for the stem, to reiterate what others have said, stem size is determined by your body proportions. Nitto Technomic stems would be a nice option for a quality Japanese models, and can found for reasonable prices (several in the mid-$30 and lower range on the 'bay).

Btw, I was in Seattle recently on vacation & walked into a nice LBS in the Belltown district of Seattle called Belltown Pull-apart: https://belltownpullapart.com/. THey had some nice bins of used vintage parts for sale. It might be worth checking out if you haven't already.

I hope you find cycling is not too painful on your joints. If you do have discomfort, you might consider even more padding on the handlebar tape. There is a famous one-day "classic" race called the Paris-Roubaixwhich includes sections of bone-jarring cobblestones. Riders frequently double-wrapped their bars with cork handlebar tape. There is also this new (albeit pricey) cork tape with gel coming out from Cinelli, available later this month.
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Old 09-09-10, 10:36 PM
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Here's my old shogun, it was a 56cm I believe, and the stem was 90mm... I still have the stem, but the bike is gone. It's a nitto.


edit: it might have been a 54cm, I can't remember but it was a little small for me. Yeah, I just found the stem in my junk box... let me know if you want it.

Last edited by duckforcover; 09-09-10 at 10:38 PM. Reason: update
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Old 09-09-10, 10:58 PM
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Ooo, I haven't seen Belltown Pull-Apart before. Thanks for the tip -- I'll have to go check it out. I actually live outside Seattle. Since our public transportation sucks, and the traffic here is brutal, I rarely go into the big city . It's also a nightmare to park there. But that spot might be worth the trip. My lbs is small and scrappy and deal mostly in those tiny bmx-y bikes (very technical terms here) that my six year-old insists are really made for him, not grown men. But they are very nice, and just a two-mile ride from my current abode, so I try to visit them when I can. My coworker who is going to help me restore the Shogun also works part time at the Bellevue (Eastside) Gregg's, which is a huge local bike store chain. He says they don't have the stems I'm looking at in stock, either. That's the thing: lots of places can order stuff for me, but they don't have it in stock to actually try out. And even if they did, I'm not sure I'd yet recognize the right size. I think that takes time and experience. I see these bikes as an investment, so I don't mind switching out something later, if I decide I need to. I already hate the grips I put on the Sports, so those will be coming off as soon as my coworker can soak them in something horribly caustic (they're glued-on, shellacked, beautiful-but-rock-hard Portuguese cork. Teach me to go with form over function!). If I hate this stem, I'll eventually switch it. No biggie. Gotta start somewhere, so stock size will be a good starting point.

Since I have to order this stem anyway, any leads on a 70 or 80mm stem in anyone's stash that will resemble the original one would be appreciated. I'd much rather pay one of you guys than some company somewhere. Otherwise, I'll order the Technomic and see how it goes. In six months, if it isn't working for me, I'll get a different one, and pass on the love to some deserving person who needs my old stem.

Then I just have to decide on tape (beautiful Cinelli gel tape, by the way, but I think I want brown. Why, Cinelli, why?), cable housing color, new levers or no, fenders, saddlebag... you guys know the drill. I'm thinking brown wrap to go with the Brooks I'm getting from a friend in the ubiquitous honey color, and grey or white cable. I like the vintage Dia Compes I've seen around for levers, though I'm still working on that idea. My best friend suggested wooden fenders, but though they are gorgeously awesome, I don't think they fit either my bike and its purpose, or my budget. Love me some stainless fenders, though. I hear the VO ones are nice. And then there's tires (gumwall? I think yes), new pads, chain... at some point I have to start riding the darn thing! I can't just restore it forever, tempting as that is .
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Old 09-11-10, 12:29 PM
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Any thoughts on the Nitto Technomic Deluxe going into a 54cm frame? I hear this can be an issue, but I don't understand bikes well enough to figure out whether or not this would be an issue for my bike. Since I need to order the stem before we start restoring the bike, I need to know ahead of time if this stem won't work on a bike this size. Would an 80mm Pearl be a better choice for such a small bike? I found one for about $20 more than the Deluxe.

Thoughts?
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Old 09-11-10, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by duckforcover
Here's my old shogun, it was a 56cm I believe, and the stem was 90mm... I still have the stem, but the bike is gone. It's a nitto.


edit: it might have been a 54cm, I can't remember but it was a little small for me. Yeah, I just found the stem in my junk box... let me know if you want it.
How'd I miss this? I just sent you a PM. I am definitely interested.
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Old 09-11-10, 02:06 PM
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I couldn't reply to your PM, I don't have 50 posts yet.

One thing to remember with these type of stems, the higher you adjust it will also bring it closer to you.
The lower you set it, the more far forward it will end up.

I hope that makes sense, I think it will be ok from looking at the pic of your bike.

Anyways, you can try it and if it works out for you just send me back whatever the postage was.

I am a little north of Boston.

Last edited by duckforcover; 09-11-10 at 02:10 PM. Reason: edit
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Old 09-11-10, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by duckforcover
I couldn't reply to your PM, I don't have 50 posts yet.

One thing to remember with these type of stems, the higher you adjust it will also bring it closer to you.
The lower you set it, the more far forward it will end up.

I hope that makes sense, I think it will be ok from looking at the pic of your bike.

Anyways, you can try it and if it works out for you just send me back whatever the postage was.

I am a little north of Boston.
Great! I got your message to my account, and I sent you a response. I'm always happy to reimburse folks for things. I like to keep good relationships!
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Old 09-11-10, 05:30 PM
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Got your email, done deal.
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Old 09-11-10, 10:53 PM
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Originally Posted by duckforcover
Got your email, done deal.
Hurrah!
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Old 09-12-10, 01:55 AM
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sr/sakae stems come in many different lengths in very nice prices on our favorite auction site!
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Old 09-12-10, 10:47 PM
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Snarkypup,

If the 90mm stem ends up being too long for you, I just took a 80mm SR custom stem off of my husband's Univega. It was replaced with a Technomic deluxe (120mm). I am not far from you and can arrange to let you "try" it out if you like.
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Old 09-13-10, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by alr
Snarkypup,

If the 90mm stem ends up being too long for you, I just took a 80mm SR custom stem off of my husband's Univega. It was replaced with a Technomic deluxe (120mm). I am not far from you and can arrange to let you "try" it out if you like.
Thanks! I'll keep you folks updated. I am doing the restore in early October, as we're moving houses in two weeks and I can't spare weekends until we're in the new house and settled. I have everything ordered to do up the bike, and will be back then to let you know how it went! I'm sure I'll be too proud to resist, anyway.
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Old 09-13-10, 10:36 AM
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The original stems are SR,along with the seat post,crank and pedals.

Shogun,at that time,would install anything that was available,if you ordered a bike from them.If it was purchaced off the showroom floor,you got what was standard,which was SR stuff.

In fact,you could order custom built frames from them.The dealers would take your measurements,send them to the factory,and the frame would be made for you!I know,I own one.

You can run into Shoguns with all kinds of different stuff on them,even Campy.

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Old 09-13-10, 10:34 PM
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Snarkypup,

I was just in the belltown pull apart, and second what gaucho777 mentioned-- they have oodles of nice vintage parts including several SR stems. I was in there getting a clamp on cable stop that I could not find anywhere else in town. I also noticed that they has some lovely suntour bar end shifters just like some I purchased on ebay, for a much better price than what I paid.
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