Looking for ideas and opinions on the "Ross Signature" Custom or team frame
10-07-13 | 10:51 AM
#1
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From: omicron persei 8
Looking for ideas and opinions on the "Ross Signature" Custom or team frame
I picked this up to build a bike thats more spirited than my 650 Trek. The person I got it from bought it in a lot so he had no info on it.
On the NDS chain stay there is the name or Gaily
Rifled steer tube
On the NDS chain stay there is the name or Gaily
Rifled steer tube
10-07-13 | 11:07 AM
#2
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From: Niagara Region, Canada
Bikes: 1970s Alex Singer, 1960s Peugeot PX 10, 1960s Bertin C37, 1973 Carre Bertin C 37, 1972 Carlton Kermesse, 1981 Peugeot PX 14 Super Competition
that_guy_zack-
If it's really a Ross Signature (check the seatstay caps for ROSS embossing) it's a nice bike. Tom Kellogg was the original designer and there is a link to Forum info on Ross bicycles. There are photos here and here of various Ross bicycles as well. However, the rifled Columbus style steerer and the style of fork crown lead me to believe you have a re-sprayed Italian frameset. You may want to check for Italian threading. As well, the frame shifter bosses look odd.
If it's really a Ross Signature (check the seatstay caps for ROSS embossing) it's a nice bike. Tom Kellogg was the original designer and there is a link to Forum info on Ross bicycles. There are photos here and here of various Ross bicycles as well. However, the rifled Columbus style steerer and the style of fork crown lead me to believe you have a re-sprayed Italian frameset. You may want to check for Italian threading. As well, the frame shifter bosses look odd.
10-07-13 | 12:15 PM
#4
Interesting! and cool...IIRC Tom Kellogg was the main builder but not the only guy who made the top models...can't recall whom the other torch-bearers were. It does look like the rifling in the steerer is the Columbus style (curving) rather than Ishiwata or Tange (straight), but can you verify: 5 ribs or 6? Is that BB shell an Hitachi or a Roto (can't enlarge the pic on my computer to see)?
10-07-13 | 12:38 PM
#5
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From: Absecon, NJ
Bikes: Puch Luzern, Puch Mistral SLE, Bianchi Pista, Motobecane Grand Touring, Austro-Daimler Ultima, Legnano, Raleigh MountainTour, Cannondale SM600
10-07-13 | 12:59 PM
#7
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From: omicron persei 8
I know of the normal signature models well, have had a few. Im just interested in this one and trying to figure out what it really is.
Just seems like a lot of trouble for someone to paint and decal a nice frame like this as a Ross, as well as the fact that there is a riders name on the chainstay.
Counted 5 ribs in the steer tube, Curving. And Shimano drops front and rear. And yes, 27.2 post. The BB shell does not seem to be a roto, cant find the Hitachi.
Just seems like a lot of trouble for someone to paint and decal a nice frame like this as a Ross, as well as the fact that there is a riders name on the chainstay.
Counted 5 ribs in the steer tube, Curving. And Shimano drops front and rear. And yes, 27.2 post. The BB shell does not seem to be a roto, cant find the Hitachi.
Last edited by that_guy_zach; 10-07-13 at 01:10 PM.
10-07-13 | 08:03 PM
#8
I know of the normal signature models well, have had a few. Im just interested in this one and trying to figure out what it really is.
Just seems like a lot of trouble for someone to paint and decal a nice frame like this as a Ross, as well as the fact that there is a riders name on the chainstay.
Counted 5 ribs in the steer tube, Curving. And Shimano drops front and rear. And yes, 27.2 post. The BB shell does not seem to be a roto, cant find the Hitachi.
Just seems like a lot of trouble for someone to paint and decal a nice frame like this as a Ross, as well as the fact that there is a riders name on the chainstay.
Counted 5 ribs in the steer tube, Curving. And Shimano drops front and rear. And yes, 27.2 post. The BB shell does not seem to be a roto, cant find the Hitachi.
The hitachi BB shell will have this logo (logo only, not the name) cast in.
10-08-13 | 11:56 AM
#10
seems like it could be a Signature "Triad" which did come with that BB shell, forkcrown and Columbus tubing (SL?). Yours might have ben customized for "Gaily" whoever that was, with the pump peg and possibly re-sprayed, too.
10-08-13 | 01:54 PM
#11
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From: omicron persei 8
Thats the one. I was not aware of that model. Thank you for the help.
10-09-13 | 07:52 AM
#13
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From: omicron persei 8
Found some good info here-
https://thezenofcycling.blogspot.com/...ragged-in.html
Tom wrote: "The frame design was mine, the same exact design I developed for the first Ross Signature racing frames. Unlike the rest of the Ross bicycles made over the years, the Signature frames were real hand built frames, as good as any made at the time. I was very proud of what we did there. The guy who built that 508 was good enough that I hired him away from Ross and he is still working for me to this day, twenty six years later. You've got a little piece of history."
The only caveat to add is that Tom had left Ross in 1983 and Jim Redkay was running the shop by then. In all likelyhood, Jeff Duser _did_ make the frame, but the 508 Triads were built by a team consisting of Jeff, Juan Rodriguez, and Dave Rodriguez (hence the 'triad'). So truth be told, I don't know for sure if Jeff actually built my frame. I asked Tom for more detail, but I haven't heard back. He's probably tired of me annoying him (like you don't know that's possible).
https://thezenofcycling.blogspot.com/...ragged-in.html
Tom wrote: "The frame design was mine, the same exact design I developed for the first Ross Signature racing frames. Unlike the rest of the Ross bicycles made over the years, the Signature frames were real hand built frames, as good as any made at the time. I was very proud of what we did there. The guy who built that 508 was good enough that I hired him away from Ross and he is still working for me to this day, twenty six years later. You've got a little piece of history."
The only caveat to add is that Tom had left Ross in 1983 and Jim Redkay was running the shop by then. In all likelyhood, Jeff Duser _did_ make the frame, but the 508 Triads were built by a team consisting of Jeff, Juan Rodriguez, and Dave Rodriguez (hence the 'triad'). So truth be told, I don't know for sure if Jeff actually built my frame. I asked Tom for more detail, but I haven't heard back. He's probably tired of me annoying him (like you don't know that's possible).
07-23-19 | 04:15 PM
#14
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From: Southern California
Bikes: Storck Scenero, Ross Signature Triad
I am the original owner of a Ross Signature Triad which I still have, the 63 cm pink frame purchased directly from the Ross showroom in Commerce, CA in 1985. The stamped numbers on the bottom are 508 6316 84 107. I had it built up at a bike shop in Pasadena with Shimano Dura Ace bottom bracket, chain rings, and cranks; the remaining components are Shimano 105 I believe. I competed as an age group triathlete (international distance) for several years.
Since 1990 it has been used off and on for fitness riding. First generation Time clipless pedals were installed in the early 90s which have since been replaced by Speedplays. As my age got higher and my speed got slower, I could no longer do justice to the flashy hot pink paint and had the bike refurbished and painted burgundy in the mid-90s by Cycle Art in San Diego county; at that time a cracked bottom bracket was replaced.
At age 60, the 53/42 chain rings coupled with a 6 speed 13-24 became impractical for my knees, and I bought a carbon fiber Storck with more appropriate old man gearing. I am torn between keeping the beautiful Ross for flat rides or selling it to someone who would appreciate it for the classic it is. I am taking it to have it refurbished by Joe Bell in San Diego whose work is very respected.
Is there a market for it?
Since 1990 it has been used off and on for fitness riding. First generation Time clipless pedals were installed in the early 90s which have since been replaced by Speedplays. As my age got higher and my speed got slower, I could no longer do justice to the flashy hot pink paint and had the bike refurbished and painted burgundy in the mid-90s by Cycle Art in San Diego county; at that time a cracked bottom bracket was replaced.
At age 60, the 53/42 chain rings coupled with a 6 speed 13-24 became impractical for my knees, and I bought a carbon fiber Storck with more appropriate old man gearing. I am torn between keeping the beautiful Ross for flat rides or selling it to someone who would appreciate it for the classic it is. I am taking it to have it refurbished by Joe Bell in San Diego whose work is very respected.
Is there a market for it?
07-23-19 | 08:47 PM
#15
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I am the original owner of a Ross Signature Triad which I still have, the 63 cm pink frame purchased directly from the Ross showroom in Commerce, CA in 1985. The stamped numbers on the bottom are 508 6316 84 107. I had it built up at a bike shop in Pasadena with Shimano Dura Ace bottom bracket, chain rings, and cranks; the remaining components are Shimano 105 I believe. I competed as an age group triathlete (international distance) for several years.
Since 1990 it has been used off and on for fitness riding. First generation Time clipless pedals were installed in the early 90s which have since been replaced by Speedplays. As my age got higher and my speed got slower, I could no longer do justice to the flashy hot pink paint and had the bike refurbished and painted burgundy in the mid-90s by Cycle Art in San Diego county; at that time a cracked bottom bracket was replaced.
At age 60, the 53/42 chain rings coupled with a 6 speed 13-24 became impractical for my knees, and I bought a carbon fiber Storck with more appropriate old man gearing. I am torn between keeping the beautiful Ross for flat rides or selling it to someone who would appreciate it for the classic it is. I am taking it to have it refurbished by Joe Bell in San Diego whose work is very respected.
Is there a market for it?
Since 1990 it has been used off and on for fitness riding. First generation Time clipless pedals were installed in the early 90s which have since been replaced by Speedplays. As my age got higher and my speed got slower, I could no longer do justice to the flashy hot pink paint and had the bike refurbished and painted burgundy in the mid-90s by Cycle Art in San Diego county; at that time a cracked bottom bracket was replaced.
At age 60, the 53/42 chain rings coupled with a 6 speed 13-24 became impractical for my knees, and I bought a carbon fiber Storck with more appropriate old man gearing. I am torn between keeping the beautiful Ross for flat rides or selling it to someone who would appreciate it for the classic it is. I am taking it to have it refurbished by Joe Bell in San Diego whose work is very respected.
Is there a market for it?
I have one of the Signature bikes and keep shouting about how nice it is, but I don’t think I’ve made enough headway for you to expect big dollars. Most people will still under appreciate a Ross, even one as nice as yours.
07-23-19 | 08:54 PM
#16
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From: Portlandia's Kuiper Belt, OR
Bikes: 1987 Woodrup Competition - 2025 Trek Checkpoint SL 6 Gen 3 - 1987 Lotus Legend - 2024 Trek Emonda ALR Rim Brake - 1980 Trek 510 - 1988 Cannondale SR500 - 1985 Trek 670 - 1982 Trek 730
I am the original owner of a Ross Signature Triad which I still have, the 63 cm pink frame purchased directly from the Ross showroom in Commerce, CA in 1985. The stamped numbers on the bottom are 508 6316 84 107. I had it built up at a bike shop in Pasadena with Shimano Dura Ace bottom bracket, chain rings, and cranks; the remaining components are Shimano 105 I believe. I competed as an age group triathlete (international distance) for several years.
Since 1990 it has been used off and on for fitness riding. First generation Time clipless pedals were installed in the early 90s which have since been replaced by Speedplays. As my age got higher and my speed got slower, I could no longer do justice to the flashy hot pink paint and had the bike refurbished and painted burgundy in the mid-90s by Cycle Art in San Diego county; at that time a cracked bottom bracket was replaced.
At age 60, the 53/42 chain rings coupled with a 6 speed 13-24 became impractical for my knees, and I bought a carbon fiber Storck with more appropriate old man gearing. I am torn between keeping the beautiful Ross for flat rides or selling it to someone who would appreciate it for the classic it is. I am taking it to have it refurbished by Joe Bell in San Diego whose work is very respected.
Is there a market for it?
Since 1990 it has been used off and on for fitness riding. First generation Time clipless pedals were installed in the early 90s which have since been replaced by Speedplays. As my age got higher and my speed got slower, I could no longer do justice to the flashy hot pink paint and had the bike refurbished and painted burgundy in the mid-90s by Cycle Art in San Diego county; at that time a cracked bottom bracket was replaced.
At age 60, the 53/42 chain rings coupled with a 6 speed 13-24 became impractical for my knees, and I bought a carbon fiber Storck with more appropriate old man gearing. I am torn between keeping the beautiful Ross for flat rides or selling it to someone who would appreciate it for the classic it is. I am taking it to have it refurbished by Joe Bell in San Diego whose work is very respected.
Is there a market for it?
As for a market for these, it will be very small as few are familiar with Ross, fewer are familiar with their top-level Signature models, and fewer still are aware of the Triad. Tom Kellogg and Jim Redcay, among a few others, were builders for Signatures in that part of the '80s. Other skilled builders did the later work (always hand made), though that can get a little murky.
It's crazy to hear that someone, anyone, has a Triad, let alone a Super Record-equipped Signature Road Criterium. And a 63cm! As such, you very much have my attention! Is your 63cm frame a center-to-top or center-to-center measurement? What is the top tube length? Were any frame angles listed or provided?
07-23-19 | 09:11 PM
#17
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I would say you have very much come to the correct place! I had a later 1985 Ross Signature 294S that was a beautiful, classy, and great-riding bike. No matter what components I put on it, it always enjoyed being on the road. Black with a silver head tube. It was my first real vintage bike that was my size and I fully overhauled it with its original Campagnolo Triomphe groupset.
As for a market for these, it will be very small as few are familiar with Ross, fewer are familiar with their top-level Signature models, and fewer still are aware of the Triad. Tom Kellogg and Jim Redcay, among a few others, were builders for Signatures in that part of the '80s. Other skilled builders did the later work (always hand made), though that can get a little murky.
It's crazy to hear that someone, anyone, has a Triad, let alone a Super Record-equipped Signature Road Criterium. And a 63cm! As such, you very much have my attention! Is your 63cm frame a center-to-top or center-to-center measurement? What is the top tube length? Were any frame angles listed or provided?
As for a market for these, it will be very small as few are familiar with Ross, fewer are familiar with their top-level Signature models, and fewer still are aware of the Triad. Tom Kellogg and Jim Redcay, among a few others, were builders for Signatures in that part of the '80s. Other skilled builders did the later work (always hand made), though that can get a little murky.
It's crazy to hear that someone, anyone, has a Triad, let alone a Super Record-equipped Signature Road Criterium. And a 63cm! As such, you very much have my attention! Is your 63cm frame a center-to-top or center-to-center measurement? What is the top tube length? Were any frame angles listed or provided?
07-24-19 | 12:40 AM
#18
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From: Southern California
Bikes: Storck Scenero, Ross Signature Triad
I would say you have very much come to the correct place! I had a later 1985 Ross Signature 294S that was a beautiful, classy, and great-riding bike. No matter what components I put on it, it always enjoyed being on the road. Black with a silver head tube. It was my first real vintage bike that was my size and I fully overhauled it with its original Campagnolo Triomphe groupset.
As for a market for these, it will be very small as few are familiar with Ross, fewer are familiar with their top-level Signature models, and fewer still are aware of the Triad. Tom Kellogg and Jim Redcay, among a few others, were builders for Signatures in that part of the '80s. Other skilled builders did the later work (always hand made), though that can get a little murky.
It's crazy to hear that someone, anyone, has a Triad, let alone a Super Record-equipped Signature Road Criterium. And a 63cm! As such, you very much have my attention! Is your 63cm frame a center-to-top or center-to-center measurement? What is the top tube length? Were any frame angles listed or provided?
As for a market for these, it will be very small as few are familiar with Ross, fewer are familiar with their top-level Signature models, and fewer still are aware of the Triad. Tom Kellogg and Jim Redcay, among a few others, were builders for Signatures in that part of the '80s. Other skilled builders did the later work (always hand made), though that can get a little murky.
It's crazy to hear that someone, anyone, has a Triad, let alone a Super Record-equipped Signature Road Criterium. And a 63cm! As such, you very much have my attention! Is your 63cm frame a center-to-top or center-to-center measurement? What is the top tube length? Were any frame angles listed or provided?
I have an appointment to take it in to Joe Bell tomorrow for a complete refurbish and to keep for myself unless someone is willing to "make me an offer I can't refuse" as is. One major imperfection on the underside of the top tube paint; maybe an energy drink leaked on to it. A few minor imperfections elsewhere.
07-24-19 | 11:22 AM
#19
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From: Portlandia's Kuiper Belt, OR
Bikes: 1987 Woodrup Competition - 2025 Trek Checkpoint SL 6 Gen 3 - 1987 Lotus Legend - 2024 Trek Emonda ALR Rim Brake - 1980 Trek 510 - 1988 Cannondale SR500 - 1985 Trek 670 - 1982 Trek 730
The seat tube is 63 cm center to top and the top tube is 60 cm. To be clear, it is equipped with a mix of Shimano Dura-Ace and Shimano 600 (thanks to another forum member for correcting me as I originally said some of the components were Shimano 105). I don't know the angles.
I have an appointment to take it in to Joe Bell tomorrow for a complete refurbish and to keep for myself unless someone is willing to "make me an offer I can't refuse" as is. One major imperfection on the underside of the top tube paint; maybe an energy drink leaked on to it. A few minor imperfections elsewhere.
I have an appointment to take it in to Joe Bell tomorrow for a complete refurbish and to keep for myself unless someone is willing to "make me an offer I can't refuse" as is. One major imperfection on the underside of the top tube paint; maybe an energy drink leaked on to it. A few minor imperfections elsewhere.
07-24-19 | 11:57 AM
#20
Mr. Anachronism
Joined: Jan 2013
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From: Somewhere west of Tobie's
Bikes: fillet-brazed Chicago Schwinns, and some other stuff
07-26-19 | 06:17 PM
#21
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Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 15
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From: Southern California
Bikes: Storck Scenero, Ross Signature Triad
Wow. Thanks for the interest and input. As it turns out after considering the options I have decided to refurbish the bike and keep it. I took it into Joe Bell in San Diego this week - great guy. He spent a couple of hours with me going over shades of paint color, modification ideas, etc.
For those interested in the details, I have decided to return it to its original pink color with recreated Ross decals.. I have also decided to update it as much as possible - widen the space between the rear dropouts to accommodate 21st century gearing, switch to brake handle shifters, etc. I know the vintage crowd is going to berate me for desecrating the temple, but I am already going to get ridiculed for being so slow while riding such a flashy colored bike, so what's a little more abuse.
I attempted to post pictures, but this site will not allow me because I do not have the minimum number of posts necessary to reach that inner circle status. Sorry. If I somehow pass the audition process, I'll post them.
For those interested in the details, I have decided to return it to its original pink color with recreated Ross decals.. I have also decided to update it as much as possible - widen the space between the rear dropouts to accommodate 21st century gearing, switch to brake handle shifters, etc. I know the vintage crowd is going to berate me for desecrating the temple, but I am already going to get ridiculed for being so slow while riding such a flashy colored bike, so what's a little more abuse.
I attempted to post pictures, but this site will not allow me because I do not have the minimum number of posts necessary to reach that inner circle status. Sorry. If I somehow pass the audition process, I'll post them.
07-26-19 | 07:01 PM
#22
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Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 15
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From: Southern California
Bikes: Storck Scenero, Ross Signature Triad
Yes!!!!! I don't know how these pictures got there because the site told me "no can do" when I attempted. The riding picture is its original pink 1986. The red was when I was dropping it off to Joe. It still won't let me post others.
07-26-19 | 07:06 PM
#23
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You are in good company with the updating. The 7k+ posters on this thread will have your back.
Retro roadies- old frames with STI's or Ergos
Retro roadies- old frames with STI's or Ergos
07-26-19 | 07:23 PM
#24
1/2 as far in 2x the time
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From: Northern Bergen County, NJ
Bikes: Yes, Please.
I am the original owner of a Ross Signature Triad which I still have, the 63 cm pink frame purchased directly from the Ross showroom in Commerce, CA in 1985. The stamped numbers on the bottom are 508 6316 84 107. I had it built up at a bike shop in Pasadena with Shimano Dura Ace bottom bracket, chain rings, and cranks; the remaining components are Shimano 105 I believe. I competed as an age group triathlete (international distance) for several years.
Since 1990 it has been used off and on for fitness riding. First generation Time clipless pedals were installed in the early 90s which have since been replaced by Speedplays. As my age got higher and my speed got slower, I could no longer do justice to the flashy hot pink paint and had the bike refurbished and painted burgundy in the mid-90s by Cycle Art in San Diego county; at that time a cracked bottom bracket was replaced.
At age 60, the 53/42 chain rings coupled with a 6 speed 13-24 became impractical for my knees, and I bought a carbon fiber Storck with more appropriate old man gearing. I am torn between keeping the beautiful Ross for flat rides or selling it to someone who would appreciate it for the classic it is. I am taking it to have it refurbished by Joe Bell in San Diego whose work is very respected.
Is there a market for it?
Since 1990 it has been used off and on for fitness riding. First generation Time clipless pedals were installed in the early 90s which have since been replaced by Speedplays. As my age got higher and my speed got slower, I could no longer do justice to the flashy hot pink paint and had the bike refurbished and painted burgundy in the mid-90s by Cycle Art in San Diego county; at that time a cracked bottom bracket was replaced.
At age 60, the 53/42 chain rings coupled with a 6 speed 13-24 became impractical for my knees, and I bought a carbon fiber Storck with more appropriate old man gearing. I am torn between keeping the beautiful Ross for flat rides or selling it to someone who would appreciate it for the classic it is. I am taking it to have it refurbished by Joe Bell in San Diego whose work is very respected.
Is there a market for it?
As long as you're not in a rush, that bike will find the right owner.
07-28-19 | 04:41 PM
#25
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From: Southern California
Bikes: Storck Scenero, Ross Signature Triad
Here are the pre-refurbish pictures. Sorry for the poor quality - had to hastily snap them as I dropped it off to Joe Bell in San Diego. I also included one of the original pink color from 1986 - for some unexplained reason the bike was much faster when I rode it back then.
Corrosion on underside of top tube near head tube
Top of top tube
Undersurface of bottom bracket area
Corrosion on underside of top tube near head tube
Top of top tube
Undersurface of bottom bracket area