Sorry, buddy, as a scientist I can tell you that one experiment performed by a couple of people doesn't make something "proven by science", no matter how many capital letters you use. It only demonstrates that, given the specific assumptions they make and their experimental setup, a certain result might be expected.

Among the issues with their research methodology: I'm guessing it was done under dry conditions? Short trials? On a trainer? No incline? They performed the test under conditions that would be maximally beneficial for using platforms.

To be fair, one should consider other scenarios. One problem with platforms is that, in general, none of them are perfect at giving good traction between foot and pedal, and the more they try to ensure good traction, the more it hurts when they fail. I'm betting those studs don't feel good against calf or shin.

Additionally, as I read the abstract it did show a 2% advantage in output, which is a decent amount. Look at it this way, that's almost certainly more than the difference between Sora and Dura-ace components, or similar arguments for other componentry (wheels, frames, etc). Put yet another way, if you're going to go to the trouble of buying a bike for more than $600, you should get clipless pedals too or you're wasting your money.

All I have to say is be careful of the wet. When I ran metal platforms in the rain the surface (no matter how many spikes were on there) got slippy. And if your foot slides off behind the pedal you run the risk of having those spikes slammed into your shin. I still have scars it is not fun.

I don't need perfect traction, I just need enough to keep my feet. Which, so far, these pedals have not failed me in once, even in the rain. This includes the occasional burst of high-cadence spinning when I need to go fast. For my style of riding, they are good enough.

And I could inflate my tires to 160 psi and put my seat 6" above my aerobars, and if I don't do this I'm just wasting my money, cause there is no reason to buy a bike over $600 unless its to go faster

By the abstract, toe clips are 2.1% worse. The test was done with 5 minute runs on an ergometer. The study doesn't exactly prove there are not significant advantages to using clipless pedals for bicycling.

(Ride what you like.)

If 2% is a true figure (I can agree with that), lets put it into everyday commuting application.
For my 50 minute commute of 11.25 miles, clipless will get me there 1 minute sooner. 1 minute.

Now what follows is just my personal opinion on the subject...

As I said earlier, in a race this would make a big difference. If you commute every day like you are in a race, that's your prerogative but that's not my style. One minute isn't even noticeable to me. Plus, I have 20 stop signs and 20 lights to navigate through as well as school buses, city buses, motorists, pedestrians, crossing guards, and I'm sure other stuff that all have an effect on my commute time. That small of a difference wouldn't even register.

Let me put it another way. This is the commuting forum, not the roadie forum. If a newb was to come to me and ask if clipless would get them to work faster than good platforms (especially ones with good grip like I posted), I'd flat out tell them "no". The difference (if any) is sooo minute, it's not even worth mentioning. The only thing I would mention is that being clipped in will help you in climbing hills because they will help you turn the pedals over the top portion of your stroke and they will help keep your feet glued to the pedals when spinning ferociously down hill... and I would sure recommend then on a fixie for that same reason. But that's it.

Now regarding getting a boo-boo on your shins... are you ladies kidding me? (no offense to the real ladies, who typically have a higher pain threshold than guys anyway)
I guess If I'm walking the bike and happen to kick the pedal, that would hurt. Heck, some crank brothers or pretty much any other medal or even hard plastic is gonna smart. If I fall off the bike, hitting my shin on the pedal is the least of my worries. Being careful when the pedals are wet? Good advice for any platform, especially if they are plastic/rubber. Metal studs, not so much but still something to keep in mind.

Who you calling a lady? Besides you should see my shins. So many scars it is amazing.

Anyhow, if a newbie asked me if clipless pedals would help him or her I would say yes. At the very least I find them more comfortable. Not to mention quicker.
Plus, riding my FG without foot retention is moronic as well. Try hitting a cadence in excess of 90 without foot retention. 150 being my max.

My comment was only directed to road bikes, and I'm *not* saying everyone needs a road bike - nothing wrong with hybrids, mountain bikes, cruisers, touring bikes, etc - but if you spend money for a higher-end road bike and then do something to cripple it, that's not particularly bright.

The only significant difference between a $600 or so road bike (say a Sora/Tiagra mix) and a more expensive road bike is indeed its speed. They all have basically the same features - basically light weight, skinny tires, drop bars, brifters. As you increase in price, the primary difference is that the thing gets faster. Why on earth would you spend an extra $1000 to increase the efficiency of the bike by 0.5% and then do something to reduce the efficiency by 2% or more? Just bad economics.

Before I get accused of being a bike snob, my road bike is a $400 Craigslist special. Why? Same argument as above - the weakest component on the bike is me.

Heh heh, i was just razzing.
Those are battle scars!

I was poking fun back. I suppose a smilie would have been helpful.

I wonder if anyone has tried the King Grip pedals, also from Rivendell? That's what I've been looking at. I have pretty wide feet, and I'm pretty cheap, otherwise I've been tempted by the Tioga Spider pedals. I'm glad to hear good things about platforms since that's all I've ever used, and I really don't see myself switching. Since 90% of my cycling is with the purpose of getting me to somewhere where I'll be getting off of my bike to do something else, I've never much been interested in clothing that improves my cycling in specific situations at the expense of my general cycling utility. Plus I've priced clipless shoes, and they make those Tiogas seem downright affordable.

Like all DH pedals, be careful if your foot ever slips. You can get some nasty shin injuries from these pedals...

Pleased to see that the platform pedals pictured in this thread are, indeed, platform pedals. (Even if they don't look or perform like the Lyotard Marcel Berthet platforms I used a long time ago. They were designed to work with toe clips.)
What do I do on my 'bent with SPD clipless pedals that I couldn't do with BMX-style platform pedals? When getting ready to take off from a dead stop, I can put my right foot on the pedal anywhere in the rotation and move the crankarm up, down, or all around to get to the sweet spot for a takeoff.

Yeah, clipless are better for that, no argument. But I was pleasantly surprised that with the Vipers, I can get a significant degree of the same effect. From a stop, I can sort of sling the pedal up through a good 120° of arc from bottom dead center--right up to where I want them for my start.

FWIW, I wear Gore-Tex hiking boots with my Vipers in all kinds of rain conditions. So far, not a single slip.

I really love these pedals.

I do it every day on my single speed 65 inch gear at 20-25 mph. If I were riding fixed I'd strap in however.

Yes, that is why I specified a FG in my post. However, I am having knee issues due to an injury so it will be a SS as soon as I finish installing the rear brake.

I have a set a king grips. I haven't installed them yet but get back to me in a week and i'll let you know how they work out.

Rivendell sells some nice MKS BMX style pedals at its website. An expensive pair for folks who ride in rain and mud and keep pedals for twenty years. And, a cheap set of "sneaker" pedals that are silly cheap, and built well enough for a couple of years of normal use.

The best BMX style pedals can work with any sort of shoe or sandals, from leather soled wingtip dress shoes down to flip flops...and can "lock" to the shoe as securely as any so-called "clipless" pedals.

Can you provide a model # or link to Bikenashbar for these pedals. I couldn't seem to find this model.
Thank you!
Mr Bill

I share your opinion that there's no sense using something to gain a tiny efficieincy increase when you're then forced to wear specific shoes whenever you get on your bike. That's why I've switched to regular (i.e. not clipless) pedals on my commuter. It took me awhile to adapt after having ridden exclusively on clipless for about.... 15 years? But now that I have adapted, I love it.

Anyway, I've been using a set of Grip Kings on my Quickbeam for about a month or so now and I like them a lot. They don't have a ton of bite but they have a large surface area and a lot of fairly grippy little nubs on `em. I can wear any shoes I like without a care. I ride with them a lot in these and these. Both grip the pedal great and never slip. I'm really satisified with the Grip Kings!

yeah? wheres the study?

you mean these?

https://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?c...20Pedal%20Sale

Read the whole thread.

Sorry, I just found the pedals on BN.
Mr Bill

Will they take cages or Power Grips?

The Tiogas? No. But that's kinda the whole point.

btw, still working out great and haven't slipped or hurt a shin yet!