The wheel lock just makes it more difficult to steal the rear wheel. With a proper U-lock they're quite useful. They're are relatively weak when compared to U-locks, but they usually go round the rim and leave little extra room for tools/leverage. Axa-Basta has several decent models (see "Framelocks" and "Click locks").

We do have some bike stand designs with a length of chain attached. The idea is to take the chain through the rear wheel lock, preventing anyone from carrying the bike away. Usually there's enough chain to take it through the front wheel too, basically securing frame and both wheels. Still I think the rear wheel lock alone is for low risk areas only.

--J

On a more trivial note, is the whole liquid nitrogen dropper + hammer thing just a T.V. fantasy?

Crawdadio:
What's your opinion of this lock? Is it a gimmick? I've seen them at motorcycle shows, and they looked sturdy there, but I'm no locksmith.

Well, both.
It could work, in theory. After the plug (cylinder) has been frozen and cracked apart, AND all the little frozen bits have been shaken out, one still has to know to actuate the lock with another tool. If applied to where the shackle meets the lock body, I could see it working quite well, but I really wouldn't know as I have never tried it.
But who the hell carries liquid nitrogen?

I really don't know how well those would hold up against a heavy prying attack. They look pretty tough, but I have no experience with them. Sorry. I also can't tell what kind of key they use, and whether or not the key system would be easily defeated.

I am absolutely certain that I wouldn't use them as my only lock on my nice bike in a high risk area.

EDIT:
I just noticed that it has a 'Push button keyless locking convenience'.
Bad. "Convenience" always, always equates to a loss in security, at least to some degree.

Street Cuffs Snap

So far as I can tell, it's mostly rumor and fantasy, but you do see it mentioned here and there....

Austin Chronicle
Willamette Week
From comments on a Boing Boing post:
From comments on on someone's personal blog, after their bike was stolen:
Previous mentions on BF:
Freon vs Padlock
Lock(s) suggestions (freezing disclaimed)

Using LN to break locks/chains to steal bikes has shown up in movies/tv, including being dramatized on L&O:
Legion (L&O:CI S2)

These folks played around with it, and seemed to find it took too long. So maybe it's all a put-on, or maybe the thieves know a few special tricks.

So anyway, that's why I was curious. Seems like if there's a way to do it effectively and quickly in the field, it'd be pretty hard to guard against.

Anyone know if the NYC thing is apocryphal?

"You can't theft-proof a bike"

True, but for that matter, you can't theft-proof anything. Here's a link to how some men broke into what was probably the world's most secure vault:
https://www.wired.com/politics/law/ma...urrentPage=all

Ok - how do they do this? I don't mean step-by-step instructions, but it's just never made sense to me - seems like 4 digits be enough possible combinations to take far more time to figure out the combination than it would to break the lock? Or is there something else to it?

It's also a giant PITA that Kryptonite won't see same-keyed locks. According to them, the only locks they might do that for are the super expensive, super heavy ones. If I leave 2 locks at work, 2 locks at home, and carry 2 locks with me, that's 6 different keys. :-(

Cross posted (by me in response to the same question, and some other questions....):

"


Originally Posted by skellener
"Well, if that is the case, the bike is gone no matter what lock you use. I think the idea is to keep the "not so serious" bike thieves from getting it.

Still wondering if anyone has info on combination vs. key type locks?"


Originally Posted by NEXUS
"I have only and will only use one kind of lock and that is the Kryptonite Kryptolok Combo U:



And the reason is I hate carrying around keys that can get lost. I even have an electric combo lock for my house front door. Life is so much easier this way. A few months ago my best friend who now lives out of state had a unexpected business meeting here in town and wanted to spend some time with us afterwords. We were actually out of town so I gave him the combination to get in the house and the combination to the U-lock if he wanted to go for a bike ride. Saved him hotel and car rental!

If you live in a bad area then this lock probably wouldn't be good enough for you since it's not that thick. You would probably want to go with the OnGuard 5012C Bulldog DT Combination U-Lock & Cable"



" Convenience=a compromise in security.
Usually.
If one knows how, it takes a matter of seconds to turn the right combination and open that lock. And, unfortunately, to people passing by it just looks like you are fumbling with the combo on your lock.
Handy and easy if you live in a small town. Easily stolen if you are in a larger city.

P.S. I don't want to scare you, but if you spent less than $600 on your keypad entry lock on your house, you should replace it with a better one, or go back to a good ol' fashioned heavy duty deadbolt.

I deal with at least two people who have had their homes broken into each day (average).
Take this with a grain of salt. If you live in a nice, small town with a low crime rate, obviously don't worry.............
....but if you don't.
How much is your peace of mind/safety/big screen/bike worth to you?"



Originally Posted by NEXUS
"The house lock wasn't that expensive but it is a deadbolt lock. If some guy really wanted to get it her would just go through a window.

So how does a person figure out the combo to a lock in seconds?

And yeah, I live in a really safe town with almost 0 crime."


" I am glad that you live in low crime area. I do miss those days.... Hey, whatever works for you. I just hate to see people that think their homes are secure after buying locks from home depot and the like.

Without becoming too technical and/or giving info on a technique, there are 'gates', that you can actually see or feel as you spin the dials. Depending on the particular lock you have in front of you (make,model) you have to know how to 'transfer' them to the actual combo.
So, for a hypothetical example, I see/feel a gate at #4 as I spin the first dial. Knowing that with this particular lock they offset the 'gates' 2 numbers, I dial back 2 numbers.
Next chamber.......etc.....
There is some knowledge, skill, and good eyes involved, but with practice anyone can learn.

There are actually races at ALOA (associated locksmiths of america) conventions involving these, and many other opening techniques.
They even give you prizes!
I know it's annoying to carry keys, but to all out there who live in an area where your bike even MIGHT be stolen, please use a good solid, keyed lock. "

Edit: I will add that most of the newer U locks are using "disc tumbler" cylinder systems. While these are very good, time tested cylinders, they do have their problems.
Sometimes, because there is no spring tension on the disks, they get out of alignment. You have surely tried to put your key in and had it not go all the way in, causing you to have to fumble with it to get it to turn.
When this happens, while you insert the key, jiggle and turn left repeatedly as you push it in until it gets to the bottom.
Annoying.
Disk tumblers can be defeated, if you know how. But they ARE much better than standard pin tumbler padlocks, or tubular key cylinders.

Tubular cylinders are OUT because they can be opened with a bic pen. While this is true, it got all way blown out of proportion. It is still a difficult thing to do. Go ahead. Try it.
Still, don't buy a tubular (looks like a round hole on the keyed part) keyed bike lock.

All that said, most theives don't pick locks. They break them. You can't do much against an angle grinder. With the right cutting wheel, they can cut through any material that I can think of. Including a highly tensioned rim. I have done this as a test. It took about 20 seconds.
So, weigh convenience, cost, and weight. Buy the best lock that you can. Use it every time. And forget about it.



As to ON GUARD locks vs. KRYPTONITE.
I have seen more lock failures with the on guard brand than the kryptonite. In fact, I have never had a customer bring in a kryptonite lock that was broken in any way, only to have them removed from bikes, or keys made.
They function almost identically, and can be defeated in exactly the same ways. So neither is more secure than the other in my opinion. However, the kryptonite brand locks DO SEEM to be built quite a bit more robustly, with tighter tolerances and cleaner machining. I own two of them.

So, for lasting, quality operation, I go for the kryptonite over on guard. It is best, IMO, to invest a little more cash into your locking system.


You can't prevent someone from taking a cordless angle grinder to your locks. This is what we usually do to remove locks legitimately for customers. Your toughest lock or chain will be defeated in 3-5 minutes, tops. You can, however, persuade the opportunist (most common theft) by using a high quality locking system to deter them onto the next (easier) bike to steal."

Originally Posted by SlimAgainSoon
"Hey, Mr. Locksmith -- what about graphite?

I always thought that was the thing to use on locks."


"^
Powdered graphite (extremely fine) was considered the best lubricant for cylinder plugs (only) (the part that the key actually goes into) for many, many years. And it works really well......

...Until any kind of liquid, dirt, gunk, particulate gets in there. Bike locks get A LOT of foreign material into them. On interior door locks, where you won't see that happen, it works really well.
Once some foreign material gets into the cylinder, the graphite attaches to it and clumps up. It happens all the time when some 'genious' maintenance man has a lock issue and thinks that WD40 is a magic cure all. That makes everything even worse and more sticky when it dries. This negates its effectiveness entirely.

Don't use graphite or WD40 on your bike lock. "


Maybe too much information for your particular question, but I thought I'd just throw it out there for any new readers who don't want to sift through all the pages.

The cheap combos are trivial to pick, you can just put pressure on them and feel when each wheel drops in.
It's possible to build a well-machined combo with hard detents on every number of every wheel that would make it a lot harder to pick, but I don't know if anyone actually does.

Yeah...I am neither a locksmith nor do I work for a bike lock company, but I know cheap key locks can easily be picked, while more expensive ones can't (or at least it's really really difficult). I would think if they really wanted to, someone could do the same thing for combination locks...

Bah, I just ride a bike that is worth less then the $60 u-lock I have on it.

Though, now that I think about it, it is a bit discouraging not being able to lock an expensive bike up without the fear of it being stolen.

So, just to back track for a minute. Is it not recommended to leave your bike lock on the bike rack? I noticed people in my work do it with their u locks. I really don't want to have to carry a u lock it's too heavy.

^
It depends a little bit on the crime rate/probability in your specific area.
If bike theft is probable/likely/common, I wouldn't do it. Simply because someone could notice that you lock your bike at the same place with the same lock every day. They come prepared to break your specific type of lock, and your bike is theirs..........

If you aren't worried about this type of scenario, then I don't see a problem with it. If possible, always use two different types of locks. Even if you just leave two locked up to the rack, it is better than just one.

The bike rack is on the roof in a car park, its accessible by general public but is not on the street. I live in Manchester, England, its got quite a bad crime rate. The thing is though that there are quite a few locks on these bike racks and so many bikes get locked to them.

I am just waiting for another lock to come in the post. The one you recommended in your first post. (thanks!) I have currently got 2 locks on it but one is crap.

Sounds to me like, unless there's something that's particularly unique about your bike, that this is a largely theoretical concern. It's not exactly a giant shock that you would use a U Lock to lock your bike, right? :-)

^
Right. You should use two different types of lock.

My main point was about using the same location day after day. If you lock your bike at the same place everyday without changing up the location once in awhile, it is entirely conceivable that a thief might case your bike. That is, it is a possibility, especially in a larger city where bike theft is rampant.
If theft is a concern, don't be predictable.

No.

^^This. You lock your bike to the same rack every day. You leave your U lock there. Now one day you go to lock up and find someone has filled the keyhole with superglue. Now what? Do you just leave the bike unlocked on the rack? It's now an easy mark. Or what if someone thinks your lock is their's and accidently breaks their key off in it trying to unlock it? Again,you're now without a lock. What if you want to stop at the store on the way home? Plus,leaving your lock out in the elements 24/7 is going to cause corrosion problems.

I've been using the same Citadel U-lock for the last 31 years. I don't doubt the secret to this lock's successful history is the bikes it's locked up: a succession of fine-riding elderly beaters with low spec parts. It's 2009 and I don't lock&leave too much any more. I bought a folder and don't let it get out of reach.

Locking is still an important issue for me, though. After having a nice bike (and nothing else) stolen out of my garage one day (it turns out this is not an uncommon bike theft scenario), I began keeping the bikes locked up at home. Take a picture of yourself with each of your bikes and record the serial numbers. If your bike is stolen, you are not going to get it back, but you may be able to get an insurance settlement.

BTW, none of my local shops carry Kryptonite. I have no idea why. Around here it's OnGuard or on-line if you want a U-lock.

tcs

I leave my ulock everyday but there are not elements to worry about and no other locks to mix it up with. If someone wanted it they know I lock it in the garage everyday and it's the only bike out there one lock, two or three wouldn't matter I'm away from it for 10+ hours a day. I guess all they'd really need how it is normally locked up is to remove my cranks and break the chain. Silly non-triangulated frame who designed this thing anyways! If I lock it futher back they'll have to take off the fork too so they'd need 2 allen wrenches.. that'll stop em



I have a cheapy lock in the bag for most places that I'll be in for a short time.. Only enough to stop a walk off but that is more then most folks do so I'm fort knox baby!

Ok, can some english major please try to explain this wording - logically what a response of "No" to "Is it not recommended" parse out to?

From the rest of the post I assume you're saying you shouldn't leave your lock there. Well, in making this decision you should consider some practical realities:
1. If there's always other bikes locked up where you lock up your bike, and they are as or more expensive than yours I don't see the point of worrying about someone "casing" your bike. If there's always bikes there, why would they "case" your bike when they could just steal another bike?
2. The question often isn't "Should I leave my lock on the rack" but is "Should I buy a heavy duty lock and leave it on the rack, or should I buy a lighter lock that I can carry with me but not leave it on the rack?". So you're trading one risk for another.

I don't know where other people live, perhaps New York is an exception. But I know if I felt obligated to take my lock with me, constantly find new places to lock my bike up to, carry 2 heavy duty locks...I don't think I'd be willing to leave my bike there at all. I believe one of the starting premises of this thread was that you cannot 100% secure your bike. There's a point where it's just not a good idea to leave your bike outside somewhere, period.

Not sure why it took PaulRivers response to remember but most of what you are saying would apply to long term rented bike lockers also. Yes they are more secure in theory compared to a ulock someone could fill one of those with superglue, intentionally or acidently break off a key or something else rendering it unusable. It is also has problems with the elements as I found through experience and I had to make sure to carry graphite because my bike locker would stick sometimes in the new england winter.

Carrying an extra lock might help but if you were cased no matter what lock you carried it'll be gone before you get back so I guess you turn around go home and find another way?

HA!

I have good friends at a local bike shop in New Orleans. They rent bikes and supply KryptoniteŽ Locks with each rental. Sometimes, customers lose the key. The bike shop does not always have a spare key (because that one was lost by a previous customer). So one or two shop employees have to go and break the lock to retrieve the rental bike - almost always locked in a high foot traffic area.

Guess what? No one has ever (read as NEVER) said one word to the guy driving the power tool through a U-lock. Not once. Not a cop, security guard, civilian, other bikers, NOBODY.

Sorry to disappoint you further.

The question was about thieves, not LBS employees....