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New Old school steel mountain frame?

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Old 09-13-11 | 11:03 AM
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New Old school steel mountain frame?

Does anyone still make steel frames like the old 90's era rockhoppers, stumpjumpers and 800 series Treks? I've been looking for a frame like these for a few months now, but I need an XL or 23", and those seem to be few and far between.
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Old 09-13-11 | 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by aceofspaids
Does anyone still make steel frames like the old 90's era rockhoppers, stumpjumpers and 800 series Treks? I've been looking for a frame like these for a few months now, but I need an XL or 23", and those seem to be few and far between.
not sure if there are any production bikes out there, that meet your criteria.
it could end up being a custom build.
or..
just keep trying the likes of eBay.
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Old 09-13-11 | 11:21 AM
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A company out of NYC makes frames and forks like the ones you describe. The frameset is called the Simple City and the site is www.nycbikes.com. The largest size is 22.5 and the frame and fork cost $249 plus another 40 bucks for shipping. I have never ordered from them but I have seen some people on BF say that they have had negative experiences with them. Just saying.

I also love those old steel mountain bike frames but not the problems that potentially come with a twenty year old frame that was beat the **** out of, so far I have only found the company that I just mentioned above making these frames new. I'd love to hear of another option.
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Old 09-13-11 | 11:39 AM
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If you just want a fully rigid steel frame, surly (troll, karate monkey, and ogre) and salsa (fargo, and a bunch of steel frames for suspension) make great frames, but they are more expensive, i think around 500 for frames. Niner makes frames like that but are really expensive.
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Old 09-13-11 | 02:13 PM
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Bikes: Kona Dawg, Surly 1x1, Karate Monkey, Rockhopper, Crosscheck , Burley Runabout,

Surly makes some 22 and 24" frames. I have 3 . The 1x1 , cross check and the karate monkey. Very solid and versilte.
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Old 09-13-11 | 02:22 PM
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Soma Groove.
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Old 09-13-11 | 02:39 PM
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Old 09-13-11 | 03:47 PM
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With your size, go 29er.

The problem with most of today's frames (even the steel ones) is that they are generally designed for suspension forks, and tend to have much steeper angles than the bikes of yore.
That said, the Surly Karate Monkey and Ogre, Salsa El Mariachi, among others are quite nice, but are "suspension-corrected". The Fargo is non-suspension corrected, but is designed as an offroad drop-bar (woodchipper) design. That is not to say a flat bar could not be used, but it is optimized for the woodchipper.
Singular cycles in jolly old England designs and builds some very nice, affordable framesets, with an eye towards the classic design and functionality in today's age. The Prairie Peddler in Wisconson is the US distributor. FWIW I've ordered their "Gryphon" frameset (new version with full braze ons should be shipping soon), as it represents a combination of modern day practicality with classic style and geometry (sloping top tube excepted)

Jeff Jones in Oregon espouses the old school ethos, and designs and builds bikes around that philosophy. His ti customs put him on the map, and he now offers steel framesets starting at $750. The catch on this is that his front forks are spaced 135mm with standard disc spacing so a special Paul hub is required.

If staying with the full retro vibe (26er), the Soma Groove is very cool.
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Old 09-13-11 | 05:03 PM
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Bikes: 2012 Salsa Fargo 2, Rocky Mountain Fusion, circa '93

Salsa says their Fargo is suspension corrected now, at least for 80 mm of suspension:

https://salsacycles.com/bikes/fargo_3/

I'm waiting to try one, soon I hope.

But they aren't much like my '93 Rocky Mountain bike in terms of the frame.
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Old 09-14-11 | 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by aceofspaids
Does anyone still make steel frames like the old 90's era rockhoppers, stumpjumpers and 800 series Treks? I've been looking for a frame like these for a few months now, but I need an XL or 23", and those seem to be few and far between.
26" wheeled Surly LHT is very similar actually; they go up to 62cm; they are going to have a 64cm in '12 but that will be 700c only
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Old 09-14-11 | 11:43 AM
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Does Trek still make the 820?

https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes/mountain/sport/820

Buy it and replace the components you don't like... you'll probably still come out ahead pricewise over a Surly.

It is a shame that Nashbar quit selling the steel MTB frames. I have an NB-SF2 from 2006 and I love it all to pieces (almost literally!).
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Old 09-14-11 | 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by bigbenaugust
Does Trek still make the 820?

https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes/mountain/sport/820

Buy it and replace the components you don't like... you'll probably still come out ahead pricewise over a Surly.

It is a shame that Nashbar quit selling the steel MTB frames. I have an NB-SF2 from 2006 and I love it all to pieces (almost literally!).
The current day Trek 820 is aluminum.
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Old 09-14-11 | 12:14 PM
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You mean does an Importer have something made, in your size, off-shore?

... as there are many custom builders in the US that would be happy to make a frame set ,
for you to meet your exact needs , just cannot compete with Taiwan for low cost..
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Old 09-14-11 | 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by HardyWeinberg
26" wheeled Surly LHT is very similar actually; they go up to 62cm; they are going to have a 64cm in '12 but that will be 700c only
+1
My old 1989 Hard Rock and my LHT have surprisingly similar geometries.
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Old 09-14-11 | 12:33 PM
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Bikes: Surly crosscheck ssfg, Custom vintage french racing bike, Bruce Gordon Rock & Road

Pretty much an old school mtn bike IMO...

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Old 09-14-11 | 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by zoltani
Pretty much an old school mtn bike IMO...

WOW! Who makes that, I can't make out the name on the frame?
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Old 09-14-11 | 12:42 PM
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Bikes: Surly crosscheck ssfg, Custom vintage french racing bike, Bruce Gordon Rock & Road

Bruce Gordon

https://www.bgcycles.com/rocknroad.html

Frame and fork will run you $1600, but it's hand built in Bruce's shop, and he has been making touring bikes for a long time. I got mine used complete for the price of the frame and fork, though I have the 700cc version...it's a damn good bike.
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Old 09-14-11 | 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by zoltani
Bruce Gordon

https://www.bgcycles.com/rocknroad.html

Frame and fork will run you $1600, but it's hand built in Bruce's shop, and he has been making touring bikes for a long time. I got mine used complete for the price of the frame and fork, though I have the 700cc version...it's a damn good bike.
Just a bit out of my price range, by about $1300. Nice bike though.
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Old 09-14-11 | 01:18 PM
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Bikes: Surly crosscheck ssfg, Custom vintage french racing bike, Bruce Gordon Rock & Road

Yeah, it ain't cheap. As others eluded to you will either have to get such a bike built for you custom, or you should check out some off the peg touring bikes, such as the long haul trucker.
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Old 09-14-11 | 01:19 PM
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Bikes: Raleigh Grand Prix, Giant Innova, Nishiki Sebring, Trek 7.5FX

Surly Troll, Karate Monkey, Trek 820, the Soma Groove is nice too...


-Slim

Last edited by SlimRider; 09-19-11 at 06:59 AM.
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Old 09-14-11 | 03:09 PM
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Not to belabor a point but at $289, shipped, the nycbikes simple city frameset is made of reynolds 520 and 4130 steel. It has the old rigid mtb frame geometry with plenty of braze ons and made for 26" wheels. And, it comes with a headset and in ten different colors. It seems to me to be the most economical and appropriate choice. If I'm overlooking a company, I'd love to know.
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Old 09-14-11 | 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by aceofspaids
The current day Trek 820 is aluminum.
Blasphemy!!! Sorry about that. At least my Nashbar is all-steel.
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Old 09-14-11 | 03:26 PM
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Bikes: Old steel GT's, for touring and commuting

If it were me, and that was the price range I was looking at, I'd just be looking at Craigslist for a 20 year old mountain bike. Right now I am kicking myself because I don't have the measly $125 for a '91 Schwinn Paramount Series 70 in my neck of the woods. Same geometry you are looking for, and some of the high end components probably still have some life left in them. For the difference in price with that company in NY, you could probably get a used bike sandblasted and painted, or strip the paint yourself and have it powder coated.

My '88 GT Timberline is still going strong as a daily commuter and I use it for pretty heavily loaded bike-camping trips. A few months ago I picked up a '91 Sekai/Norco MTB that had clearly sat in someones garage for all of the past 20 years, it didn't even have any wear at all on the original brake pads! There appear to be a fair number of bikes out there like that, that have seen very little use that people are looking at now thinking they will never ride them or that they are "outdated". These are essentially new framesets for you for about 100-200 $.

Last edited by Medic Zero; 09-14-11 at 03:33 PM.
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Old 09-14-11 | 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by aceofspaids
The current day Trek 820 is aluminum.
Unless their website is incorrect the frame spec is as follows:

Trek Custom Steel w/chromoly seat tube
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Old 09-14-11 | 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by canyoneagle
With your size, go 29er.

The problem with most of today's frames (even the steel ones) is that they are generally designed for suspension forks, and tend to have much steeper angles than the bikes of yore.
That said, the Surly Karate Monkey and Ogre, Salsa El Mariachi, among others are quite nice, but are "suspension-corrected". The Fargo is non-suspension corrected, but is designed as an offroad drop-bar (woodchipper) design. That is not to say a flat bar could not be used, but it is optimized for the woodchipper.
You've got it backwards. Modern frames designed for suspension have slacker head angles than older nonsuspension bikes. The longer the travel of the fork that the bike is designed for, the slacker the head angle. This makes sense since the head angle changes as the fork compresses. Bikes from around 1990 had head angles of 71 to 73 degrees (depending on brand) while most modern suspension frames have head angles around 70 degrees. A rigid mountain bike with a 71 degree head angle is a handful to ride off-road. A steep angle puts you over the bars on downhills...scary...and but it centers you over the bike on climbs making them very a little easier. It takes a lot of finesse to ride a steep angled bike

The first generation mountain bikes (about 1983) had 69 degree head angles but you don't want to ride one of them. They are superbly stable on downhills but they are terrible to climb on.

"Suspension corrected" is usually used to refer to a rigid fork. The blades are a little longer so that the head angle isn't too steep when installed.
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