"Just Ride" by Grant Petersen
05-24-12, 12:43 PM
#101
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 614
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
The whole "Copenhagenize" movement (driven in large part by companies like Riv) is just as much about image as the wannabe racer crowd. I mean, I'm all for creating a culture of bike ubiquity, but I think both extremes of the argument are wrong, since they're all style over substance. Just because you wear tweed and suspenders while you ride doesn't make you more "authentic" than someone who wears lycra, and just because you wear your sunglasses over your helmet straps doesn't make you the epitome of the sport. Bottom line: biking>not biking. Wear/ride whatever the f**k you want, just don't be a dick about it.
05-24-12, 12:45 PM
#102
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Burnaby, BC
Posts: 4,144
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
3 Posts
Whoosh!
You've really rather missed my point, and at the same time expressed totally unsupported and unsupportable opinions about my views.
Nowhere did I say expressly or impliedly, for example, that I "don't like his (GP's) bikes". In fact, the converse is true: I very much like the Atlantis, for example.
You've really rather missed my point, and at the same time expressed totally unsupported and unsupportable opinions about my views.
Nowhere did I say expressly or impliedly, for example, that I "don't like his (GP's) bikes". In fact, the converse is true: I very much like the Atlantis, for example.
In fact, your point is not really so subtle. It's just that it's wrong.
05-24-12, 12:59 PM
#103
born again cyclist
05-24-12, 01:03 PM
#104
Senior Member
I think the views that GP expresses are his honest take on things and not just a marketing ploy. But I also think there is some marketing going on, intentional or not.
He's saying you don't need to buy clipless pedals and spandex clothes because cycling can be a tranqual and relaxing activity as well as an athletic one. And it just so happens that he sells some stuff that will work well for that softer side of cycling.
He's saying you don't need to buy clipless pedals and spandex clothes because cycling can be a tranqual and relaxing activity as well as an athletic one. And it just so happens that he sells some stuff that will work well for that softer side of cycling.
05-24-12, 02:34 PM
#105
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 542
Bikes: 2012 Jamis Coda Comp; early 80s Univega Nuovo Sport
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
The whole "Copenhagenize" movement (driven in large part by companies like Riv) is just as much about image as the wannabe racer crowd. I mean, I'm all for creating a culture of bike ubiquity, but I think both extremes of the argument are wrong, since they're all style over substance. Just because you wear tweed and suspenders while you ride doesn't make you more "authentic" than someone who wears lycra, and just because you wear your sunglasses over your helmet straps doesn't make you the epitome of the sport. Bottom line: biking>not biking. Wear/ride whatever the f**k you want, just don't be a dick about it.
05-24-12, 04:27 PM
#107
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Above ground, Walnut Creek, Ca
Posts: 6,681
Bikes: 8 ss bikes, 1 5-speed touring bike
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 86 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
4 Posts
The guy is welcome to come here anytime and express his views. No one cares about his bikes, but rather, are commenting on his rather strange and mildly insulting opinions and apparent lack of a thorough understanding of bike commuting. All in a rather lame and obvious attempt to sell his wares.
the guy always reminds me of Mr. J. Peterman, of Seinfeld fame, and his pretentious ad copy, except GP is NOT clueless.
Last edited by hueyhoolihan; 05-24-12 at 04:33 PM.
05-24-12, 04:39 PM
#108
GATC
Not only does a less expensive suit cost less, it is also a far less precious thing. You might not bicycle to work in a $1,700 suit, but one that cost $450? When the cost of a suit is on par with a fancy dress shirt and a pair of premium jeans, the possibilities for wearing it open up considerably.
05-24-12, 04:46 PM
#109
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Naptown
Posts: 1,133
Bikes: NWT 24sp DD; Brompton M6R
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
1 Post
Sometime try riding a bike in normal clothes. If you do it often enough, you'll weed out certain garments, but in short order you'll find that your cycling wardrobe is about five times as big as you thought it was, and you'll never again not go for a short ride just because you didn't feel like suiting up.
We sell bike jerseys, and like them and wear them ourselves, when it's appropriate or we just feel like it. The rear pockets are handy, but not essential, and a bag on a bike almost always carries whatever the pocket can carry, and does it better. Pockets are for getting at stuff while pedaling a bike that has no bags. Or, if you're just going out for a short ride, a snack and a repair kit fit nicely in jersey pockets. Jerseys are good, but you don't have to wear one all the time.
We sell bike jerseys, and like them and wear them ourselves, when it's appropriate or we just feel like it. The rear pockets are handy, but not essential, and a bag on a bike almost always carries whatever the pocket can carry, and does it better. Pockets are for getting at stuff while pedaling a bike that has no bags. Or, if you're just going out for a short ride, a snack and a repair kit fit nicely in jersey pockets. Jerseys are good, but you don't have to wear one all the time.
What I am surprised by is the large number of thin-skinned cyclists on this forum who react defensively if someone like GP even suggests that they don't have to wear bike specific clothing to ride to work, and who suggests that you might try something different.
05-24-12, 04:55 PM
#110
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Eugene, Oregon
Posts: 1,345
Bikes: 2014 Specialized Dolce Triple, 1987 Schwinn Tempo, 2012 Windsor Kensington 8
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
It was a rainy, blustery day today (with thunderstorms expected later) so I put on my roadie gear - complete with waterproof jacket and helmet cover and set off for a short pleasure jaunt that ended at the local Grocery Outlet, so I brought along a pannier to pick up some cheap canned goods before heading home. Saw probably 5 other cyclists (including a ~10 year old kid on a SS Walgoose who dropped my arse like Facebook stock, little punk) no one else in cycling specific clothing. Yet we all managed to smile and wave and/or chat amicably when our paths crossed.
The truth is I don't know anyone who is a cyclist who is only a "utility" cyclist, or only a "commuter" or only a "roadie." We all move in and out of various cyclist categories at different times and in different ways.
The truth is I don't know anyone who is a cyclist who is only a "utility" cyclist, or only a "commuter" or only a "roadie." We all move in and out of various cyclist categories at different times and in different ways.
05-24-12, 04:58 PM
#111
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Eugene, Oregon
Posts: 1,345
Bikes: 2014 Specialized Dolce Triple, 1987 Schwinn Tempo, 2012 Windsor Kensington 8
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
05-24-12, 07:06 PM
#112
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Antioch, IL
Posts: 328
Bikes: Giant Defy Advanced 0, Rivendell- Sam Hillborne, Montague folding bike.
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I genuinely like Rivendell stuff, and enjoy Grant's columns. Will probably buy the book just to read them again. I've found that everything he sells is the highest quality, and I always check what he's selling before heading over to Performance. Currently wearing Rivendell "bike shorts" as I'm writing this. I particularly recommend his pedals to older riders, and have them on three bikes right now.
Having said that, I also do most of my commutes (about 4000mi last year) in bike gear.
Having said that, I also do most of my commutes (about 4000mi last year) in bike gear.
__________________
"Why is there a hill after every meal, but not a meal after every hill?"
--Overheard on Grabaawr
"Why is there a hill after every meal, but not a meal after every hill?"
--Overheard on Grabaawr
05-25-12, 07:55 AM
#113
born again cyclist
Doesn't really make him sound like an ass to me.
What I am surprised by is the large number of thin-skinned cyclists on this forum who react defensively if someone like GP even suggests that they don't have to wear bike specific clothing to ride to work, and who suggests that you might try something different.
What I am surprised by is the large number of thin-skinned cyclists on this forum who react defensively if someone like GP even suggests that they don't have to wear bike specific clothing to ride to work, and who suggests that you might try something different.
when i hear phrases like "where is there room for debate?" about a topic as hugely subjective as what to wear when cycling, i know that i'm listening to an obnoxious, arrogant, closed-minded, blow-hard tool.
here is the gospel truth:
Last edited by Steely Dan; 05-25-12 at 07:59 AM.
05-25-12, 09:48 AM
#115
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 401
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Ohh c'mon now.
It's been my well heeled experience that some cheap dri-star T's from wallie world, any pair of shorts, and a brooks saddle can serve as comfortable attire, even biking 70 miles a day in Floriduh's furnace.
It's been my well heeled experience that some cheap dri-star T's from wallie world, any pair of shorts, and a brooks saddle can serve as comfortable attire, even biking 70 miles a day in Floriduh's furnace.
Matt
05-25-12, 10:08 AM
#116
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Beaverton, OR
Posts: 14,744
Bikes: Yes
Mentioned: 525 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3230 Post(s)
Liked 3,870 Times
in
1,439 Posts
Anyway, the vast majority of people will read just the title of the book and comprehend the point. The sales price of the book is a tax on people who don't get it.
__________________
My Bikes
My Bikes
05-25-12, 10:16 AM
#117
GATC
Sometime try riding a bike in normal clothes. If you do it often enough, you'll weed out certain garments, but in short order you'll find that your cycling wardrobe is about five times as big as you thought it was, and you'll never again not go for a short ride just because you didn't feel like suiting up.
"There shouldn't be any debate at all," Petersen says. "Riding a bicycle should be just a natural part of your life. It's so easy. We are the only ones — 'we,' speaking as an American — we are generally the only ones who commute to work in racing clothing. Where is there room for debate about how ridiculous that is?"
But hey, I have never worn a bike jersey so maybe I shouldn't comment.
05-25-12, 10:27 AM
#118
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 401
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
grant wasn't merely suggesting that there might be another way of doing things (extremely reasonable), he was saying that commuting in cycling-specific clothing is ridiculous and that there isn't any room for debate on the subject (ass).
when i hear phrases like "where is there room for debate?" about a topic as hugely subjective as what to wear when cycling, i know that i'm listening to an obnoxious, arrogant, closed-minded, blow-hard tool.
when i hear phrases like "where is there room for debate?" about a topic as hugely subjective as what to wear when cycling, i know that i'm listening to an obnoxious, arrogant, closed-minded, blow-hard tool.
I haven't read the book, but I have met Grant, a few of his employees, and have a general understanding of his customer base. Prior to meeting Grant I had an internet-based preconception of a grey haired crotchety old man so opinionated nobody could have a conversation with him unless you drank the kool-aid and agreed with everything he said. I was completely wrong. I won't try to paint a picture because I don't know him well enough to do so, but I can say, from my experience, that Rivendell is passionate about "all" aspects of cycling, and aren't as judgmental as the internet would have you believe.
Matt
05-25-12, 10:43 AM
#119
born again cyclist
but then, as another poster astutely pointed out, he probably wouldn't sell as many books.
05-25-12, 11:01 AM
#120
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 489
Bikes: '74 Schwinn Le Tour (x2), '83 Bianchi, '96 Trek 820, '96 Trek 470, '99 Xmart Squishy Bike, '03 Giant Cypress
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
I love Rivendell's stuff/aesthetic (sadly it's way above my payscale), and tend to agree with most of GP's philosophies (not all, though, he seems weirdly lacking in flexibility in some things). I tend to think that he's just trying to quell some people's thoughts/worries/preconceived notions that you need X,Y,Z to ride a bike, when most of the times you need to "just ride" the bike and not worry about all of the other stuff.
05-25-12, 11:06 AM
#121
Infamous Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 24,360
Bikes: Surly Big Dummy, Fuji World, 80ish Bianchi
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
3 Posts
Bingo, we have a winner! What kind of prizes do you have for this sage gentleman, Stormcrowe? I think he deserves a titanium membership!
__________________
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
05-25-12, 11:16 AM
#122
Infamous Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 24,360
Bikes: Surly Big Dummy, Fuji World, 80ish Bianchi
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
3 Posts
But of course, you know your own butt, taint and winky better than me...thank god, so like you already mentioned, do what is best for you and your unique needs.
__________________
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
05-25-12, 11:23 AM
#123
Infamous Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 24,360
Bikes: Surly Big Dummy, Fuji World, 80ish Bianchi
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
3 Posts
F that. While I may not wear cycling specific clothing, I am much happier riding in clothing that is better suited to riding than my work clothes and changing into my work clothes at work. I tried to revert back to the whole ride in my work clothes thing when I lucked out and landed my current job only 5 miles away from home...but there was simply no way I could avoid working up a sweat on my rolling route and I just don't feel comfy in wet clothes in my old age...especially in the freakin winter, when I tend to sweat even more!
__________________
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
05-25-12, 11:37 AM
#124
Infamous Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 24,360
Bikes: Surly Big Dummy, Fuji World, 80ish Bianchi
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
3 Posts
__________________
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
05-25-12, 11:44 AM
#125
Infamous Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 24,360
Bikes: Surly Big Dummy, Fuji World, 80ish Bianchi
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
3 Posts
To be fair, Grant will go on about how detrimental it is for people to be wearing spandex outside of a race or group ride setting, then at the same time will try to sell you wool sweaters and knickers.
I'm sorry, knickers are just as out of place when you're more than a few feet from a bike or a pirate ship as a cycling jersey is.
Knickers are very practical bike wear and in combination with the sweaters has a sort of a nostalgic look. To me it's still trying to sell an image or lifestyle, just like the "race oriented" crowd is. It's just a different lifestyle.
I'm sorry, knickers are just as out of place when you're more than a few feet from a bike or a pirate ship as a cycling jersey is.
Knickers are very practical bike wear and in combination with the sweaters has a sort of a nostalgic look. To me it's still trying to sell an image or lifestyle, just like the "race oriented" crowd is. It's just a different lifestyle.
__________________
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey