i was wondering why there are not more bicycle users in my neighborhood since we have alot of folks on disability and ssi and in programed housing
well it costs $2 each way using a bus, so that's about $1500 a year if daily use
my car costs $600/year for mandatory insurance and $20/month in gas ,that's a total of $840/year for having a car
i have seen used cars for around $600 and if you only use your car like me for local runs to the supermarket or other local errands the maintenance and repair costs are low on a yearly basis.
i guess this is why even the poorest among us have cars instead of bikes.
acorn

That depends entirely on where you live and what you drive. For me, it'll save me almost $10,000 a year between maintenance, insurance, gas, tolls, and the car payment itself. It's a no-brainer for me to get rid of the ole 4-wheeler.

Your math may be flawed. I'm amazed at what you pay for both insurance and gas and while I won't challenge your insurance rate, I suggest it would be impossible to commute 20 out of 30 days on only $20.00. That would be remarkable! You have also neglected to include additional public transit costs for incidental trips, parking and vehicle maintenance. I know that in my circumstance insurance is $1,100.00 per year and $30.00 a week in gas. Bi-annual oil-change/tune-up/maintenance on the car runs a minimum $1,000 per year (factoring in that some components will require replacement or repair on a 13 year old car). Parking at work and various other standard trips runs another $300.00 per year or more. So, barring any unforeseen mechanical issues or tickets I can expect to have a minimumal yearly expense of about 3 grand. On the other hand, I own a $550.00 cruiser, a $600.00 chopper, a $700.00 trike (for shopping) and a brand new (picking it up today) Firebike cruiser ($1,200.00) that add up to the same value as operating a car for one year (approx). I commute every day from March through to December and use public transit for only about 2.5 months of the year ($200.00). So, if I can curb my impulse to buy more bikes, I save thousands every year by cycling and using public transit. I've never seen anyone ever be able to realistically show a vehicle costing less to operate than cycling/transit.

well
i work about 3 miles from my house and only use my car for t he travel to work and back and i only put about $20 (10 gallons) of gas in my car. if my car gets 20mpg and i drive only 180 m iles a month you can see why i only use $240 year in gas. yes my insurance is 600 year since i dont have collision and my car is a 1988 cutlass cierra. so that is $840/yr. my maintenance and repair and inspection costs were $600 for the past year so that's a total of $1440 in cost for my car. a bus every day 7 days a week costs me $1500 for the year if i used it to get to work and to do errands.
acorn

An economic incentive is just an extra. The real incentive is your health.

Provided you don't get any tickets or have to pay for parking, the costs would be, as you point out, similar to transit. But driving and transit just aren't as healthy or fun as bicycling and once you have paid off the bike (equating it to the cost of transit or a car) you are MAKING money. Our transit pass here is $98.00 a month so I figure I need to ride for about 13 months to pay-off my newest bike: after that, I am saving that hundred bucks a month. For my other three bikes, I only had to ride 6-7 months to have them covered.

Well it's possible, as you say, to spend less on a car than you would on transit or at least for the costs to be comparable.

On the other hand, while I don't know where you live, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a monthly pass that would substantially lower your fares. For example, a years' worth of monthly bus passes for me would cost half of what I'd pay for those 7 round trips a day at the fare box. On top of that I can take as many trips a day as I like (joy!).

And has been correctly pointed out, it's not fair to include the capital costs of your bicycle when talking about operating expenses. If we're going to do that, let's talk about how much it costs to buy the car you're driving. You'll be hard pressed to find a decent and reliable used car of any kind for under $1000. Yet $1000 will buy you a lot of bicycle.

For around $50 you can take a class at the Jr. College here and with your ID card get free unlimited use of the bus.

Today there is an article in the paper that the Jr. College can't create a new media arts program unless it can put in hundreds of more parking spaces. But there is no room for more parking unless they pave over some of the most gorgeous views in the city (if not in the world) and spend millions of dollars they don't have.

I think they should count each student who arrives at school without a car as a parking space and spend money on incentives to use bikes, buses or motorcycles to get to school. Feel-good stuff won't get people on bikes since the school is at the top of a steep hill that nobody wants to ride up. But cold hard cash might. Pay students to ride bikes to school.

Anyway, this doesn't have much to do with the topic, does it. Sorry.

My bike is powered by my own sense of self satisfaction.

Alright. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say what everyone else is thinking.

I refuse to believe that driving is cheaper than a bike for a 3 mile commute.

There. I said it.

The health benefits are ancillary. Speaking strictly on hard costs, there's no way you can't save money riding a bike 3 miles every day. There's just no way.

Because of the hills and mileage, initial costs are high but I do save about $40 each month.

4 jersey (various weights for differant seasons)
1 rain gear (good set)
1 short
1 tight
1 really good pair of cycling shoes
1 really good bike (used)
====
$1600 including lights etc

$50 /mo gas when weather is bad, drive to different office/church/hauling/night outings
$30 /mo bike maintenance (tubes, replace this or that whatever)

Bike $80/mo vs. Car only: Monthly gas $120

I also believe that you are really fooling yourself about the true cost of owning and operating your car versus cycling. Why not read what Ken Kifer had to say about it? https://www.kenkifer.com/bikepages/advocacy/autocost.htm

I have a 2 mile daily commute M-F (plus an average of 2 additional miles a day) and a total 20 mile commute on Sunday (when I go to church in a neighboring town). Here's how it breaks down for me:

Car payment for a beater from a family friend = $100/month
Gas for beater = $30/month
Insurance = $200/month(!) (I'm a nearly 21 year old male)
Periodic Maintance = $14/month (oil change every 3 months and monthly car wash)
Unplanned Maintance = Who knows, last time it was a new radiator for $200
Parking at university = $13.33/month ($120/academic year)
Car Registration: $35/year

Total monthly = $360.25
Total yearly = $4322.96 (excluding unplanned maintance)

(Excluded: Driver's licence, $35 for 5 years. I'll keep that even after I make the switch to biking exclusively because I may need to borrow a car or something in the future.)

My new bike, when I get it in the next few weeks as quoted my my LBS:

Specialized HardRock Comp Disk: $600
Lock: $70
Helmet: $30
Multitool: $30
Slick tires: $40

I'm not adding maintance or tune-up costs because I'm not sure what those will be yet, but I know they'll be cheaper than the beater-car. I'm also not adding in the cost of better, more nutritious food I'll end up eating to keep my performance up (which should be minimal). It's easy to see that I will still spend much less biking than driving.

As for health benefits, my mom had her first heart attack at 44 and died from coronary problems at 53. She didn't exercise or eat right. Looking at it from a purely economical standpoint, I'm sure her many surgeries, medical equipment costs, and hospital stays cost well over $100,000. Looking at it from a purely emotional standpoint, I can not put my future family through what I had to go through and will spend whatever is needed to keep that from happening. That negates all of the above in my eyes.

Also, the OP has a flaw in his/her logic: $2 each way for the bus is expensive, but that's the non-regular user rate. I'm sure a bus pass would be less expensive, especially if paid for many months in advance.

it is true i think that a BIKE is cheaper than a car but the amount of savings would be small if someone has my situation
its around 50 for insurnace-20 gas-and 50 averaged out for repair and maintenance. so that's 120 dollars. lets say a bike costs only 10 bucks a month. to save 110 i don't think does it for most low income people. 4 months out of the year it is very cold and a car gives comfort in this kind of weather.
acorn

Geez, 4 months is all the riding months you have? Where are you? Alaska? I'm in Toronto and we've actually just had an unusually long winter (there's still snow on the ground...rare for here this time of year) with temperatures only just now climbing above 0c, but there are about 250-300,000 cyclists out. Next month that will climb to approx 900,000 and they ride through to the end of October.

new Diamondback outlook: $200
upgrading to semi-slicks: $40
upgrading to metal pedals: $25
Rack: $30
Cheap avenir brand panniers: $35
good lights: $120
helmete: $50
total: $500

And that was not even a bottom barrelpricing example right there... It could be done for at least $100 less.

Just add in for routine maintenance, and I'm sure it's still less than
$600 a year.

no you misread, 8 months of good biking weather here on long island new york.
my point is, that even though i love bike riding, after a long day's work i have no desire to ride a bike when the temps are below freezing.
i think low income people just use a bus and assume the next step is a car without thinking that maybe a bike is a better idea. according to my calculations for someone in my situation, one would save an extra $110 per month if one rode a bike instead of using a car, which is a considerable savings for a low income person.
acorn

The true costs of driving a car are around 40 cents a mile, or more. At least that's what employers usually reimburse for mileage. You all have forgotten about depreciation, interest, taxes, etc. For example, a $20,000 new car will probably lose at least $5,000 of its value in just one year. (Of course the beaters you are talking about lose less value, but cost more to maintain, and are so unreliable that you end up paying for tow trucks and cabs anyway.)

And nobody has mentioned the huge costs to government and society of maintaining a motorized nation. We all subsidize autos, whether we drive or not.

Ah, ok. That makes sense about how many months you have. Cold doesn't bother me for riding, personally, although wind and slush and ice and snow do, but only because I ride heavy cruisers with slicks.

Alot of low-income people here in Toronto, particularly downtown, use bicycles. In fact, you'll see bikes on about 1/3 of the front portches. With narrow one-way streets, parking at a premium and getting around on congested downtown streets being unattractive, at least a third have opted for bikes. We may have different circumstances than you, however, as residents have to pay for street parking. We also have a reknowned transit system and most folks never have to walk more than a block to reach a bus, streetcar or subway train and most use transit because of its reliability and frequency. I'd still rather bike simply because I can get to exactly where I want without any walking and I don't have to wait for a bus, streetcar or train.

as far as weather...that has always been an issue.

The obvious things to consider are:

warm clothes (snowsuit for winter if it's lower than 30f a good part of the year, otherwise jsut go for some carrharts and get out of them when you get there)

Rain gear (rain pants and jacket, I found rain pants to be tricky to buy, but the jackets are easy enough and work well)

for the really bad weather, consider fenders/mudflaps as well...they may be ugly, but ugly is sometimes a fair tradeoff to have a comfortable commute.

Basically it can be done...it's not as cushy as a car with heat..but it's not going to be miserable either so long as the rider is prepared.

As far as people not thinking of it, it's our car-based culture speaking right there...keep in mind the average american is taught from birth up that cars get you places, and bikes are toys....which is why we are at the point we are.

Truth is a bike is cheaper than a car for distances of 5miles or less each way in near every circumstance....as you reach 10 the gap narrows, and above 10 it's relative...some people just don't have time to ride a bike 15mi each way...and I understand that...it's just the guys who can't imagine riding a bike for a mile that make my head hurt. For me counting traffic lights (which are a plenty), it's about 15-20mins for me to do 3miles, which isn't bad at all....heck once the commuter is in shape, it's actually quite fun, but we all already know that

The other end of it is the US for the most part has an absolutely craptacular public transit system...bus is NOT a good form of public transit....light rail is nice, subway is best due to not having to interact with roads at all (best of both worlds, train is not slowed down, neither are the cars). Plus with the way bus drivers drive out here, I wouldn't put my life in their hands if I was at gunpoint....I'm half tempted to think a drunk or stoned guy would drive 10 times better than some of the bus drivers out here...

Really, it's the bad public transit in most cities plus the car mentality that is the issue, not the economics of it....but my point stands, it IS economically viable, and not too hard at all to do....45 mins out of a day for a 6mi daily of commute (i take the scenic way home...well as scenic as I can get without being in 40mph+ traffic), makes for 45mins of the 1 hour of reccomended exercise a day, etc...it's all good!


edit: oh and I forgot to mention we forgot to account for the cost of accelerated engine wear that happens when starting the car...starting your car to go a mile, shutting it off to get your video from blockbuster, then starting it back up and going home does far more wear than you would think. At that point the cost per mile is well over the $0.80 the workplace comp would pay...I forgot the exact figure but it would be over a dollar, i know that much.

You can calculate all you want, but when you choose to ride a bike over a car the financial benefit is immediately felt because you stop spending so much money for gas.

But as is pointed out on Ken Kifer's pages, the money spent on driving instead of biking can be thought of in terms of time spent working to earn the money.
Factor in that time, and the time advantage of the car is much less, if not reversed!

About bad weather: I often dread my commute in bad weather, but, strangely, once I get going in it I have as much fun as on nice days.

This applies for my commuting riding. My job would pay my commuting costs if I used public transportation. They don't pay for my cycling costs, which includes $50/yr for bike locker and about $282/yr for the use of the fitness center at work for showers, and some winter biking clothing I might not buy if I were not commuting. For me the health benefits make it worthwile.

I don't own a car and overall it is definitely cheaper using a bike and public transit here. Even if you don't have high parking and registration fees, which we have here, a car will need a an oil change periodically. Every three months was what I remembered. Other things come up for sure on an used car bought for $1000 or less. I've owned a couple of sub $3000 dollar cars. I now own and maintain three bicycles. I bought the last bicycle only three months ago, but I'm sure the combined yearly cost of maintaining all three will be less than half what it cost me to maintain one used car.

For that distance, sell the car AND the bike & just walk!
Oh, but that will mean more fun with numbers.