For me, it depends on the pitch. Up to somewhere between 8% to 10%, I can sit. Steeper I stand.

The exception being cobbled climbs. For those I always stand.

I have been accused of being a climber on club rides and even in some age group races even though I think the opposite. I'm 5'11" and 185-188 giving me a ratio of around 2.64 lbs/inch. My climbs in the Cleveland area are mostly 2 miles or less with a total gain of 300-400'. The best training hill within riding distance of my home has 407' of gain in 1.7 miles. For many here on the forum those are not climbs but rather large rollers. During the early season I will ride repeats up the hill in overgear in Z4, then later at Z4/5 at preferred cadence. Later in the season I will ride Z5+ intervals up really steep short (1/3 mile) hills that are close to 15% (Oak Hill in the CVNP). Basically the hills become very hard efforts and are not sustained climbing per say. I believe you can get better at climbing those kinds of hills I refer to, just by doing hard intervals. To climb 1,000'+ on the same gradient would take a sustained and very controlled effort that could last 30 minutes or longer, where the Ohio hills will take 8 minutes or less. I look at them as more of a sustained sprint that I meter out my effort as consistent as possible to reach the top without blowing up before getting there. I don't worry about after the climb as there is usually a recovery back down.

One thing I always try to avoid while climbing is putting extra effort into the climb when the road tips up. If I’ve been riding at 350 watts for 4 minutes then suddenly hit a rise and begin to press the effort at 450 watts there just might not be a recovery back to the 350 watts needed to still climb resulting in blowing up and having to go to salvage mode. The power meter does really help while climbing since you know how much effort you are putting into or not into the climb. I know that at X watts I can hold the effort for a long time, at X watts the sustainable effort is a 5-8 minute, at X watts the sustainable effort is 2-4 minutes, etc…

If you are holding 12 mph on a one mile hill I think you are doing fine. Of course, if you wish to do better then you have to do more of it. It you want to do really well at something, say playing the piano, the only way to to play the piano a lot. Same with the bike. Go back to that hill and ride it bottom to top several times each day over weeks.

I'm asthmatic so hills or even just maintaining a hard effort on the flat, is difficult for me. Nevertheless, I press on the hills and very slowly I get better. Enough better that it is satisfying to put in a good effort. Long ago I played a wind instrument and was taught to breath with the diaphram as do opera singers and high altitude mountaineers. For me, it is of some importance to breath deliberately and thoughtfully with the diaphram. https://my.clevelandclinic.org/disord...breathing.aspx I hope the link will be helpful.

P.S. I just remembered a video on climbing in the mountains. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRFNKhNhhJQ The main thing to notice in the video is how relaxed the rider is. No wasted energy. I try to keep that image in mind in my own climbing efforts.

Oak Hill is the only hill I have not done in the CVNP. I can get up the hills I am just slower than the rest of my B/A group. 90% of the guys I ride with are A riders. Like 19 to 21mph. I agree about long rides. I need to get a Watts meter.

I forgot one other suggestion about climbing ... and I forgot it because I forget to do it when I climb.

When climbing, especially when you're tired and you're concentrating on pushing hard on the pedals, it's easy to let your pedaling technique slip. And that can slow you down ... a lot.

Concentrate pedaling in circles, pushing down on one side and pulling up on the other. Use both your legs throughout your entire pedal stroke.

It's not easy. It takes practice. It's easy to forget, especially if you're tired. And you'll discover muscles you never used before.

But if you look down at your speedo while you're doing it, you'll see 1-2 MPH more speed for what seems to be the same effort.

PS: The best part is that you don't need to lose any weight to try it.

Another thing to remember is breathing. Years ago i read about breathplay, a way of breathing in rythym. Count your breaths against your cadence, or against markers on the road or whatever. It works.

I don't stand on very steep climbs like 20%, I'm too afraid something will break.

Biker395 knows about wind, just ask him about scorpions.

A'Jet has more power than the rest of us, so trying to do what he does is likely to result in visits to the emergency room. I'm 6'6" and 190. 2 pounds per inch would make me 156, and someone would take me to the emergency room just from looking at me!

What has really helped my climbing has been the fact that my team's weekly group ride includes "9-Mile Hill", which is about 30 minutes worth of very even grade. Climbing it has increased my determination to just keep cranking at a good pace, and, as A'Jet says, to not let myself get blown up by surging above what I can handle. We've already done some hard riding when we hit that hill, and I know where I need to hold my power to get a good time. I will follow a surge only if it stays below a certain effort; otherwise, I just let people ride off ahead.

As others have said, to get better on hills you have to ride hills. I believe offseason weight training is beneficial, but that's not universally believed. Once you're on a non-training ride though, let the length of the ride and size of the hills determine your tactic. Short ride on rollers - attack and suffer, recover, repeat. Long ride or long hills - downshift and steady.

I'm guessing that those speeds are average for the whole ride, not the climb.
I do about 3000 ft/hr for repeated long climbs.

If your body fat is above 10%, you can lose some fat. That'll make you faster on climbs. The other thing is to do more climbs.

For the guy with a 9sp ultegra triple, get a smaller granny ring- 28t or 26t- to lower your gearing. I also prefer a 39t middle ring instead of the 42t. It makes the middle ring useable on moderate grades. Make sure it's a middle ring with chain pins on the inside.

There are some body weight exercises that I do for cardio and leg strength. They help me reclaim some climbing strength I loose from breaks like the Christmas season.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vhJza-2xiI A 25 pound minimum is way high. Just try doing 20 in a row. Builds good core strength.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVnwXkMi58A Try to build up to 3 sets of 50. I do these during commercials while watching TV.


Burpees https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIQx1FiQt50 another good exercise to do while watching TV.

YEAH-I probably watch the weather channel too much.

the only meaningful thing to do is lose weight. I'm in your category. All the technique in the world won't make up for excess fat.

lol ... with regard to things breaking, I hope you mean bike parts and not people parts.

Yea, I have to say ... one thing about enduring those absurd winds on the 508 ... I don't complain quite as loudly about run-of-the-mill headwinds anymore.

Getting in better cardiovascular form helps a lot, too. In fact, climbing lots of hills ought to help both (loosing excess fat and better shape).

I'm the guy with the ultegra 9sp triple. Thanks for the idea, didn't know that was an option. I do have a 39 middle now, it's a 52,39,30. I spend most of my time in that 39 middle, love it. Would I need to deal with a new chain for a smaller combination if I changed the small ring to a 28 or 26 which would give me 28/25 or 26/25? My lbs infered that if I upped my cassette to a 27 or 28 I'd need a new longer chain. I've got a new chain right now so would rather not. The smaller inner ring sounds like a dandy idea. Will look into that.

I run a 48/38/22 triple. When I switched from a 48/38/28, I found I either needed a larger capacity rear derailleur to handle the chain on small-small, or, in my case, I got away with shortening the chain. If you do shorten the chain, please make sure your chain is long enough to shift into big-big. Bad things will happen if this is not the case and you accidentally do it on the road.

I've enjoyed reading the posts and have learned a little bit tonight, good stuff guys.

Apesrunner, what helped me in the motivational dynamic was loading up the Strava app on my lowly iPhone 3GS. I can know race my friends on our nearby hills. That alone helped me in ooomph when the top of the hill was just a tad further than I'd otherwise want to go....and try to do it faster next time. When you make a top 10 you will think you deserve a new shirt

And wind? Ugh. But I have learned to use that as an advantage as well.

I am 5'10, weigh 173 and ride the Raleigh (sig listed) on long rides and the Trek for hills and 20-30milers.

I have been doing TRX for the last 3 weeks. What a killer workout!!! I hope the core work will help my hill climbing.

I'm still researching whether to go with a 12-27 cassette or a 26t inner chainring. I talked with my lbs guy the other day and he didn't think the chainring change was good because of the potential shifting problems on the front derailleur. I'm thinking I don't want to sacrifice the closer shifting changes that the 12-25 offers(we're still talking Ultegra 9sp)and I don't go to the 30t small ring I have now unless I'm climbing longer hills so back and forth between the middle and small doesn't happen often.The 26t chainring would give me closer to 1/1 ratio,26/25 than the 30/27 I would get if I changed the cassette. I realize I could go to a cassette with a 30, 32, or 34 but don't want to mess with my rear derailleur.
I'm looking for more feedback from the many experienced riders here. I'm under no illusions that any of the possibilities will be a magic pill to keep me from having to do the work to get better, just looking for as much help as possible. We've got some long steep climbs around here.

If you really think the 30x25 isn't going to be low enough then putting on a bigger cassette won't be a big deal. I put a lot of climbing miles on the 30x 25 low until I went to the Eastern Sierra Nevada and I borrowed a cassette with a 30 tooth cog and it worked great. It's an Ultegra 10 speed triple and when I put the 30 on the rear I didn't have to adjust or change anything else.
That 30x30 gear helped get my large self up to 10,000 feet.

Big breakthrough today! I haven't changed anything on the bike yet and yesterday I got discouraged trying a short but very steep climb after a 15 mile warmup ride. I had to bail after less than 200yards and was going so slow I almost couldn't get unclipped.Both winded and legs crapping out.Today my riding buddy and "coach" said lets go up fickle hill which starts right out my door very steep for the first 2mi and if taken to the top is 2150ft in 7.5 miles. I'd never made it more than 1.25mi before but with my friend we made it 5mi and had to turn around for time. I did have to stop to catch my breath a couple of times on that beginning stretch and then had to stop higher up just to take in the view.
I think some lower gears may have kept me from having to stop. I'm encouraged by your experience big john of going to a 30 cassette on your Ultegra triple setup and not having to change anything as I've been told I'd at least need a longer chain. I think I'm still bending towards Erics suggestion of a smaller inner chainring which would be a more permanent solution than having to swap cassettes. I know that's no big deal to all of you experienced riders.